Shoplifting advice please

[Chabbz]

Hello, sorry I am new to this but I will try my best to explain so as to get the appropriate advice, thanks.
I was in Tesco and was using the shop and scan service ( I am in Scotland btw) when I got to the paying area the scanner said I was selected for a bag check. After they had done this they said I hadn't scanned £8 worth of items. A manager was called who then emptied my bags and they said there was more items, coming to a total of £23 had not been scanned. I was told I was to follow them to the back office. I asked if I could pay for my shopping first to which I was told no. I was taken through the back, with my trolley, and put into a room, and the door was locked. The manager told me I was going around calculating the value of the goods I had stolen, the police had been called and I was just going to have to wait. They left the room locking the door behind them. The police turned up and charged me with shoplifting. I explained to them I am on heavy medication for a number of health problems, including mental health problems. I explained that I don't pay attention and get distracted easily. I was still charged and told I had done this twice before. I asked if I could now pay for my shopping and leave. I was marched back to the tills, paid for my shopping, and the items that I was "trying to steal" as I wanted them and then left the shop. I was in bits, but felt the best thing to do was accept what they were saying, however having slept on it, and spoken to my psychiatrist, I am now wondering if they can do what they did? Can they lock me in a room? Can the manager assume I am guilty? I thought it was innocent until Proved guilty. I also thought to be a shoplifter you needed intent? If anyone has any advice, positive or negative, I would be exemptionaly grateful, thank you in advance.

incidently, they charged me twice for some of the products I "stole"

[ostell]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

My own personal opinion was that if you haven't got to the paying stage of what you had in the basket you had not attempted to leave the store so what charge were they bringing ? Locking you in a room is also a no no.

[Chabbz]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

My own personal opinion was that if you haven't got to the paying stage of what you had in the basket you had not attempted to leave the store so what charge were they bringing ? Locking you in a room is also a no no.

It says on the bit of paper "theft by shoplifting"

[Openlaw15]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

My own personal opinion was that if you haven't got to the paying stage of what you had in the basket you had not attempted to leave the store so what charge were they bringing ? Locking you in a room is also a no no.

Theft requires both an act that is criminal and intent.

Is this a self service till because usually people on the till scan the items? You cannot argue against the criminal act itself as whether you were aware or not it is still a criminal act more likely than not. If you were not aware that you scanned the items with a view to keep them, I doubt the criminal intent element has been satisfied. This is based on England's law however so Scotland law may be a bit different.

[Chabbz]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

I suppose it is a form of self service. You get a hand held barcode scanner and just go around scanning the items you want to buy and then put them in your shopping bags. When done, you go to a till point and scan the barcode on the till, this then uploads all your shopping onto the till and then you pay for it and leave. I understand had I left the store then I would have stolen the items, and I accept that had the bag check not been requested, then yes I would have taken the items, but only because I was sure I had scanned everything as I was going around doing my shopping. I didn't go in with intent to steal anything, and I know ignorance is no defence in the eyes of the law. I just feel like such a criminal and I've never had so much as a parking ticket, and now I have a criminal record for 6 months. I suppose I just feel like I wasn't treated at all well, given that they had decided I was guilty of trying to knowingly steal things, before they listened to anything I had to say. I'm just so depressed and embarrassed

[des8]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

Did the police actually charge you?
In which case they must also issue a caution. Did they?
Did they mention submitting the details to the procurator fiscal?
Did you sign anything?

In any event, viewing the small value involved I doubt you will hear anything further from the authorities.
However you might receive a begging letter from Civil Recovery Ltd. (I think that's the outfit used by Tesco.)

[Chabbz]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

The police said they were charging me and handed me a pink bit of paper with the charge and my details written on it. They gave me the whole " you do not have to say anything" speech but I don't know what a caution is so honestly don't know if I got one or not! There was no mention of the p.f and I didn't sign anything. I'm afraid if tesco think they can recover anything civilly they can whistle for it. I wanted to know if legally I should have been held in a locked room, and if I'd actually done anything wrong as I hadn't left the shop?

