Estate sign off and distribution

[crustypants]

Hi, I'm sure to most on here this would be easy to answer but id just like some clarification on a couple of things if possible. The probate on my dads estate is finally coming to a conclusion. The executrix has sent myself and my brother (we are both the residuary beneficiaries) the estate accounts to sign off. its a relatively small one, just under £50,000. Anyhow, I'm happy to sign off the accounts but my brother is still very emotive about issues with the executrix and is likely to refuse to sign off

My issue is, that even though the executrix has collected all monies and put them in an executor account, she wont distribute anything until we have signed off the accounts. that includes monies left to six charities and small amounts left to 3 grandchildren.
question 1- can she distribute to the charities and grandchildren before estate account sign off or does everything have to wait
question 2- can she distribute to me as residual beneficiary if I sign off the accounts and not my brother

Many thanks in advance

[Openlaw15]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

[MENTION=39710]des8[/MENTION] ..when you have time. Hello Crusty, sorry to hear of these problems.

I have requested that des8 who is excellent at this sort of thing, assist you when he has time. He is a very busy man helping people on here, besides having his own life away.

[crustypants]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

thank you so much

[des8]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Hi and welcome.
Deaths, wills and beneficiaries must be responsible for more family disputes than any other cause!
As I see it the executrix has three options:
1) to distribute any way without your brother's approval of the accounts
2)refer the accounts to court for examination and directions
3) make application to court for an order under Trustee Act 1925 to pay the estate into court

The potential problem with option 1 is that your brother could (not necessarily will) bring an action against the estate.
Do his reasons for not agreeing the accounts have any validity and is he likely to start contentious litigation?

Options 2) and 3) also have cost implications

[crustypants]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Hi des8, thanks for replying.
there is nothing contentious with regards to what money goes where and to who, it is basically to six charities, 3 grandchildren and the rest split between me and my brother as residual beneficiarys. the will was clear on that. no issues what so ever.
my father died in 8 years ago and probate only got passed about February. the reason it took so long was because the will was worded so badly (written by my dads then partner, the Executrix) with regards to who the Executors should be. The probate office granted it to my dads partner first, then after we remonstrated with them, they said it could be myself and my brother. finally we all received a letter stating it was to be all 3 of us or fight it out in court basically. Anyway, Caveat after Caveat, my brothers one lapsed and she applied, the probate office granted it to her and she collected all the monies from my dads accounts. so the reason my brother possibly wont sign the accounts off is because he is pissed at her getting to be executrix.
For me, I am gutted that she has got it, but I just want the whole thing sorted and finished as it is 8 long years. The people in the wrong to me are the probate office for granting it to her. we still have the letter from them stating it had to be all 3 of us or go to court. When we contacted them to complain they just said they granted it to her because they hadn't taken the other communications into account.
But I wondered if she was supposed to pay the other beneficiaries, i.e charities and grandchildren before presenting us with the final account to sign off.

[des8]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Having the beneficiaries "sign off" is only to give the executrix a little peace of mind, as it releases the executrix from further liability to the beneficiaries in the absence of fraud or failure to disclose assets
The monies payable to the charities and grandchildren will be due interest on the amounts (4% I think) until paid. That interest comes out of the residuary beneficiaries share so perhaps your brother should be told his stupidity is reducing the amount of his legacy.





I must admit i don't understand why anyone would want to be executor.
The responsibilities and potential liabilities of the position if you get it wrong can be frightening.
However, with a small estate there really shouldn't be a problem, and being pissed off is not a reason recognized by the courts for challenging an executors actions.

If she continues to refuse to distribute the assets, you could make application for a court to order the distribution.

[crustypants]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Thanks again for you're reply and help. I understand what you mean about being executor but the reason it meant so much to us was that before my dad passed away we weren't getting along to well and it was sort of my dads dying wish for us two to work together on it as a way trying to reconcile us. Unfortunately the way his partner worded it was such that if we both continued our differences then she would assume control and have the final say. Unfortunately she has used that as her way to grab control even though my brother and myself have reconciled. Funnily enough it was really over challenging her. But 8 years is too much and I just want it sorted now whereas my brother is far more emotive.

[des8]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

So your father's attempt to reconciliation has worked in one sense, but caused problems elsewhere.
I always find disputes around wills etc so disheartening, but not unusual
Well, there is no point in raking over the coals now, you are where you are.
I can only recommend your brother bites his tongue and accepts the status quo as any other course is going to cost, and make any reconciliation with your late father's partner more remote.
Not an outcome your father would have wanted.

[crustypants]

Estate final accounts sign off

Hi, me again I'm afraid,
The Executrix is badgering me and my brother to sign off the accounts for my late fathers estate. I'm keen to get it all signed off to get things moving but as it stands it looks like the executrix is still taking legal advice and therefore there will be more legal costs added to the estate, in which case the accounts she has presented me with will be wrong. Am I right in thinking that I shouldn't be signing the accounts unless they are actually FINAL and no more solicitors bills to be accounted for after the event.


Thanks in advance

[Kati]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

tagging [MENTION=39710]des8[/MENTION] xx

[des8]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

If the executrix presents you (as a main residual beneficiary) with "final" accounts for signing, and the accounts as presented balance, there is no reason why you should not sign them.
You say "it looks like" so I assume there is no certainty about her seeking further advice, and even if she is, the consultations could already have been accounted for.

If you sign off the accounts, and you then receive your legacy, the executrix could be personally liable if any further creditors of the estate make a claim.
Solicitor's costs would be so classed.
If she was wise she would have effected Executors Liability Insurance.
If having signed off the accounts, but prior to distribution being made, an omission was discovered, amended accounts could be submitted

[crustypants]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Thanks for replying, and you're help. I may have worded my post slightly wrong. In email correspondence during this past week with the executrix, she said that due to the further delays she has taken more legal advice from her solicitor and wants to sort it sooner rather than later to keep the legal costs as low as possible. Therefore one would naturally assume that she is being charged for the advice and therefore she will add it on to the bill. Surely I can't sign them if she's going to keep adding to them? They are either final or not final accounts
Thanks.

[des8]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

I would sign them.
The advice she sought may have been via a quick telephone call which solicitor is not charging for.
I think you have to take things at face value, especially there is little you can do except refuse to sign .
You appear not to have any concrete evidence that these are not the final accounts, solely an assumption there might be further costs.
There appears to be no reason to challenge the figures, and in any event they are not to your detriment.

[crustypants]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Ok, so to put it another way, if I sign them send them back and when distributing the estate myself and my brothers residual amount are down say £500 each to which she claims is due to extra solicitors costs since she issued us with the final accounts. Can she just do that?

[des8]

Re: Estate sign off and distribution

Not if they have been agreed
But to recover the shortage won't be as easy as saying she can't with hold it!