Britannia Parking / BWLegal - PCN Advice

[RSG1997]

I found the template thank you. I have sent a SAR to Britannia and will await the PCN and update you as soon as i hear back with all the data they have.

I am okay sending the above apart from the requests for a SAR to BW Legal ?

Even though i have not yet received a Letter of Claim would you say i still would need to send a reply for PRE-ACTION PROTOCOL FOR DEBT CLAIMS to BW Legal ?

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...s/debt-pap.pdf

I think i am slowly getting my head around the words and jargon a bit better sorry if it seems i am slow understanding this.

[charitynjw]

SAR example

[charitynjw]

I found the template thank you. I have sent a SAR to Britannia and will await the PCN and update you as soon as i hear back with all the data they have.

I am okay sending the above apart from the requests for a SAR to BW Legal ?
I'd send to both & cross-refer.

Even though i have not yet received a Letter of Claim would you say i still would need to send a reply for PRE-ACTION PROTOCOL FOR DEBT CLAIMS to BW Legal ?

Yes. respond.
Tick box D (Defend for now)
Tick box I for document request & list docs.
Don't bother with the I&E
Keep copy & get proof of posting/sending.

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...s/debt-pap.pdf

I think i am slowly getting my head around the words and jargon a bit better sorry if it seems i am slow understanding this.

See above (bold)

[ostell]

No point in sending a SAR to BWL, they should only have documents supplied by Brittania. You could write to BWL and suggest that they delay any action as you have not as yet heard back from Britannia from your SAR request.

[RSG1997]

Thank you both, i will await the response after i have actioned the above and let you know their response. Will most likely still get a letter of claim but what is the likelihood of this even reaching court considering the charges for it, surely they wont take me there unless they could win.

Is it not too late for me to contact the landowner (Frankies & Bennies) to explain my situation as the Keeper to try to appeal to have this removed as the driver was there for their member of staff however overstayed due to assisting the business.

I spoke to the business and they are saying the car park is ran by Britannia and is not owned by them and since i do not have a receipt of purchase for anything i have no proof that i was there. I could try there head office to find the landowner and explain my case however i have been told all it is is an ANPR system with no CCTV so the only from of evidence is the back of my number plate entering and leaving between the times.

[charitynjw]

Thank you both, i will await the response after i have actioned the above and let you know their response. Will most likely still get a letter of claim but what is the likelihood of this even reaching court considering the charges for it, surely they wont take me there unless they could win.

It costs £25 to issue a claim of this size via MCOL.
For every 10 court claims they file, even if only 50% of Defendants pay up.....well, do the math!

Is it not too late for me to contact the landowner (Frankies & Bennies) to explain my situation as the Keeper to try to appeal to have this removed as the driver was there for their member of staff however overstayed due to assisting the business.

Not too late if they can intervene.

I spoke to the business and they are saying the car park is ran by Britannia and is not owned by them and since i do not have a receipt of purchase for anything i have no proof that i was there. I could try there head office to find the landowner and explain my case however i have been told all it is is an ANPR system with no CCTV so the only from of evidence is the back of my number plate entering and leaving between the times


.

The SAR should get you the info you need to fight this.

[RSG1997]

Hi Guys !

Final got a response from BW Legal,

"Good Morning


Thank you for your email, the contents of which have been noted on file.


1. Our Client's cause of action is that you breached the terms and conditions of the contract which you entered into by parking your vehicle in the car park for longer than the maximum time permitted.


2. Our Client is pursuing you as the registered keeper of the vehicle.


3. Our Client does intend to rely on Schedule 4 of Protection of Freedoms Act 2012.


4. The details of the claim are that your vehicle parked for longer than the maximum time permitted.
The £100.00 charge is regarded as a charge for contravening the Terms and Conditions. The sum payable following the issue of the PCN occurs on the happening of a specific event (i.e. a material breach of the Terms and Conditions) and is therefore a core term of Our Client's contract with you.

It is irrelevant whether or not the charge as displayed bears any relation to the cost for parking (even where there is no cost involved). Our Client relies on the leading authority of ParkingEye Limited v Beavis [2015] UKSC 67, where the Supreme Court held that PCN charges, like this charge, serve a legitimate commercial interest. The relevant car parking Codes of Practice, also give guidance that £100.00 is a reasonable sum to charge.

The signage in situ makes provision for Our Client to recover any additional costs (Contractual Costs) incurred by them in relation to the PCN. The Contractual Costs referred to above formed part of the Terms and Conditions (of the parking contract) which were accepted by you in the course of staying at the car park. Save for the fact that the sum of £60.00 attributable towards these costs are entirely reasonable for nature and type of work involved in recovering the parking charge, such costs are recoverable under the relevant parking code of practice.


5. The Parking Charge Notice (PCN) which you have been issued with is for a breach of contract. The only right which you have to enter the land in question are on the terms and conditions which apply. It is unnecessary to apply an analysis of offer, acceptance and consideration quite simply because the contract was formed on mutual promises. By parking your vehicle in the car park you have entered into a unilateral contract with Our Client. Acceptance does not have to be communicated, the act of parking your vehicle is acceptance.

