Unregulated vehicle finance.

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

It is a HP agreement, there is an "option to purchase" clause which permits the hirer to buy the vehicle on the last payment, it is a standard HP clause. Unfortunately before that time it is the property of the creditor.

It does seem unfair, but i fear that the law will be on their side in this, I suspect that if you had managed to keep hold of the vehicle you could have put up a fight and may well have got a better deal through the courts, but it is one of those cases where possession is nine tenths of the law.

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Would you have any idea if they are under any obligation to offer the vehicle for sale back to me? Or if they sell it for more than was currently owed on the agreement, do they have to return any balance to me? It seems morally abhorant that I can pay £59,000 out of £70,000, and they if sell the vehicle for its true current market value of say £30,000, they keep the excess which could be £19,000 and im left with nothing!

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Would you have any idea if they are under any obligation to offer the vehicle for sale back to me? Or if they sell it for more than was currently owed on the agreement, do they have to return any balance to me? It seems morally abhorant that I can pay £59,000 out of £70,000, and they if sell the vehicle for its true current market value of say £30,000, they keep the excess which could be £19,000 and im left with nothing!

They shouldn't , any balance after the settlement of the sums due under the agreement should come back to you, just saying that it would have been far better for you if you would have been able to negotiate the sale than them.

Think of it as a credit agreement secured by the vehicle(not strictly true) but the creditor has loaned you a sum of money(48k), once this plus the interest has been realized any additional sum is yours, this is not usually an option and I suspect only has occurred here because you paid such a large deposit.

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Thanks for all this Andy, Sparkie and Clever Clogs, im beginning to build up a picture now. This is all the more frustrating because in May of this year, I e-mailed close asset 3 times asking for a 'settlement' figure so I could pay the agreement off, I received replies to the first two that simply said 'Market Value'. At that point this was approx £35,000, whilst the full balance would have been in the region of £18,000. My final request received no reply. I wrote to them again in August when the value was still £35,000, but the balance would have been £15,000. As the real 'Market Value' of the vehicle would currently still be around the £30,000+ mark, am I going to have any rights if they say 'there is no surplus, we sold it for the outstanding balance, say £14,500'? Or is this a case of its their vehicle, they can sell it for what they like? Finally Andy58, your final sentence says 'this is not usually an option....' Are you referring here to the fact that repossessed vehicles don't normally have a genuine excess value over the balance as in this case? Once again chaps, thanks for your guidence with this!

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Thanks for all this Andy, Sparkie and Clever Clogs, im beginning to build up a picture now. This is all the more frustrating because in May of this year, I e-mailed close asset 3 times asking for a 'settlement' figure so I could pay the agreement off, I received replies to the first two that simply said 'Market Value'. At that point this was approx £35,000, whilst the full balance would have been in the region of £18,000. My final request received no reply. I wrote to them again in August when the value was still £35,000, but the balance would have been £15,000. As the real 'Market Value' of the vehicle would currently still be around the £30,000+ mark, am I going to have any rights if they say 'there is no surplus, we sold it for the outstanding balance, say £14,500'? Or is this a case of its their vehicle, they can sell it for what they like? Finally Andy58, your final sentence says 'this is not usually an option....' Are you referring here to the fact that repossessed vehicles don't normally have a genuine excess value over the balance as in this case? Once again chaps, thanks for your guidence with this!

Yes indeed they don't, also I am a little mystified as to why they should think the market value of the car should have anything to do with the settlement figure for the agreement. The sum owed by you would be the balance on the agreement.

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Thats exactly what I thought. If the balance was £14,500, and the value £30,000, and I paid them £30,000, they would immediately have to return the balance of £15,500 to me anyway. The one time they actually spoke to me about it, they just said 'its our vehicle, we require the market value', and they never even gave me that figure! It thought it quite bizzare that im offering to pay the agreement up 11 months early, and they don't want to know!

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

When you made the agreement with them the contracted to turn over legal possession of the car after the payment itemized on the agreement. They cannot re negotiate this figure just because they see an avenue of making more money on the deal.

