Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

[Amethyst]

Are these unfair ?

I believe so, if you are struggling financially and need to juggle in order to make payments to your loan you may need to pay it by another method. If the bank refuse to cancel your direct debit and take money from your account regardless they then charge you on both current account and loan, that is basically pushing you into a situation you are trying to avoid whilst maintaining your payments. So they get double whammy of charges.

So what banks have these terms, are they in PIL and explained when you open the loan account, how do you get out of them ?

Many of the loans are stated as 'only available to XXX bank current account holders'


So re Natwest

Repayment informationPayment by direct debit only on a monthly basis. First payment due within 6 weeks of drawdown. Payment holidays not permitted. Deferral of payments at start of loan not permitted.

and on the actual CCA

8: if required by the bank the customer will open and maintain a current account with the bank

So had a chat with a customer service rep online at natwest

You are now connected with Dan
Sharon : am looking for the terms and conditions of personal loans
Dan: Hi Sharon, what in particular do you need to find out regarding the terms and conditions?
Sharon : the terms which state you must repay the loan from a natwest current account
Sharon : ie if you are struggling with payments from the account and the direct debits taking you overdrawn and you need to pay by an alternative method, how can you do so
Dan: The only method of payments, as far as I know, is by direct debit from your account.
Sharon : yep thats what all customer service peeps say, but would like to see the terms of the loan which say this
Sharon : as far as I can see the only requirement is to hold a natwest account
Sharon : theres nothing mentioned about payment having to be from the account by direct debit
Dan: I am looking for it now, but there doesn't seem to be anything on the website, I know we cannot accept payment by debit card though.
Sharon : thank you x
Sharon : no I couldnt find the loan t&cs at all on the website

Dan: You could call our lending team on 0845 300 5017 and see if they can find you anything.
Sharon : okay will give them a try will they need accounts numbers etc ?
Dan: I think so yes
Sharon : damn
Sharon : ok do you know whether the t7cs for loan accounts are available online anywhere
Sharon : t&C's
Dan: I couldn't find any when I looked just now.
Sharon : okay thanks for trying for me appreciate your help, will try the lending team now
Dan: Thank you for chatting with us today. We really value your feedback. Please click the "Close" button at top right to answer a few questions about your experience with us today. Have a really good day!

lol. so he was helpful. nice little system tho.


Have written to Mr Hartzer too.

[Mochamoo]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

I went through the loan agreement papers and the additional terms and conditions booklet with a fine tooth comb this morning.

No where at all does it say I have to pay the loan from a Natwest account and nowhere does it say I have to pay by DD.

It does at the bottom of of one of the pages have a small bit that says:

Loan application number
CIN Number
Customer account number from which loan repayments taken
Sortcode of customer current account from which loan repayments taken.

[Amethyst]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

RBS's response.

Think it needs responding back to again but I havent as yet if anyone has any input.

Ref: 312477
From: <img id="P___568789184" webimdisplaystyle="inline" style="display: none;"> Mound, Paula (Group Customer Relations) (Paula.Mound@rbs.co.uk)
You may not know this sender.Mark as safe|Mark as junk Sent: 07 October 2009 15:25:41 To: sharon_karne@msn.com
Ref: 312477
I am once again contacting you regarding your email of 17 September 2009 addressed to Brian Hartzer. I am sorry that I have been unable to speak with you, however, I have provided my response below.
When a customer applies for a NatWest personal loan, there is a requirement to also have a service account with NatWest, from which the monthly repayments may be made. The payments are automatically taken by an internal direct debit and no mandate is completed, therefore, they do not fall under the Direct Debit Scheme for cancellation.
Another reason that we are unable to accept cancellations of payments from the service account is that the NatWest functionality of these accounts does not allow direct payments to be made to the loan account, or accept payments from a different source.
You have mentioned that some of your clients would have been able to make payments by an alternative method. I confirm that if the alternative payments are made directly to the service account rather than the loan account, the payment will still be taken in line with the terms and conditions of the account.
NatWest does not charge late payment fees on personal loans, however, if there are insufficient funds and the payment is returned unpaid a fee will be charged to the service account. In order to assist our customers NatWest has recently reduced these fees and it is hoped that this will prevent the spiral of charges you have described.
There are currently some proposals being considered regarding the loan repayment issue, however, this is still at the early stages. In the meantime, if a customer is facing financial hardship and is unable to meet with their repayments or require their loan to be rescheduled, they may be passed to our Debt Management Team who will be able to consider their proposals.
I hope that you have found the above information helpful and thank you for writing.
Yours sincerely


Paula Mound
Manager
Group Customer Relations
Royal Bank of Scotland Group
Executive Response Team | 12th Floor | 280 Bishopsgate | London | EC2M 4RB | Depot 028
Tel: 020 7672 1981
Fax 020 7672 1796

[natweststaffmember]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

That is utter balloney, I am sure on personal loans you sign a direct debit mandate. I didn't on the last one but it was a staff loan. Furthermore, you can make payments into the loan account because I do make additional payments to reduce the term of the loan.

[Mochamoo]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

That is utter balloney, I am sure on personal loans you sign a direct debit mandate. I didn't on the last one but it was a staff loan. Furthermore, you can make payments into the loan account because I do make additional payments to reduce the term of the loan.

I pay mine from new account via standing order don't even use the 2letters you told me to lol

[pinknico]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

"Another reason that we are unable to accept cancellations of payments from the service account is that the NatWest functionality of these accounts does not allow direct payments to be made to the loan account, or accept payments from a different source"

Can someone clarify this as when we missed a payment they gave us the details on how to make an online payment direct to the account with the loan number and sort code using a debit card from another bank account.

