penalty charge notice help

[carrotsticks]

I received a penalty charge notice for a 50l (no left turn)
i was away working when it was sent so before i had time to look at the evidence the 14 days were up and the cost has increased - due to increase again soon too.
the 'evidence' shows 2 photos, 1 showing my car turning left at traffic lights and after, could have been anywhere.
in neither photo is there any signs or road markings to show it was an illegal move. i'm waiting to see the cctv footage, i don't think it will show much more than that from the camera angle.
i've been on google street view and seen it was a no left turn but surely their evidence should show this?

At the time i was turning left because i was feeling unwell, photos do not show i had just thrown up on myself, i had no idea it was an illegal turn and my satnav was telling me to turn left there (traffic was bad so took a detour...)
is this grounds for mitigating circumstances? i just wanted to pull in and clean myself up.

In another forum for a similar pcn case someone has posted this : "The PCN is invalid as it states the wrong time for payment of the discounted charge (this is for CCTV based parking PCNs) - 14 days from date of notice, when it should be 14 days from date of service of notice. Thus shortening your time for payment and rendering the ticket invalid. Key cases are Lukha at NPAS and followed by Grosskopf at PATAS."
Making me feel that there may be a chance to cancel the alleged offence in legal wording - i have tried to attach the pcn to this post.

Basically i intend to appeal even at this late a stage, coming up to 28 days this coming sunday, but i would appreciate any help in wording it or anyone's experiences if i'm wasting my time?

[carrotsticks]

Re: penalty charge notice help

Just viewed the cctv footage (finally sent a notigfication it was ready to view) and it shows nothing extra.
any markings in the road are faded but don't look like anything to show it was a no left turn.
car nearly went up the back of me as i waited for pedestrians to cross, possibly the only thing to make it seem like an illegal turn

[des8]

Re: penalty charge notice help

Hi and welcome
You seem to have done your homework, (Pepipoo the other forum?)

Just keep it simple, mention the mitigating circumstances of illness and certainly challenge the validity of the certificate, quoting the relevant cases

And good luck!

[des8]

Re: penalty charge notice help

suggest you check out the wording of the relevant act and those cases before using them.
might be better just to keep to mitigation and explain you've been away , hence latish appeals and missing 14 day discount period.

PATAS case reference is 2070445427 Pulp Faction Recycling –v- Islington

The Penalty Charge Notice (PCN) in this case was issued under the provisions of the London Local Authorities and Transport for London Act 2003.

The Appellants, who appeared before me on 29 October 2007 represented by Mr Douglas and Mr Aldridge, argued in accordance with their written submissions of 10 September 2007 that the PCN was not compliant.

I reserved my decision.

I set out below the Act's relevant provisions:

S.4 (8): "a penalty charge notice under this section must
(a) state
(iii) that the penalty charge must be paid before the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of the notice [my italics]".

The PCN in this case stated that " the penalty charge must be paid before the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date that this notice was served (the day it was delivered) [my italics]".

The Appellants submitted that in view of this discrepancy in wording the PCN was invalid.

Although I have noted the Authority's submissions on the point as set out in its Notice of Rejection the requirements of Section 4(8) of the Act are mandatory and a PCN must fully comply with them.

I am accordingly satisfied for the reason identified above that this PCN is not compliant and is therefore not valid.

The penalty charge may not therefore be enforced.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukla/2...ion/4/enacted:

(8)

A penalty charge notice under this section must—

(a)

state—

(i)

the grounds on which the council or, as the case may be, Transport for London believe that the penalty charge is payable with respect to the vehicle;

(ii)

the amount of the penalty charge which is payable;

(iii)

that the penalty charge must be paid before the end of the period of 28 days beginning with the date of the notice;

(iv)

that if the penalty charge is paid before the end of the period of 14 days beginning with the date of the notice, the amount of the penalty charge will be reduced by the specified proportion;

(v)

that, if the penalty charge is not paid before the end of the 28 day period, an increased charge may be payable;

(vi)

the amount of the increased charge;

(vii)

the address to which payment of the penalty charge must be sent; and

(viii)

that the person on whom the notice is served may be entitled to make representations under paragraph 1 of Schedule 1 to this Act; and

(b)

specify the form in which any such representations are to be made.

