Transfer of ownership

[NewHorizons]

I recently received the Grant of Probate naming me as executor of my late father's estate. The will gifted the house to me and my sister. I am now following the procedure for transferring the ownership. When I searched the land registry for the property there is no information held. I suspect this is because the house was bought many years ago before registration was necessary. I have located the original paper deeds which are held by the solicitors who also held the will.

So, a few questions if I may:
1. Do I need to fill in a transfer of property (TR1) to put it in me and my sisters name, or do I do this as a first registration (FR1)?
2. On the same note, do I need to fill in form K15 to apply for a search of the land charges department before assuming its a first registration?
3. The Gov.uk site suggests also filling in an AP1 but I guess that depends on the answer to question 1?
4. The house is valued around £180,000 so that looks like a £30 fee on Scale 2 for registration, but it says if transferring to two beneficiary names I only pay on half the value so a £20 fee as it would be under £100k? Its not a problem, just want to send the correct fee.
5. It suggests completing the Verify Identity (ID1) but then says it is not necessary for a first registration (see 1. above). Again, not an issue to complete it, just trying to keep it as simple as possible.


One final question, I am hoping to sell the house to market ASAP, so is it worth going through all the above to register only to transfer ownership again once sold, or is it better for our own protection to get it registered/transferred to us first?
Thanks in advance, I appreciate there are lots of questions there :-)

[Sam101]

Quickest answer would be to speak with the solicitors to clarify. As long as you and your sister are in agreement, then there should be no reason for the paperwork to be completed when you sell but it will delay the sale whilst it is being registered and change of ownership, That may not be so good for your buyer.

[dslippy]

This may not be straightforward. Get it done by a solicitor.

[NewHorizons]

Thanks, I will ask the solicitor holding the will for advice and see what costs are involved in having them assist with it :-) Seems relatively straightforward if it is a first registration.

[NewHorizons]

A solicitor friend advised that the FR needs to be done to get it registered then the AS1 as its inherited from the sole owner. TR1 only if it was jointly owned with the deceased. Are there any potential penalties, other than delays, if this turns out not to be correct. I just had a quote for a solicitor to do this and they wanted £799. That seems awfully expensive for checking two relatively short forms I have already completed and paying a £30 fee.

[des8]

Just to warn you that there are significant delays with the processing of documents by Land Registry.
My insider tells me that first registrations can now take between 6 and 12 months, which if you are selling to a buyer using a mortgage can cause problems.

[NewHorizons]

Just to warn you that there are significant delays with the processing of documents by Land Registry.
My insider tells me that first registrations can now take between 6 and 12 months, which if you are selling to a buyer using a mortgage can cause problems.

Ouch, I will speak to the estate agent dealing with the property about the best way forward if selling the property. Thanks again.

[atticus]

You may do better to consult your solicitor!

[dslippy]

It is what it is - an unregistered title. Even 10 years ago there were firms of property solicitors who would not touch a first registration. A sensible buyer will probably ask you to register it first anyway. Delay will only delay any eventual sale.

[des8]

Spoke to my contact today & he tells me that Iif there is a delay which causes you problems in first registration process you can request LR expedite the matter.
This should let you jump the queue.

He also said that many delays are caused by solicitor errors e.g. mis spelling of names, not ticking the elevant boxes etc.

[NewHorizons]

Spoke to my contact today & he tells me that Iif there is a delay which causes you problems in first registration process you can request LR expedite the matter.
This should let you jump the queue.

He also said that many delays are caused by solicitor errors e.g. mis spelling of names, not ticking the elevant boxes etc.

The estate agent dealing with the property said they could expedite a registration once an offer is made on the property. Another quick look at the advice following probate would seem that the AS1(assent) form needs completing first to pass the property to beneficiaries as per the will. I believe this would also trigger the registration process if the first box (registration details) is left blank?
I think it's this ambiguity over which process to use that makes it a difficult, and ultimately involves a solicitor. Having looked at the forms and guidance, there isn't that much to do presuming you are completing the right one!
Again, thanks to you all for chipping in, even though the general advice is to consult a solicitor about this, and I can see why :-)

[dslippy]

You have been sarcastically advised that some solicitotors do not fill in all the boxes, and also advised not to fill a box in.
A common way of dealing with this for a buyer to say, 'You register it, then come back'
This particular one may not have any complications, biut even so the resources taken by first registrations are disproportionate and there is a queue at HMLR. How you negotiate the queue is another question.

[NewHorizons]

I have managed to speak direct to the Land Registry about my situation and I would need to fill in AS1 and FR1 with the appropriate fees to transfer to beneficiaries and register the property. They say there is no legal obligation to do this before selling and the buyers conveyancer can apply to expedite the process down to a few weeks if they are happy with the documentation held (deeds, probate, wills, certificates etc.). I am out of the country now for a month so can't do anything that would require countersigning and evidencing. The house may well have an offer on it by then, so we shall see how best to proceed at that time. In the meantime I can prepare the forms and documents.
Thanks again all, your input has been incredibly helpful and believe me, I really don't think this is something to be undertaken without seeking legal advice, I am just trying to keep costs down wherever possible.

[dslippy]

Do not assume that if you are out of the country you cannot sign things. You can give a solicitor a power of attorney to sign things on your behalf. We live in times of email.