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HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what to do

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  • HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what to do

    BBC News - Six million people in UK have overpaid or underpaid tax

    Six million people in UK have overpaid or underpaid tax

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    David Gauke, Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury, said those who had underpaid would be given time to pay

    Nearly six million people in the UK have paid the wrong amount of tax.
    About £2bn was underpaid via the Pay as You Earn (PAYE) system in the past two years, with about 1.4 million people owing an average of £1,500 each.
    But £1.8bn has also been overpaid and some 4.3 million people will get a rebate because they have paid too much.
    Treasury minister David Gauke said that in the current financial climate, the government was not in a position to "just wave goodbye" to the money owed.
    He said the government had inherited the problem and the PAYE system - which was created in the 1940s - was struggling to cope with modern working patterns.


    A spokesman for HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) rejected suggestions that as many as 10 million people might be eligible for a rebate because there is a backlog of unresolved cases from the years before 2008-09.
    "We don't recognise the 10 million figure, just because a case is open does not mean a refund is due," he said.
    Notification letters A new computer system introduced by HMRC in 2009 has allowed more discrepancies to be identified.
    As a result millions of letters will be sent to taxpayers across the UK informing them of errors in their contributions.
    The first 45,000 are expected to arrive on Tuesday, with 30,000 informing recipients they are due a rebate of on average £418.
    The remaining 15,000 letters will tell taxpayers they have underpaid and will have their tax code altered next year to recoup the money.
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    Paul Lewis, presenter of Money Box on BBC Radio 4: "There is an appeal process"

    It is thought that some individuals may face both underpayments and overpayments, which could cancel each another out.
    Discrepancies arise when the amounts deducted in tax and National Insurance by employers using the PAYE system do not match the information held on HMRC records.
    This most often occurs when individuals change jobs, have more than one job at the same time, or because employers are using the wrong tax code.
    In some cases officials say they will consider writing off demands for additional money if taxpayers can demonstrate they provided all the information necessary to calculate their tax correctly.
    An HMRC spokesman told the BBC: "The overwhelming majority of PAYE cases - over 40 million - are right, so most people have paid the right amount of tax.
    'Boost accuracy' "But for a variety of reasons in some cases there will be a discrepancy.
    "The government accepts that the way we go about deducting tax at source needs to be much more accurate and the introduction of the NPS [computer system] paves the way for a real time system which in turn boosts accuracy."
    John Whiting, from the Chartered Institute of Taxation, told the BBC that some of the poorest, including those who received means-tested benefits, could have been hit twice, as their benefits would have been incorrectly calculated.
    "It is very difficult to go back and claim benefits you underclaimed, whereas, as demonstrated, if you owe tax it is possible for the revenue to back claim there," he said.
    Mr Gauke said the government wanted to move sensitively and cautiously but he recognised the difficult situation some people were facing was "through no fault of their own".
    He added: "At the moment we have said that those who owe more than £2,000 - those who are obviously in the most difficult position - we're reviewing exactly how we're going to do that.
    "For those who owe less than that we will be seeking to recover that over the course of the 2011-12 tax year through tax codes."
    'Heartless' George Mudie, a Labour MP and member of the Treasury Select Committee, told the BBC he believed there was a case for waiving the debt owed by those who had underpaid.
    He said he believed the HMRC had handled the situation badly and unfairly.
    He described the HMRC as a "heartless" and "arrogant" organisation and said: "If they want money, they take the money and very rarely are they prepared to consider, even when they make mistakes, not taking the money."
    Emma Boon, from campaign group the Taxpayers' Alliance, said the HMRC must take steps to help those told they have to pay more.
    "Some of them won't be finding out about it for a few weeks or maybe even a few months, so it could be towards Christmas which really isn't what you want to hear," she said.
    In June, the government ordered a review of how the PAYE system works and is encouraging the public to contribute their thoughts about how it could be improved.
    ------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
    Q&A: Income tax system and you