[carrotsticks]

Re: penalty charge notice help

Thanks Des for your input on this.
It was pepipoo i found, i tried to join a few other forums like that one which failed and i never got a reply even from their admin to suggest how to join properly so i ended up on here.
I did as much research as i could, work's manically busy and it's only tonight really that i have the first chance to put my case to them since it started - i'm sure it would have been a lot easier if i was legally trained - i'm reading your suggestion and heading towards writing this all up tonight and sending an appeal to them via their website... fingers crossed....

[des8]

Re: penalty charge notice help

good luck

[DADA]

Re: penalty charge notice help

Hi.
could someone help me please with similar PNC?
I ve posted this in a different Thread last week so not sure it got attention there as no response as yet.
....PENALTY CHARGE NOTICE (32D Failing to drive in the direction shown by the arrow)
Hi,
I hope you can help me to fight this Penalty Charge Notice, I believe this is been issued to me unfairly and many more people have been caught on the same as signs on the junction are not clear at all!

I ve included the notice with pictures and I ve attached it to this post. I have made a right turn when the road signs show a blue arrow to proceed straight but I have investigated the road signs in that junction and 'streeview' clearly shows that no ''NO RIGHT TURN SIGN''is shown on the traffic light and the blue arrow in the middle of the road is not clear and seems has been painted black over it.
Now I understand I should look at the road signs but there are also no indications that 'right turns' are forbidden in that junction before reaching that junction. If a motorist looks at the flow of the traffic and no traffic and not ubstruction have been caused I believe this is an unfair penalty! I am sure many more motorist have been victim of this unclear signage and I really hope you can help me in any ways to fight this.
I believe councils in London are desperate to get more money from motorist that can barely afford to have a car never the less to feed their banks!

I have 13 days for today to pay the discounted charge but I want to appeal to this asap.

Many thanks

Ragards

Dada

- - - Updated - - -

Hi.
could someone help me please with similar PNC?
I ve posted this Thread in a different forum (FORUM: Bailiff Help ( Enforcement) last week so not sure it got attention there as no response as yet.
....
Hi,
I hope you can help me to fight this Penalty Charge Notice, I believe this is been issued to me unfairly and many more people have been caught on the same as signs on the junction are not clear at all!

I ve included the notice with pictures and I ve attached it to this post. I have made a right turn when the road signs show a blue arrow to proceed straight but I have investigated the road signs in that junction and 'streeview' clearly shows that no ''NO RIGHT TURN SIGN''is shown on the traffic light and the blue arrow in the middle of the road is not clear and seems has been painted black over it.
Now I understand I should look at the road signs but there are also no indications that 'right turns' are forbidden in that junction before reaching that junction. If a motorist looks at the flow of the traffic and no traffic and not ubstruction have been caused I believe this is an unfair penalty! I am sure many more motorist have been victim of this unclear signage and I really hope you can help me in any ways to fight this.
I believe councils in London are desperate to get more money from motorist that can barely afford to have a car never the less to feed their banks!

I have 13 days for today to pay the discounted charge but I want to appeal to this asap.

Many thanks

Ragards

Dada

[des8]

Re: penalty charge notice help

I did actually see your original post, but didn't respond because, sorry to say,I don't think you have a snowballs chance in hell of winning an appeal.
I could only view the location on Google Earth, and that might be out of date.
However there were plainly road markings indicating ahead only (white arrows on the tarmac in both lanes pointing ahead.
There are also three signs (white arrows on blue background pointing ahead) attached to traffic lights.
The traffic lights themselves only show a green arrow pointing ahead for both lanes.

IMHO the signage showing on Google Earth is very clear, but I can't see your pictures clearly so perhaps things have changed

[DADA]

Re: penalty charge notice help

Hi,

thank you for your response but I still believe that if no right turn is allowed at that junction than 'Not right turn'signage should be in place like in any other junction.
I clearly see that the blue arrow is almost deleted by blank mark, please see this instant street view https://www.instantstreetview.com/@5....77h,-5.19p,1z sorry my pics were not clear.
Also no sign before you get to the junction advice 'no right turn is allowed'.

Thank you