BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

[Lucy12Dec2017]

We were caught up in the BA IT failure in May. BA have (eventually) refunded our flights/car hire and compensated us in accordance with EU261 regulation. The holiday villa and airport car parking was booked with a Natwest Credit Card and covered by this insurance (we thought) and BA advised us to claim against Natwest for the loss of the villa and parking. After months of sending Natwest multiple documents in various formats normally with a 2-4 week delay between requests they finally declined the claim as they said we had received compensation from BA thus we were not entitled to the Natwest cover. Reading the small print this is the case and due to the poor service from Natwest they have offered us a small token gesture as compensation (they could have pointed this out in May when we made the claim). Questions I have, as the BA compensation was for the flight cancellation are Natwest correct to offset this v the holiday cost? Can we claim from BA for the Villa etc?

[R0b]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Hi Lucy,

As far as I am aware, Regulation 261 only provides compensation for the flight being delayed or cancelled and it does not extend to covering any other losses but if you booked it all part of a package then you might have some rights under the (I believe) the Package Travel Regulation but that would be the tour operator not BA direct, unless of course it was booked through BA. Though from your post it doesn't seem like you've booked this as a whole package but if you can clarify that would be helpful.

If you booked the villa and parking separately then you would be looking at a claim for breach of contract, an entirely separate action to the flight compensation which is automatic. The problem I see is that there doesn't seem to be a link between BA and purchasing the villa using your Natwest card. Otherwise, it will be a breach of contract claim solely against BA for the cost of the holiday villa and airport parking as this is a loss directly flowing from the cancelled flights.

I haven't checked the T&Cs for BA but there will probably be a limitation of their liability in respect of any breach of contract claims.

[des8]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Can you post a link to Natwest Credit card Travel insurance that you claimed under.
I'm intrigued by this scenario you post of a claim being completely declined because of partial compensation by a third party.
Generally I would expect a contribution clause only

[Lucy12Dec2017]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Re questions above - the Villa was booked separately from the BA flights, BA refunded all which we bought through them and the automatic compensation (after claiming it)

Natwest Insurance details below

https://supportcentre.natwest.com/Se...nce-policy.htm

The travel insurance is through the black rewards account - I assume its section 8 on page 56 they are using to not pay out

[Lucy12Dec2017]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

and from the actual letter we received

I’ve reviewed the decision made in relation to declining your claim. I understand you were looking to have
the costs for your villa and car parking covered. In your policy booklet, under the abandoned international
departure section on pages 22-43 it confirms:
“Special conditions
• You must seek recompense from the operator where you should be entitled to compensation (e.g. due to
EU Passenger Rights);
What is not covered
We will not cover:
• any expenses that you can recover from elsewhere, such as compensation, assistance or refund that
should be provided by your operator or travel agent. If you should be entitled to such compensation we will
not pay any claim unless you provide evidence from them showing why such compensation was not given
to you;”

[Lucy12Dec2017]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Re questions above - the Villa was booked separately from the BA flights, BA refunded all which we bought through them and the automatic compensation (after claiming it)

- - - Updated - - -

Natwest Insurance details below

https://supportcentre.natwest.com/Se...nce-policy.htm

The travel insurance is through the black rewards account - I assume its section 8 on page 56 they are using to not pay out

and from the actual letter we received - although its not clear where that clause is, must be a separate policy handbook other than what is online

I’ve reviewed the decision made in relation to declining your claim. I understand you were looking to have
the costs for your villa and car parking covered. In your policy booklet, under the abandoned international
departure section on pages 22-43 it confirms:
“Special conditions
• You must seek recompense from the operator where you should be entitled to compensation (e.g. due to
EU Passenger Rights);
What is not covered
We will not cover:
• any expenses that you can recover from elsewhere, such as compensation, assistance or refund that
should be provided by your operator or travel agent. If you should be entitled to such compensation we will
not pay any claim unless you provide evidence from them showing why such compensation was not given
to you;”

[R0b]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Well I think the section they are referring to under the terms of the insurance is pages 23-24 which is what they've quoted in their response to you.

any expenses that you can recover from elsewhere, such as compensation, assistance or refund that should be provided by your operator or travel agent. If you should be entitled to such compensation we will not pay any claim unless you provide evidence from them showing why such compensation was not given to you

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding this exclusion point because on the one hand it says your not going to be covered for any recompense which ought to be provided by BA yet on the second sentence it goes onto to say that they won't pay a claim unless you provide evidence from BA that they refuse to compensate you. It seems to me that this is suggesting that if you are refused compensation, Natwest will pay out if you give evidence as to why BA is refusing to pay out - appears a bit ambiguous there!