    HM Revenue and Customs is set to tell some six million people in the UK that they have paid the wrong amount of tax.
    Between September and Christmas, HMRC says about 4.3 million taxpayers will receive rebates after paying too much through the Pay as You Earn (PAYE) system.
    About 1.4 million will be sent letters telling them they have underpaid and need to make up the extra.
    How might someone have under or overpaid income tax?
    There are a number of reasons why people may have under or overpaid their tax. Your employer may have used the wrong tax code, you could have started a new job or you may have had an emergency tax code for a while. You may have only worked for part of the year or you had more than one job at the same time. You may not have told HMRC right away about changes to benefits you got through your work, or your circumstances changed. Perhaps you were made redundant or became self-employed and therefore your income reduced. Other income such as investments or rental income may have reduced but you didn't tell HMRC. It could also be that HMRC made a mistake with your tax.
    How does PAYE work?
    If you are an employee your employer will deduct income tax directly from your wages and pass it on to HMRC.
    The amount deducted is based on your total taxable income taking into account any tax allowances and your individual tax code as provided by HMRC.
    At the end of the financial year, HMRC compares the amount of tax it has received from each taxpayer with the amount it would expect to receive according to their tax code and income. Anyone on the wrong tax code could end up paying too much or too little.
    Why have so many discrepancies occurred?
    The PAYE system was originally devised around employers since at the time it was introduced many people tended to stay with a single firm for life. Until recently it was possible to keep an accurate record of employees but since the 1970s work patterns have been transformed with workers now often having many jobs during their lifetimes. Taxable benefits like health cover and company cars have complicated matters further.
    In response the system was overhauled and in June 2009 a new IT system was introduced focusing on the employee. Where previously, all the data for an individual could be spread across as many as 12 databases, it is now all in one place.
    An HMRC spokesman said the new system enables it to keep much more up-to-date records so initially more mistakes will be highlighted. However, in the future more people will pay the correct tax at the right time thus reducing the number of corrections.
    How will I know if I am affected?
    If you are one of the estimated six million people affected you will receive a letter from HMRC sometime between now and Christmas. The first 45,000 people will receive their letter, known as the p800, next week. The majority of these have paid more tax than they should but some 15,000 have not paid enough.
    If I have underpaid, how will I pay the extra I owe?
    In most cases, underpayments will be recovered during the the 12 months of the financial year 2011/12 through your salary. This will happen automatically, so you will not need to do anything unless you believe the information in your p800 letter is wrong. If so, you should contact HMRC.
    HMRC say that in some circumstances they will consider writing off underpayments, but only if they are provided with sufficient evidence to prove that an individual did provide all the information needed to get their tax right and could have reasonably expected their PAYE deductions to be correct.
    What if I cannot afford to repay the tax? Can I refuse to repay?
    HMRC says that if someone genuinely can not afford to repay the tax , they should contact their local tax office. However, if a tax debt is legally due it should be paid.
    If I have overpaid, how will I get the money back?
    Money that was overpaid will be returned via your wages.
    How can I find out my tax code and keep it up-to-date?
    You will find your code on your P45 form, given to you by your employer when you stop working for them, which is why you should make sure you give that form to your next employer. If you have lost your P45 and want to find out your code you should contact your local Tax Office or ask your employer.
    If you think your tax code is wrong or you think you may need to update it, you should also contact your Tax Office.
    Sometimes when you start a new job your employer will put you on an emergency tax code until HMRC has worked out what it should be. While you are on this emergency code you may be over or underpaying the right tax.


    BBC News - QA: Income tax system and you
    Last edited by leclerc; 7th September 2010, 05:35:AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    "Family means that no one gets forgotten or left behind"
    (quote from David Ogden Stiers)

  • #2
    Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

    There is one HMRC customer who won't be getting a belated demand for unpaid tax through the door - Vodafone - who have just been let off £6billion. A sum equivalent to the level of spending cuts required by the UK Government this year.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

      Originally posted by EXC View Post
      There is one HMRC customer who won't be getting a belated demand for unpaid tax through the door - Vodafone - who have just been let off £6billion. A sum equivalent to the level of spending cuts required by the UK Government this year.

      Yet another disgusting example how money can bend and even break the rules to suit

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

        Tax underpayments - warning
        (04-09-2010)

        Over the next few weeks, millions of people who pay tax through PAYE will receive calculations from HMRC telling them they have either underpaid, or overpaid, tax for the last two years.
        Any calculations produced by HMRC which result in an underpayment of tax should be treated with caution. It will be by no means certain that they will be correct or should be agreed.


