Stopped for 'using my phone'

[NOCAB]

Hi,

I have just been stopped by the police for 'using my mobile phone' whilst driving.

They have issued a ticket (code 500 which I can't find) and advised that I will receive paper work in the post.

The issue here is thus;

I wasn't even touching my phone. I was driving a friends car (yes I was insured, so not familiar for me) and in doing so had my phone on the passenger seat rather than in a cradle of any description. I was taking the car to a garage which I wasn't sure of re the location and as driving along, the phone beeped at me with new 'quicker' route directions. I simply looked at the phone to see what the new directions were and a Police car was next to me and they saw my head look down at the phone and have accused me of using my phone. I didn't use it at all and as far as I am aware unless you are using your phone for any kind of interaction service for which GPS isn't one, then this is not deemed an offence. Equally the police have no physical evidence to support that I was doing anything other than their word against mine so I intend to appeal.

I have also noted on the ticket that despite taking my driving licence twice they have spelt my name incorrectly and have recorded an incorrect date of birth.

I asked the officer to prove that I was using my phone but they just said they saw me (which they can't of done) and then they 'adjusted' what they said and stated they saw me looking at my phone. I confirmed yes I did look at the phone to see the new directions but I never touched it, but they then claimed you took your eyes off the road. I said this was no different to adjusting the heating controls, and in doing so then I would actually be touching something, but in this case I simply looked at the screen, end of.

This is ridiculous apart from the fact that they don't seem to ever focus on 'real' crime.

Any advise or help much appreciated.

[efpom]

All codes are letters, followed by 2 numbers
Using a mobile phone (not hands-free) - the code for this offence is CU80

[NOCAB]

The code on the ticket says 500

[efpom]

Post up what you got - It may be a TOR (Traffic Offence Report)

[NOCAB]

I will have to take a photo but its clearly an offence code 500.

Also does anyone know what documentation I can request from the police as evidence. The car they were in would only give a like for like view off my car so whilst I didn't;t touch my phone they wouldn't;t be able to see anyway due to car height v mine. They haven't given their names either so I would want these, also a traffic car report for the vehicle to show it was road worthy. Photos if they have any which again they can't have because I didn't touch the phone. My phone records also show that there was no interactivity on my phone at the time they state they stopped me so again nothing adds up. They really are a corrupt

[paulajayne]

I They really are a corrupt

No, they believed you were using your phone. It will be difficult to prove otherwise as photographic or video evidence is not required. Officer's word is sufficient.

If you defend this do not call them liars only mistaken.

[des8]

If you intend to fight this all the way to court, when you receive the summons request a copy of all witness statements from all officers involved, log sheets, training records, photographs, video/DVD, etc.
Also you should receive a Schedule of Unused Material as this lists all the evidence that the police have, but which they may not want you to see. Following disclosure of this Schedule you are then entitled to make an application, known as a defence statement, to obtain additional disclosure.

They have to prove you were driving (that includes while stationary) with a phone in hand, so you need to cast doubt in order to be found not guilty of a hand-held phone related driving offence
You can do this by giving evidence that you were not using or holding the mobile whilst driving and that the officer was mistaken (you should not accuse an officer of lying )
It also help if you are able to exhibit your call records to show that no calls or texts etc, were made or received around the time of the alleged driving offence.
Sometimes officers will refuse to look at your device usage history in order to verify your call records.

This can be used to your advantage at trial.

This is because a police officer is under a duty to carry out a proper investigation. He is required to look for both evidence that points towards a driving offence (of hand-held usage whilst driving) having been committed and also evidence that points away from a driving offence being committed.

When the officer is cross examined at trial it should be put to him that he was offered the opportunity to check the phone records and texting history but failed to do so

This link might help you understand what prosecution need to prove: https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidanc...-mobile-phones

[efpom]

Absent sight of the document the police issued with I surmise that you were issued with a TOR. Some police forces are no longer issuing ‘on the spot’ fixed penalty notices for road traffic offences but issuing a Road Traffic Report instead pending a later decision as to whether or not a prosecution takes place. The force area where you were stopped, may have details of that on it's website.

I think you must wait for the paperwork to come through, - a notice of intended prosecution - so as to establish what charge or charges you must answer to.