6. Our Client is under no obligation to supply this. ( 6. A picture and a map showing where any signs were displayed )

7. As established members of the British Parking Association, Our Client adheres to their Code of Practice for Private Enforcement on Private Land and Unregulated Car Parks ('Code of Practice'). This Code of Practice gives recommendations in regards to the signage within the Car Park. The signs within the car park comply with the recommendations in the Code of Practice and are therefore deemed reasonable.


8. £100.00 remains unpaid for the Parking Charge Notice. Additionally, you are also liable for our £60.00 instructions fee as your file has been passed to us. Please find attached copies of the correspondence our client sent to you.


9. Please be aware that the contract between Our Client and the landowner is a legally privileged document which you have no right to inspect. However, should this matter progress to court, the contract will be adduced as evidence.


10. Please find attached photographic evidence of the vehicle.


We trust this now concludes any outstanding queries you had raised with ourselves. It is important that you now contact us in order to discuss an affordable payment arrangement. "

I am still waiting for Britannia to provide me with their SAR.

Please see attached PCN's i was "sent".

Would love to hear your guys stance ! and how to press on with fighting this.

Thank you

[RSG1997]

blank

[charitynjw]

Haha.....load of tosh!

Could you post up a pic (suitably redacted) of your email to them (or type *verbatim)?

*I don't mean write the word 'verbatim'

[charitynjw]

By the way, have a check on the NtK........whereabouts do they say this contravention took place? (location)

[ostell]

Get your point, I couldn't see anything so they have failed to 9 (2) (a) by not specifying the land nor the period of parking. They have also failed to give the invitation required by 9 (2) (e). No creditor identified contrary to 9 ((2) (h). Several POFA fails and therefore no keeper liability.

So letters to both Britannia stating that they have failed POFA and therefore the keeper can not have any liability and continuing with the claim is vexatious.

[RSG1997]

"Dear BW Legal,
This email is in response to the letter i have received dated 5th March 2019, in regards to a "Balance Due" for a Parking Charge Notice made up of a £100 PCN Charge and your Clients apparent initial legal costs of £60.00.

I am disputing any charges you demand me to pay to Britannia Parking Limited and will defend myself as the Keeper of the vehicle as i find the predatory nature you ensue as unjust.

In your letter, you detail Britannia Parking Limited claiming to have sent a PCN for parking longer than the maximum time permitted on 8th January 2019. I am stating that i have not received any previous contact before in regards to the PCN and this is something that i am unaware of, your dealings are the first i have come across to know about the charge. If i had received the correspondence from Britannia Parking Limited in the first instance I would have replied explaining why your client’s request for payment is without merit.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. I require ALL photos taken and an explanation of the allegation and your evidence, i.e.:


1. An explanation of the cause of action
2. Whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper
3. Whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012
4. What the details of the claim are; where it is claimed the vehicle was parked, for how long, how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated
5. Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.
6. A picture and a map showing where any signs were displayed
7. Details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
8. Provide details of the original charge, a copy of previous letters sent and dated, and detail any interest and administrative or other charges added
9. A copy of the agreement between the landowner/authorised agent & Britannia.

10. Any pictures of the parked vehicle


Should you later pursue this charge by way of litigation, note that service of any legal documents by email is expressly disallowed and you are not entitled to assume that the data in this dispute/appeal remains the current address for service in the future.

Until your client has complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for your client to issue proceedings. Should your client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided."

[RSG1997]

The location of the contravention was on all documents as Frankies and Bennies I whited this out along with the reg , but today i went past and the post signs outside even say 20 mins stay ! Cant expect people to stay for only 20 minutes.;D it s a joke

[charitynjw]

My apologies.

I forgot to add this.(Actually I had to urgently go & change clothes after reading their reply to you!)


(PoFA 2012 Sch 4)


Right to claim unpaid parking charges from keeper of vehicle

4(1)The creditor has the right to recover any unpaid parking charges from the keeper of the vehicle.

(5)The maximum sum which may be recovered from the keeper by virtue of the right conferred by this paragraph is the amount specified in the notice to keeper under paragraph 8(2)(c) or (d) or, as the case may be, 9(2)(d) (less any payments towards the unpaid parking charges which are received after the time so specified).

(6)Nothing in this paragraph affects any other remedy the creditor may have against the keeper of the vehicle or any other person in respect of any unpaid parking charges (but this is not to be read as permitting double recovery).

[RSG1997]

Section 9 2 E, is covered in one of the PCN's that was sent is it not it ? How would i proceed then to settle this if it is just the case of Section 9 2 H making the claim void ? As the PCN also states how to make a payment ?

Edit: Ignore the above i missread the wording as they said if they do not rather they stating they do not know which i am guessing is the loop hole ;D