        In June 2009, HMRC changed the computer system by which PAYE is operated. Because the new system was not well enough checked before launch it has spewed out millions of incorrect PAYE notices (called ‘codings’) caused mostly by faulty data already present prior to launch.
        This same system is now going to reconcile the tax position of millions of people starting this weekend. It is expected to throw up over 4 million repayments and close to 2 million underpayments (according to the BBC).
        The two years to be reconciled are 2008/09 and 2009/10. HMRC will produce a calculation (on a form P800) and will expect taxpayers to check that it is correct. There will be another piece of paper (P800 Notes) which will 'give guidance'. Such drafts that we have seen indicate that this guidance will not tell the full story and will not give taxpayers all the help that they need.
        We think this is a poor show and in breach of HMRC’s undertakings expressed in their Charter.
        The fact that they will be trying to collect debts which, if they had done their job promptly, could well have been reimbursed to people on means-tested benefits by other government departments makes the position even worse.
        There are several points to note.
        Informal calculation, not a tax demand
        These forms represent an informal calculation only, not a demand for tax. That will not be immediately obvious from either the P800 or the guidance. If the calculations are not understood they should be challenged and HMRC asked for a detailed explanation as to how things went wrong.
        Have you underpaid tax?
        There are three main things to bear in mind if your P800 shows you have underpaid tax.
        1. If you have underpaid income tax or capital gains tax for the year 2008/09, and you are satisfied that HMRC have all that time had the information they needed to calculate your tax correctly but have simply not used it until now, you should ask them to consider writing off the underpaid tax – i.e. remitting it and not collecting it from you – under the terms of ‘extra-statutory concession A19’.
        The text of A19 is set out on pages 25 and 26 of this booklet but will not be reproduced in the P800 guidance notes. Everyone who comes within the factual situation set out in the concession has the right for HMRC to consider it in their case.
        That is not to say that they will inevitably get their underpayment written off – that depends very much on whether HMRC think you should reasonably have known you were underpaying. If you disagree with HMRC’s decision on that, you can refer the matter to the Adjudicator, but you cannot appeal. However, it is important to know that the concession exists, something about which HMRC are notoriously reticent.
        2. If you have underpaid tax for either or both years, and you think it was your employer’s or pension provider’s fault for not operating the code given them by HMRC correctly or through making some other mistake, then in strict law HMRC must first call upon your employer or pension provider to make good the shortfall.
        If you think you fall into this category, and HMRC are now trying to recover the underpaid tax from you, then you should challenge them.
        3. The calculation produced by HMRC is not necessarily the full picture of your tax situation. You may be entitled to further tax reliefs or HMRC may not have matched all of their records for you. HMRC will not explain this fact very clearly.
        LITRG help
        We are not an advice agency so cannot answer individual queries, but by Tuesday of next week we expect to post a further article on this website which will set out a step-by-step guide of how people should approach the receipt of one of these tax calculations.


        http://www.litrg.org.uk/news/latest.cfm?id=806

        Hope the link is ok?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t



          Also be aware of all the scam artists jumping on the bandwagon sending out fake letters or making unsolicited phonecalls. DO NOT reveal any personal details until you have it verified it is actually the HMRC.

          For instance, it is very unlikely that the HMRC will telephone you and if they do it is unlikely to be outside of office hours. Should anyone not even know your basic details than alarm bells should ring.
          Any opinions I give are my own. Any advice I give is without liability. If you are unsure, please seek qualified legal advice.

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          Comment


          • #6
            Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

            Ooooeeeeerrrrr guess what I've had an email saying that I'm due a rebate from the Tax peeps, yeah right I thought, here's a scam, oooops clicked delete pmsl.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

              report it to HMRC Sapphire
              If you think nobody cares if you're alive, try missing a couple of payments.

              sigpic

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                Done !

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                  Thanks Sapphy, in addition to letters and phonecalls I forgot to mention emails.
                  Any opinions I give are my own. Any advice I give is without liability. If you are unsure, please seek qualified legal advice.

                  IF WE HAVE HELPED YOU PLEASE CONSIDER UPGRADING TO VIP - click here

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                    great, it may seem a pointless effort reporting instances of spam etc because nothing seems to be done but the point is if we dont report it nothing will be done
                    If you think nobody cares if you're alive, try missing a couple of payments.

                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                      Mine popped through the door ten mins ago said they owed me £19.80 came in usual brown envelope and said repayment to follow.
                      Opened next letter, white envelope with cheque inside, what a good do.
                      So it is happening folks and I hope a lot of you get yours back soon too.
                      Enaid x

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                        Warning...................
                        HMRC will not contact you on this matter via email. You will be informed by letter only, even if you fill in your returns on line.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                          I have received absolutely nothing so far
                          "Family means that no one gets forgotten or left behind"
                          (quote from David Ogden Stiers)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                            well that could be good news thus far leclerc :-)
                            If you think nobody cares if you're alive, try missing a couple of payments.

                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: HMRC letters dropping through the letterbox: are you a winner or loser and what t

                              This is just my opinion, if the shoe was on the other foot and we made a mistake by underpaying the Revenue, they would have added penalties and interest to underpayments. It is a shame that penalties cannot be charged to them for their mistake.

                              Tuttsi

                              Comment

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