Anyway, aside from the above, I can't see anything else in there that suggests you can make a claim under this insurance. The terms do seem to say that they will provide your reasonable travel costs of getting to your destination (on page 22), I am assuming you never went on your trip and if so, is there any reason why you didn't rely on this this point to get you to the destination on another airline?

Overall, I think your claim starts and begins with BA, not Natwest. If BA deny liability, you could refer back to Natwest based on the above, or the last resort may be court action. I couldn't see anything in BA's conditions of carriage which prevented you from recovering any direct losses as a result of the flight being cancelled.

[des8]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Posted extract here as it is easier (IMO) to read:
Page 22 - 23.

3 Abandoned International Departure (outbound only)
We will cover you for your:
• unused deposits;
• accommodation and travel costs (including car hire, excursions and activities); and
• unused kennel, cattery, professional pet sitter or car parking charges
that you have paid or legally have to pay if you choose to abandon your trip becauseyour pre-booked aircraft, ship or train is delayed beyond the time shown on your travelitinerary at the point of international departure from the UK by more than:
• six hours if your trip is scheduled to last four nights or less; or
• 12 hours if your trip is scheduled to last five nights or more
Alternatively, you may choose to continue to your intended destination by alternativemeans, in which case we will cover you for the lower of the costs so incurred or theamount it would have cost to abandon your trip.
........
The most we will pay for each insured person is:
• £1,000 for Missed International Departure.
• £250 for Delayed International Departure.
• £10,000 for Abandoned International Departure

NatWest does not cover what is obtainable from BA. (their "special conditions" )
The amounts obtainable from BA under regulation 261 are quite limited, and presumably do not cover your losses and do not exceed the amounts due under Natwest insurance
so IMO you do have a possible valid claim under the Natwest policy for losses in excess of the compensation paid by BA.
This seems to be confirmed by implication by General Condition 8 * Other InsurancesIf you have other insurance that covers the same loss, damage or liability, we will notpay more than our share of your claim."

[R0b]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

I'm inclined (at this stage) to disagree with Des. The special conditions specifically state that they won't cover expenses which can be recovered from the operator. As a result of the cancellation there is a direct loss flowing from the breach which is the accommodation and parking costs - that to my mind is an expense that can be recovered from BA.

That paragraph you referenced suggests hotel accommodation and travel costs will be covered, but does this wording simply mean any costs where the operator has failed to pay for your accommodation or you wish to book nicer accommodation than a holiday inn equivalent?!

I have to admit, the wording of the policy is not very clear at all and there's probably an argument to be had that the wording is ambiguous and in that case should be construed in favour of the consumer. It seems to me that you have to seek compensation against the operator where you have a valid claim, if not you revert to Natwest.

Given the fact we differ on opinion, it's mustn't be clear!

[des8]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

OK, that's fine by me R0b.. I don't object to discussions as that way we sort out possible flaws in arguments for OP.

Isn't the compensation due from BA limited to that payable under regulation 261, or is it possible to bring a claim through the courts for losses in excess of that payable under the regulations?
My understanding is that the airline is not liable for any additional accommodation costs such as villas for your holiday, but this should be covered by Natwest Insurance.

[Lucy12Dec2017]

Re: BA Compensation and Natwest Insurance

Thank you both for your thoughts. It wasn't clear to me, ironically if I had booked the accommodation/parking through BA I would have been refunded plus the compensation for the inconvenience. I will review the communication from BA and contact them regarding loss of cover. I will also complain to the ombudsman regarding the ambiguity in the insurance cover and "stalling" tactics employed by Natwest.