[des8]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

While no statutory provision for citizen's arrest exists in Scots Law, there is a common law position that anyone committing an offence can be arrested using minimum force if necessary with consideration to what is reasonable in the relevant circumstances. The offence must be a serious one and not merely for a breach of the peace. The person exercising the power must have witnessed the offence occurring therefore they cannot act upon information from another person.

IMO detention in a locked room for a very minor alleged shoplifting incident would not be reasonable!

As you had no intention of stealing you had not committed an offence.
You made errors in using their inadequate systems.

[Chabbz]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

Thank you for your replies, I am wondering about talking to a solicitor? Or is it best all round to let it go?

[des8]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

My immediate reaction is to say "forget it", but it really depends on your personal circumstances.

However having been cautioned could have a knock on effect later.
Although generally speaking, when a conviction/caution is spent it does not have to be declared when applying for work, insurance etc.
However, there are some categories of employment and proceedings to which the Act does not apply. In these cases, even spent convictions must be disclosed. This is mainly in employment positions which require a particular level of trust

If this caution is likely to affect you, you might feel it worthwhile consulting a solicitor with a view to having it overturned as you seem not to have been guilty of an offence.

[Openlaw15]

Re: Shoplifting advice please

I suppose it is a form of self service. You get a hand held barcode scanner and just go around scanning the items you want to buy and then put them in your shopping bags. When done, you go to a till point and scan the barcode on the till, this then uploads all your shopping onto the till and then you pay for it and leave. I understand had I left the store then I would have stolen the items, and I accept that had the bag check not been requested, then yes I would have taken the items, but only because I was sure I had scanned everything as I was going around doing my shopping. I didn't go in with intent to steal anything, and I know ignorance is no defence in the eyes of the law. I just feel like such a criminal and I've never had so much as a parking ticket, and now I have a criminal record for 6 months. I suppose I just feel like I wasn't treated at all well, given that they had decided I was guilty of trying to knowingly steal things, before they listened to anything I had to say. I'm just so depressed and embarrassed

Criminal act

The Criminal act (actus reus) of theft is taking goods without paying 'with an intention to permanently deprive.' However, whether you left the store or not does not mean you have not committed the criminal act. One instance is where another person stops you from leaving the store as you would otherwise had left the store with the goods without paying had they not interrupted the offence.

Mens rea

Criminal intent (mens rea) does not need to be planned before you purchase your goods, as it can be satisfied at the last minute when you decide to commit the criminal act (actus reus). So a criminal act and intent can happen together or instantaneously.

Defence: Mistake

1) The problem with your defence of not being aware, the prosecution will argue how could you be aware you intended to pay for some goods but not aware of your intention to pay for some other goods. Why didn't you scan all those goods? 2) you said you have done this twice before? No one is judging you at all, we're just trying to help you. There is a defence of mistake, ie you made a mistake because you temporarily lost concentration. What may be a positive for you is that it very easy to be side-tracked in a busy, noisy self-service store where the responsibility/ burden on you is to follow instructions. Your partial defence when relying on mistake was that you made a mistake by not following the store's instructions, scanning some but not all items owing to a lack of concentration or focus. You could furthermore argue that there is no public interest in prosecution a person who is under the care of a psychiatrist who prior to did not have a criminal record simply owing to a mistake. If you have done this twice before (according to whom by the way?), it is going to be difficult to benefit from this defence.

If your psychiatrist makes a statement that you're not always aware, ie you lose concentration easily and this will likely affect purchasing goods in a self-service store especially, it will also be a positive for you. As the psychiatrist is the relevant expert for understanding what goes on in the person's mind, which is useful for determining whether or not there has been intent.

Listen, even celebrities take things without paying and later say to themselves, why did I do that??? Don't feel embarrassed, what's done is done.