On Disclosure, - The A-G's Guidelines on disclosure at paragraph 10 provide an explanation for material that may assist the accused, which is material that:

'…might reasonably be considered capable of undermining the prosecution case or assisting the case for accused…'

Initial disclosure is given after a "Not Guilty" plea is entered.

[NOCAB]

No, they believed you were using your phone. It will be difficult to prove otherwise as photographic or video evidence is not required. Officer's word is sufficient.

If you defend this do not call them liars only mistaken.

Hi I won't call them liars even though they are stupid thick muppets, but yes I will defend this. Phone records are totally clear that there was no usage data/texts/phots etc at all during any period I was driving, there never is I hate people who use there phones while driving its dangerous. The Police really do get on my nerves always sos so busy dealing with 'high priority' crime so they sate yet have time to waste on something like this which was purely me looking down at my phone on the seat next to me. Such a crime....really.....god they suck they really do.

[NOCAB]

Absent sight of the document the police issued with I surmise that you were issued with a TOR. Some police forces are no longer issuing ‘on the spot’ fixed penalty notices for road traffic offences but issuing a Road Traffic Report instead pending a later decision as to whether or not a prosecution takes place. The force area where you were stopped, may have details of that on it's website.

I think you must wait for the paperwork to come through, - a notice of intended prosecution - so as to establish what charge or charges you must answer to.

On Disclosure, - The A-G's Guidelines on disclosure at paragraph 10 provide an explanation for material that may assist the accused, which is material that:

'…might reasonably be considered capable of undermining the prosecution case or assisting the case for accused…'

Initial disclosure is given after a "Not Guilty" plea is entered.

A-G's ? what is this please

[NOCAB]

If you intend to fight this all the way to court, when you receive the summons request a copy of all witness statements from all officers involved, log sheets, training records, photographs, video/DVD, etc.
Also you should receive a Schedule of Unused Material as this lists all the evidence that the police have, but which they may not want you to see. Following disclosure of this Schedule you are then entitled to make an application, known as a defence statement, to obtain additional disclosure.

They have to prove you were driving (that includes while stationary) with a phone in hand, so you need to cast doubt in order to be found not guilty of a hand-held phone related driving offence
You can do this by giving evidence that you were not using or holding the mobile whilst driving and that the officer was mistaken (you should not accuse an officer of lying )
It also help if you are able to exhibit your call records to show that no calls or texts etc, were made or received around the time of the alleged driving offence.
Sometimes officers will refuse to look at your device usage history in order to verify your call records.

This can be used to your advantage at trial.

This is because a police officer is under a duty to carry out a proper investigation. He is required to look for both evidence that points towards a driving offence (of hand-held usage whilst driving) having been committed and also evidence that points away from a driving offence being committed.

When the officer is cross examined at trial it should be put to him that he was offered the opportunity to check the phone records and texting history but failed to do so

This link might help you understand what prosecution need to prove: https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidanc...-mobile-phones

Hi thanks I have my phone records that show I wasn't using anything on my phone, data/texts/pictures etc, it's more than clear that they have made a mistake. And they can't have any evidence to show me holding my phone or anything even close because I wasn't (fact), and it would be physically impossible for them to do so unless I was actually holding the phone to my ear, because they were in a car on the same level as me, so unless they have X Ray vision (I am sure they think they have super powers!!!) it would be impossible to have this kind of evidence. I note from a previous reply that 'they don't need any evidence' so am a bit confused as this is conflicting advise, however I will be defending as I am guilty of nothing.....well maybe of thinking all cops suck and they are the true definition of stupid, but I don't think I am alone in this regard, christ they can't even spell!

[efpom]

It would seem, from your writing, that they are not alone in being unable to spell.

[NOCAB]

It would seem, from your writing, that they are not alone in being unable to spell.

If you don't have anything constructive to say, don't be a clever dick.

Climb down from your ivory tower and please don't waste your time replying as I notice from your own replies you can't spell either!!

In a profession where accuracy is paramount, the Police have an obligation to record accurate information which can have a dramatic impact on the outcome of an offence, which is hardly the case when posting questions on this forum.

Now excuse my spelling but sips fof obkn hdea

[NOCAB]

To advise have plead not guilty and have pulled together my defence so gonna go for it. Can prove over and over again their officers have made countless mistakes

[des8]

Good luck, and please keep us informed of how it proceeds and the outcome.