[natweststaffmember]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

"Another reason that we are unable to accept cancellations of payments from the service account is that the NatWest functionality of these accounts does not allow direct payments to be made to the loan account, or accept payments from a different source"

Can someone clarify this as when we missed a payment they gave us the details on how to make an online payment direct to the account with the loan number and sort code using a debit card from another bank account.

I use another bank to make additional payments so I use Loan Account number and sort code and I use the narrative "PR" which stands for Part repayment. Usually takes a week.
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------

I pay mine from new account via standing order don't even use the 2letters you told me to lol

lol, they must be getting better cos a few years ago they used to send the payment back.

[Mochamoo]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

"Another reason that we are unable to accept cancellations of payments from the service account is that the NatWest functionality of these accounts does not allow direct payments to be made to the loan account, or accept payments from a different source"

Can someone clarify this as when we missed a payment they gave us the details on how to make an online payment direct to the account with the loan number and sort code using a debit card from another bank account.

lol yes they are lying little buggers and the left hand cant tell you what the right hand is doing

[Amethyst]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

Lloyds are doing the same thing.

[Amethyst]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

Some more cases

Me and my husband took out a loan in June 2007 for £25k, the repayments were almost £400 a month, in July last year we were struggling to make the payments, i did contact NatWest and try to advise them of the situation. They didn't seem really helpful and would not even cancel the direct debit which came out from my NatWest bank account. I managed to cancel this online, however after so long they automatically set the direct debit back up and tried to take the monthly payments again which were just returned as unpaid payments with charges.

However, whilst the majority of my creditors accept the pro rata payments, and I have virtually no contact with them other than an annual budget review, conducted by Payplan, Lloyds TSB have proven to be an absolute nightmare. I have two loans with Lloyds TSB and those historically were paid by direct debit from my Lloyds TSB current account. Once the pro rata payments started, the payments for the two Lloyds TSB loans went into the Lloyds TSB current account, and from there Lloyds TSB transferred them to the relevant loan account. However, every month for two years Lloyds TSB charged an unpaid direct debit fee on both of the original loan payments. I spoke to them repeatedly and finally managed to get that fee stopped. The original overdraft was £2900 and I have paid in a total of £1800 (approx) in pro rata payments into the Lloyds TSB current account. The outstanding balance is around £2000. Unpaid direct debit fees account for at least £1000. Now Lloyds are reducing the overdraft limit each month by an amount greater than the pro rata payment, and as a result I am now paying excessive unauthorised overdraft fees.

Despite several attempts on my part to manage my financial affairs the actions of your bank have obstructed me.

This situation has arisen by your erroneous insistence that my loan account (number xxxxxxxx) is in some way linked to my bank account.

First of all, with regard to my Loan account you have refused to provide me with copies of documentation that were lawfully requested and which by law you are obliged to provide.

Following your default I have attempted to follow my lawful right by suspending payment on that account, until such time as you remedy the default, by lawfully removing a direct debit used to make those payments.

You have unilaterally and without my permission re-instated that direct debit. This is not an error I would expect a professional banking institution to make. Even if I was legally obliged to make payments to my loan account the source of those payments and the method by which I make them, are uniquely mine to determine.

By taking this action you have jeopardized my ability to manage my bank account. Your reckless action puts me in danger of exceeding the accounts limits, causing payments to be returned, which in turn can cause my creditors to charge me. I doubt very much that you are offering to waive any of your own charges with respect to this account if such an eventuality was to occur.

They did exactly the same thing to me last July, i called them to cancel the d/d and explained i could not afford the payments and they refused to cancel the dd. I therefore signed up to online banking, if you go on there you can cencel the dd yourself however what i found is that after about 2/3 weeks, they automatically set the dd back up without my permission, so i had to keep checking my account everyday to see if the dd had been reinstated. I ended up with charges going on my bank account because they kept trying to take the payment and there was no money in the account.

Reported the little darlings ( Nat west ) to Bacs as they refused to cancel a direct debit ! and even had the cheak to confirm they refused to cancel it in writing. bacs seeing NatWest whenever. Not sure whether to complain to fsa ? / oft ? fos ?

I also had a DD problem with Nat West where they forcibly transferred my monthly loan payment back in February from my current account to the loan account, knowing that the current account was in overdraft and that additional charges would be incurred.

[Amethyst]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

HSBC - wont cancel payment for loan nor set up a repayment of the overdraft.

[Amethyst]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

We think all these things can be used in your claims for charges as demonstrating an unfair relationship with the bank.

It may not be a specific unfair term in either the loan contract or the current account contract, but the terms of both together when interplayed give the bank a massive hold over you and thus an imbalance in rights and obligations.

It also brings up things about paying themselves over other creditors - so look on statements, if they have refused a couple payments for other things, then allowed a payment to themselves - thats a good illustration....also if you tried to cancel and they wouldnt let you or reset it up again....that kind of issue.

Its moving a little away from specific current account terms being unfair and looks more at an unfair relationship with the bank overall but I still think it is valid.

[stivis]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

also if you tried to cancel and they wouldnt let you or reset it up again....that kind of issue.

While I'm a bit late at come to this thread, some of the SO/DD are set-up on an "irrevolkable mandate"(I know an SO shouldn't be able to be)What happens is the bank are the only ones who can terminate the order,but what usually happens at the end of the term when the balance is zero is they just don't apply for more money

The linking of accounts can be challenged....Done that ......Long long time to do it though

[Amethyst]

Re: Terms which say you must pay loan from attached current account

Bump for [MENTION=46834]wesd25[/MENTION]