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

I have a mortgage on a property that cost me 6K, in 1976, it is ow worth 120k. According to their logic if my mortgage was still running I would have to pay 114k more than I borrowed to secure the purchase. Nonsense.

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

I have one further concern. It has been suggested to me that some (possibly of the more dodgy) companies have been known to repossess a vehicle and using my figures, sell my vehicle to a 'dealer' for £14,500, and tell me there's no money left. The dealer then sells the vehicle for something nearer the true market value, lets say £28,500 for a quick sale, making a £14,000 profit. The dealer then pays the finance company a commission, maybe even as high as 50% of the profit. Sometimes the commission is an underhand, unseen cash sweetener! I'd like to think this does't happen these days, but im beginning to wonder?

Would I have any route to take if they say they have sold my £30,000 vehicle for £15,000?

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

His is going back to my original point, they say it is worth one figure you say it is worth another, unfortunately they have possession of the vehicle, it is much harder for you to prove you statement when they have the car.

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Well once again thanks very much to everybody with regards to this thread. Its been most helpful in at least giving me an idea of where I might stand, and at least pointing me in the right direction. This only happened on Friday, so to be able to 'speak' to people over a weekend more knowledgeable than me has been a massive relief.

I think my first port of call tomorrow will be to the higher bodies in this company, showing them the efforts I have made throughout this year to try and get a settlement/balance figure to no avail! It hasn't been my fault I wasn't able to settle it up because they refused to give me a figure to pay. I'll also be telling them that I asked for the figure on Friday morning before the vehicle had even reached their 'compound' and that I had said i'd get the monies to them that day! I was promised a call back, that call came in the form of an e-mail at 19.30, finally giving me a figure, but advising the vehicle had been sold to a third party at 17.00, 8 hours after I had asked!! Quite disgraceful!! I have made every effort to settle with them, but been thwarted by them.

My second call of the day will be to make an appointmet with a local solicitor who specialises in Vehicle / Commercial Finance, if such a thing exists.

The vehicle also has in it many of my work and personal items, credit cards, cheque book, fuel cards, camera, work clothes, CDs, sat nav etc etc. They didn't even stop to ask if anything needed to be taken out!

Again, many thanks to everyone.

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Once again, many thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread. It has been most useful to be able to 'talk' to someone more knowledgeable than me about this subject.

My first call tomorrow will be to the higher bodies of this company in London. Pointing out that my inability to settle this account early, as far back as last May, has been down to the lack of a proper response by their office. Fortunately I kept copies of my e-mails and their replies, just saying 'Market Value'! Even when the vehicle was taken on Friday, I called their office at 09.06 asking for the figure, and told them I would transfer the monies immediately I knew. I called again at 09.30 to chase up and was told we'll call you back when we have it. This came in the form of an e-mail at 19.30, giving me the £14,000 figure but adding the vehicle had been sold to a third party at 17.00, 8 hours after I originally spoke to them! Quite disgraceful!!

My next call will be to a local solicitor who specialises in vehicle / commercial finance if such a person exists. I will also be putting to them that the vehicle has some work and personal items in it. Credit card, fuel card, CDs, sat nav, ipod, camera, work clothes, cleaning items, spare parts etc etc. I wonder how many of those will re-appear. When they took the vehicle of Friday, they didn't ask if there was anything in it that needed to come out!

Again, many thanks to all, its been most helpful!

[Guest]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

Good luck and keep us updated if you can

[redsinrome]

Re: Unregulated vehicle finance.

I certainly will, however, I have a horrible feeling this isn't going to end well. I feel my only hope will be if in the unlikely event that I manage to speak to someone in authority at Close Brothers quickly, they at least think will I have paid almost 90% of the total agreement, and I did make efforts to settle early. Then have a bit of sympathy for my efforts and situation, and give me say 24 hours to settle.

Fat chance I hear everybody cry! Me too.

I'll keep you informed.

Thanks again.