*discontinued* Civil Enforcement Limited - County Court Claim Received

[s7eve]

Apologies, I'm terrified atm and looking for anything that cabn save me. I shall have the pictures of the car park, its entrance, signage and my positioning this evening

[charitynjw]

Apologies, I'm terrified atm and looking for anything that cabn save me. I shall have the pictures of the car park, its entrance, signage and my positioning this evening

No need to be overly worried, though a small amount of trepidation is not necessarily a bad thing.
These parking co's often bang out PCNs/Court claims 'robo-style', with little attention to the actual content of their allegations.
Imho, it's a sort of attempt at psychological intimidation.
A lot of people then think "Gawd, they must be on solid ground to try & enforce!"
Many times they are not.

[s7eve]

Image One shows the entrance to the Car Park
Image Two is signage as you head down towards the parking area
Image Three shows the parking area, there are metal barriers with an opening
Image Four is the signage regarding payment
Image Five shows the position in which my car was stopped, to the left of the barrier pulled up to the back gate

Thanks

[ostell]

So that is a prohibiting notice, there is not an offer to park and therefore no contract.

The signage in the car park is of a “forbidding” nature. It is limited to cars displaying a valid permit only and therefore the terms cannot apply to cars without a permit because the signage does not offer an invitation to park on certain terms. The terms are forbidding. This means that there was never a contractual relationship. I refer you to the following case law: PCM-UK v Bull et all B4GF26K6 [2016], UKPC v Masterson B4GF26K6[2016], Horizon Parking v Mr J C5GF17X2 [2016] – In all three of these cases the signage was found to be forbidding and thus only a trespass had occurred and would be a matter for the landowner.

[s7eve]

Thats great however that type of signage appears on the road section leading up to the main area where it appears for the pay by phone. No other permit holder notices are in this section after the metal barriers which I can only presume is car park area and the signage for that area is depicted in image 4, aeems there are two seperate areas, a permit holder area and then the car park?

[ostell]

So similar reasoning. There is no offer of a contract to park for non permit holders

[charitynjw]

Yep.
If you're not supposed to be in there, you're trespassing.
& I'll bet they don't have the authority to 'do' you for trespass.
Their threat of a large payment for transgressing is, imho, tantamount to a penalty payment, not a breach of an alleged contract.

[s7eve]

Thanks for the advice both, so the signage attached here is not a contract it's a prohibition? This makes no reference to permiit holders?

[charitynjw]

Any idea what the sign to the R/H/S of that pic states? (The one that has been cut off in the photo.)

[s7eve]

Just a sign relating to a crumbling wall

[charitynjw]

We've discussed about parking as compared to loading, along with a court transcription to give the argument more weight.

We've also pointed out the (in our opinion) non-compliant signage.....but it's a judge's opinion that ultimately counts.
It's also a good idea to research the parking co's Code of Practice re signs, plus research the ParkingEye/Beavis Supreme Court decision....that gives a good idea what a judge should be looking for.
http://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKSC/2015/67.html
(From para #90)

There is also something else.
The NtK has to identify the location.
Seems to me that there is more than 1 car parking area in the vicinity of that postcode. (Google Maps)

[s7eve]

There is also a car parking area a little further down the road so same road and I presume same postcode which is 8am to 6pm 1 hour only etc... free after 6. It doesn't have a name as such whereas this one is called the Market Street Car Park but yes both could be classed as this. The firat document sent has some excellent bits in. I've begun writing up a defence and will post what I have so far shortly.

[charitynjw]

Ok......treat it as a work in progress.

[s7eve]

Of course... whats rhe general process in these cases, is submitting my written defence next and then...

again massive thanks for the help and advice so far

[charitynjw]

If the court claim issue date is 21st June, you have until *24th July (latest) to file a defence; loads of time.
(28 days + 5 allowed for service of claim form.)
If it were me I would want to be ̶a̶ ̶p̶a̶i̶n̶ ̶i̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶@̶r̶s̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶m̶ fully prepared for my defence, so I'd send a CPR 31.14 request for disclosure.
https://legalbeagles.info/library/gu...-of-documents/
The above example is for a Consumer Credit case, but the format is the same.
Substitute the bits in green for

• A true copy of the landowner/[parking company] contract of authority to enforce parking charges at the relevant site, plus any/all relevant intermediate contracts.
• A copy of the KADOE contract between [the parking co] & DVLA.
• All other documents etc that [the parking co] seeks to rely on in court re their claim, including (but not limited to) a true copy of the postal notice to registered keeper.
• A plan of the parking site showing positions of all the parking signs.
• Copies of the alleged signs displayed on site.

Scrub the bits in red & any other refs to the CCA.

Keep a copy & get proof of postage. The PO will give a free certificate of postage on request.
They don't appear to have engaged legal representation, so send to the Claimant at the address per the court claim form.

*Check this....maths is not my forte.