Gladstones CPM County Court Business Centre - Company

[PAE123456]

Hi there,

I've read a few threads but can't seem to find a case that matches mine (forgive me if I'm wrong), so was hoping on some advice on which direction to follow.

The company I work for has received PCNs for two instances where a leased company car was parked in a private car park operated operated by CPM. This car park was not regulated for a long time and is simply about 6 spaces in front of an offer block just off a main road.
To cut a long story short the PCNs and warning letters have been ignored for the last 10 months, but now we have received a County Court Business Centre claim letter (issue date 10th Dec 2018). I don't have any of the subsequent letters but the CCBC letter not only has the company name wrong, but also the address wrong.

The POC states:

The driver of vehicle registration XXXXXXXX (the 'vehicle) incurred the parking charge(s) on 05/02/2018 & 20/02/2018 for breaching the terms of parking on the land at 313 Ballards Lane - 313 Ballards Lane, North Finchley, London, N12 8LY.
The defendant was driving the vehicle and/or is the keeper of the vehicle.
AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS
£320 for Parking Charges/ Damages and indemnity costs if applicable, together with interest of £18.85 pursuant to s69 of the County Courts Act 1984 at 8% pa, continuing to Judgement at £0.07 per day.

Also, when setting up a claim on moneyclaim.gov, and through the Government Portal, should i do this in my personal name or the company's?

Thank you for your help.

[ostell]

If the address was wrong then how did you get the PCNs? If the name is seriously wrong then they are claiming from the wrong people. How is it wrong (without identifying)? It has not been advised to ignore since 2012.

Acknowledge the claim using the details and password on the form. Do not put anything at all in the defence. This will give 33 days from date of issue to get a defence to the court.

These are definitely leased cars, with the name on the V5 being the leasing company? One thing to note is that a body corporate cannot drive and therefore there can be no claim against the driver so the particulars of claim is nonsense, ie complete lack of diligence by Gladstones and a template PoC.

With those original PCNs was there on each occasion a copy of the hire agreement and the original PCN to the hire company? Probably not but please check.

If you had posted when the PCNs were originally received then I would have suggested a response of

Sirs

Ref PCN xxxxx VRM yyyyyy

We are the hirer/keeper of the above vehicle and am in receipt of the PCN you issued. We have no liability on this matter as you have failed to meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to supply the additional documents mandated by section 14 (2) (a) of the Act. You cannot therefore transfer liability from the driver at the time to us, the hirer keeper..

As a body corporate we could not have been the driver and as there is no legal requirement to identify the driver at the time and we will not be doing so.

Any further communication with us on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and our details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

And this will therefore be the main point of the company's defence.

Here is a link to POFA Take a look, particularly at sections 9, 13 &14. 14 applies to your company, the hirer.

Take note that the keeper cannot be liable for more than the original PCN, POFA 4 (5), probably £100 so you contest the additional charges that have been made.

[PAE123456]

If the address was wrong then how did you get the PCNs? If the name is seriously wrong then they are claiming from the wrong people. How is it wrong (without identifying)? It has not been advised to ignore since 2012.

Acknowledge the claim using the details and password on the form. Do not put anything at all in the defence. This will give 33 days from date of issue to get a defence to the court.

These are definitely leased cars, with the name on the V5 being the leasing company? One thing to note is that a body corporate cannot drive and therefore there can be no claim against the driver so the particulars of claim is nonsense, ie complete lack of diligence by Gladstones and a template PoC.

With those original PCNs was there on each occasion a copy of the hire agreement and the original PCN to the hire company? Probably not but please check.

If you had posted when the PCNs were originally received then I would have suggested a response of

Sirs

Ref PCN xxxxx VRM yyyyyy

We are the hirer/keeper of the above vehicle and am in receipt of the PCN you issued. We have no liability on this matter as you have failed to meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to supply the additional documents mandated by section 14 (2) (a) of the Act. You cannot therefore transfer liability from the driver at the time to us, the hirer keeper..

As a body corporate we could not have been the driver and as there is no legal requirement to identify the driver at the time and we will not be doing so.

Any further communication with us on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and our details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

And this will therefore be the main point of the company's defence.

Here is a link to POFA Take a look, particularly at sections 9, 13 &14. 14 applies to your company, the hirer.

Take note that the keeper cannot be liable for more than the original PCN, POFA 4 (5), probably £100 so you contest the additional charges that have been made.

Thanks for your reply.

The PCN's still managed to find us even with the wrong first line of address. The road our business is situated on has post mis-delivered all the time though so is definitely feasible the same could have happened here.

The car is definitely leased yes, and we have not been given the V5 document which resides with the hiring company. I can double check it is in their name but I imagine so.

We didn't receive any notification from the hire company that CPM had contacted them (i would have thought we'd have received an admin charge for this), and none of the PCNs received had copies of the hire agreement or any other information.

I will acknowledge the claim as soon as i have the company's government gateway login information (2 days time).

So, worst comes to worst you're saying that as it's addressed to a company, not a driver, the most we could end up being liable for is ~£100?

[ostell]

If those documents are not enclosed with the PCN then the keeper, the company, cannot be held liable for the actions of the driver.

However the parking company could say that the company was liable for the actions of its employees but if the parking was out of hours then that can be refuted.

So acknowledge the claim and start looking for other defences on here and http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?&showforum=60. Post on here for critique before submitting.

If the court decide the keeper is liable then the keeper is only liable for the amount on the NTK (x2 if there were 2 NTKs) + £50 max for solicitor's fees + court fee of about £25.