Used car rejection

[Miker604]

Hello,

I'm after a bit of advice as citizens advice method is going to cost me money.

I bought a car last Friday, all great.

On Monday I did my own 'hpi' report and discovered the vehicle was a cat d write off. I contacted the trader and he denied it and told me experian say it is not a write off. I contacted experian and they have investigated the matter and confirmed the car is a cat d write off.

I am now trying to return the vehicle to the trader as it wasn't as described. He has now said he was selling the vehicle on behalf of someone, it was a private sale, and I can't get my money back off him as it's not his money to give back, it's his friends. He advertised the vehicle on his trade autotrader account and his website.

Now I realise I have 30 days to reject the vehicle. He's having non of it, so what happens if this ends up going over the 30day limit?

Citizens advice say to send him a letter and wait 14days for a reply. If nothing from the trader then to raise a Adr, then if nothing again then small claims court.

I have read in small claims court you cannot claim the solicitor fees back from the person that loses the case so this will cost me a bomb.

Is there anything I can do to enforce that he takes the vehicle back as I'm rejecting it?

Sorry if this is a ramble but I'm so stressed out, I've spent all my savings on this car and have been done over.

Thanks
Mike

[CLL1]

Re: Used car rejection

Was it described as a new car? Being a cat d write off isn't necessarily a breach of contract, even if you weren't told.

[Miker604]

Re: Used car rejection

The advert stated it was hpi clear. Which it was according to experian. I have contacted experian and they have said I can't claim for compensation but the trader can as he performed the check. Regardless, the car isn't what I've been told so therefore have the right to reject it? Or am I wrong in thinking this?

[Kati]

Re: Used car rejection

[MENTION=71570]R0b[/MENTION] [MENTION=39710]des8[/MENTION] ... any ideas??

[des8]

Re: Used car rejection

Hi
It doesn't matter whether he was selling it on his own account or"for a friend". HE WAS THE SELLER, and as he was a dealer you have lots of rights.

He described it as clear when it wasn't, but claims EXPERIAN told him it was clear, when they admit it wasn't.
Do EXPERIAN admit to misinforming the dealer?

It was advertised on Autotrader, but not marked as a Cat D.
Was the number plate not visible in the autotrader advert?
Autotrader require Cat D to be declared, and they actually carry out their own checks on the number plates as below:

Helping car buyers make sense of Insurance Categories
To help buyers compare vehicles fairly on Auto Trader, we're making some changes that may affect how some of your adverts are displayed.
From the 23rd April 2014, we'll be using MIAFTR (Motor Insurance Anti Fraud and Theft Register) data to automatically identify cars on Auto Trader that are in Insurance Category C and D.

What will change?To give buyers more information about vehicles they're interested in, we'll add a label to all adverts for Cat C and D cars on Auto Trader.
As we do not allow Cat A or B cars to be advertised, any we identify will be blocked during the ad creation process. Category A and B vehicles are only salvageable for parts so cannot be advertised with us.

Why is this happening?

• To build trust in you — and in us. We've found 73% of consumers would trust a dealer that clearly identifies Cat C and D cars. By being upfront about your cars, we'll help you secure more sales.
• To simplify the legal side of things. You're already required to declare Cat C and D cars to buyers. We're simply automating that process for cars advertised on Auto Trader.
• To help buyers understand. We'll explain each Insurance Category clearly. Confusion puts consumers off, but once they understand the implications, more buyers would buy a Cat D vehicle.

What you can doIf you have Cat C and D cars advertised on Auto Trader, it’s a good idea to provide as much information about the car’s condition as you can. It remains the advertiser’s responsibility to ensure that all information given in adverts is accurate and up to date.

As it was misdescribed, even if inadvertently, IMO you have a right to reject the vehicle and obtain a full refund.
That doesn't mean you will automatically win
If you want to take it as far as court, there is no need to use a solicitor.
However, do you think this dealer has the necessary funds to refund you?
Would you tell us who, so we can do a brief check

On a slightly different tack, how much did you pay for the car and do you have any other problems with it?
Other than the fact an insurance company decided it was too expensive to repair there might be nothing wrong with the vehicle.
I've seen cars written off with slight dents on a wing. To replace said wing with new and respray in a main dealers will cost a fortune where a second hand door, possibly in the same colour costs pennies in comparison.. yet it is labelled a write off.
There are lots of repaired cars around of which no record exists because no insurance company was involved.

[Miker604]

Re: Used car rejection

Thanks for your input. I don't really have a problem with the car, apart from that it'll be a pig to sell on and I paid over the odds for a cat d. I paid £8830 in full on the day, the dealer is Stapleford Cars, Nottingham.

Experian have admitted that they misinformed him, so therefore by my understanding he should chase them for compensation, this is not my problem, although he is saying it is.

I believe autotrader may use experian for their checks too, so therefore they would have been told the same, that the car had no records of being written off.

After discussions with mycarcheck, they informed me which database that they had found the total loss on, and told me to inform experian which database to check for proof. They also informed me that it was full front end with engine damage, in my opinion, as there was engine damage, this car took a fair whack.

[des8]

Re: Used car rejection

Consumer Rights Act 2015 states goods have to be as described (Chapter2 sec 11)
It does not matter whether the misdescription is deliberate or not.. goods must be as described.

As you say, it is for the dealer to chase Experian for his losses, not you!

I note you now say the car was a "total" loss ..... I think you should retain the terms of Category A: B: C or D

So follow CAB advice, write to dealer rejecting vehicle because the misdescription breaches a term which is included in the contract.

[Miker604]

Re: Used car rejection

Ok I've got a template and will send him tomorrow. Thank you very much in sharing your opinion on the matter, it seems like I've been thinking the right things in regards to who's right and who's wrong. I would appreciate it if you could advise if/when I don't receive/receive a reply off of him after the 14days of sending the letter.

[des8]

Re: Used car rejection

PS how did you pay for the vehicle?

[Miker604]

Re: Used car rejection

I paid by debit card and 1000 by credit card. I'm awaiting a section 75 form from credit card. Bank have told me the only way I can use a charge back scheme is to prove that the trader has possession of the product - easily proven if you can post it.


I do have a question regarding the proving having possession of the car. If I got a recovery agent to deliver this cat back to the trader, even if they don't sign for it, would this be sufficient evidence to the bank that the car is in the traders possession?

[des8]

Re: Used car rejection

As you used a credit card, if your dealer proves awkward you can claim 100% of the cost from the card. No need to worry about the debit card then.

Regarding return of the vehicle, you only have to make it available for them to collect it at their cost according to CRA 2015. I do not see where sec 75 requires proof of return of the vehicle

[Miker604]

Re: Used car rejection

Ok, I will wait for the forms. I have heard that credit card companies are awkward when it comes to cars under section 75. I believe I can pursue the trader and raise a section 75 at the same time, but can only accept a resolution off one of them

[des8]

Re: Used car rejection

:okay:

[CLL1]

Re: Used car rejection

On the basis that the description of vehicle said it was clear, and it wasn't, then yes, it's a breach of section 11 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015. Your rights are set out at section 19 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, which states as follows:

(3) If the goods do not conform to the contract because of a breach of any of the terms described in sections 9 10, 11, 13 and 14, or if they do not conform to the contract under section 16, the consumer's rights (and the provisions about them and when they are available) are—

(a) the short-term right to reject (sections 20 and 22);

(b) the right to repair or replacement (section 23); and

(c) the right to a price reduction or the final right to reject (sections 20 and 24).


- - - Updated - - -

Ok I've got a template and will send him tomorrow. Thank you very much in sharing your opinion on the matter, it seems like I've been thinking the right things in regards to who's right and who's wrong. I would appreciate it if you could advise if/when I don't receive/receive a reply off of him after the 14days of sending the letter.

I've drafted particulars of claim for breach of contract matters like this, so I'm happy to share a copy to help you if you need to issue proceedings.

[Miker604]

Re: Used car rejection

Ok. I've sent the letter on Saturday. As it's recorded delivery I cannot 'track' it. Royal mail website is saying 'proof of delivery has not come through yet' but they claim first class recorded will be delivered the next working day, I sent the letter Saturday.

I've a feeling this guys not going to accept the letter and refuse to sign for it. What can I do if this is the case?

After some research my friend has possibly found the director. He was trading from the same address under a different company name, this company has not been dissolved yet, he also had another company, which has been dissolved, also at this address. He has a 3rd company that is also still operating at a different address, also a car dealer.
We have found that he is advertising cars from the 3rd company on autotrader, listed as cat ds, but on the company website the same cars are listed without the cat d in the description.

Now this guy may not be the director as I can't find any info on the company that I bought the car off. But the similarities are there. The websites have the same templates etc etc.

What can I do now?