11 liability orders

[Avalanche]

The first dated 03/04 for a sum equal to my 25% single persons discount , fabricated to bolster genuine arrears I encountered during the year 04/05 .
My circumstances had not changed
My enquiry hearing was a slaughter , was no magistrates just a one to one with an official , whom I later learned was actually the prosecutor . She didnt listen to a word I said and went on to obtain the liability order on information she knew was inaccurate. Put me into a level of arrears I could not address.
I was upto my neck in mitigating circumstances at the time , involved in my own law suit against a prison officer whom informed me he had spent my money when I asked for final payment , this in itself was bad enough as it wiped out my bank account , but then for the government to hurt me aswell , is no point to continue.
I went on to win my own civil case against the prison officer , but it left me shattered and coupled with what the government had just done kind of destroyed my faith in human nature , closest I ever came to a rope to be honest. My business was ruined Id built it from nothing .
The prosecutor also denied me access to the magistrates , by saying she didnt think was necessary .
Then I got trapped by the oldest bill first rule
I spent the next 6 years locked in a bedroom with just a pc for company , actually it turned into time well spent .
For a number of years I did not work , did not claim benefits so my arrears accumulated as a matter of course . My parents but for them who knows , I took everything very personally it had a very negative effect on my well being
When I made a claim for jsa benefit the council made an attachment order which kept them happy for a while .
When I left JSA benefit the council passed my files to a Enforcement Agents , I made arrangements to pay the EA .
My arrangement with the EA lasted 2.5 years of paying arrears and present liabilities , this last winter work been quiet , I fell behind with payments , on contacting the EA they were unwilling to discuss saying they wanted full payment over phone or they was the passing files to the actual baliff.
Turned out , the baliff has been very reasonable , actually believed me , sounds like it happens a lot , told me they had 25 others to see that day .
Agreed to make a report as refusal to pay , with sidenotes ,including my issue of unlawful taxation and the fact I couldnt pay , kept myself poor after this no point to be unlawfully robbed again at a later date when the stakes are higher .
So now im just waiting for their next move , I know refusal to pay on my notes looks really bad .
I see it more of an act of self defence at this point , withholding by a means of distraint any monies I felt are owed until the problem with the administration of my account had been fixed . I will try to justify my actions using the common law of ommision at a committal hearing , ive been treated unlawfully and by witholding payment until such date as a proper court hearing I feel im preventing a crime in which im the victim .
90 days ?
They treated me bad , however dont want to get thrown in jail , not sure what to do

[ploddertom]

Re: 11 liability orders

Let's start at the beginning by going to the Council & asking the following:

1 - how many Liability Orders they have against you
2 - the dates they were obtained
3 - the addresses they were for
4 - the period of time each covers
5 - how much each one was for
6 - how much is still outstanding
7 - the dates they were passed on for enforcement
8 - the dates & amounts of any payments

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

Hi ploddertom
May take a day or three , be interesting exercise just to see if I was ever credited the cash payments I made in the side room not that I could find the receipts now .Makes me apprehensive about even asking .
Understand its in my interest now to nail the figures .
Total is around £4260 plus charges of recent , think ive paid more than half off , and ive been making payments to each , since the arrangement .
Will make a post when I have break downs thanks

[ploddertom]

Re: 11 liability orders

You also need to ask for a breakdown of charges from the Enforcement Co as some of these will no doubt have been under the old rules.

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

Thanks , again is apprehension , scared to know what that number is , are £1000,s on my account in charges .
Just discovered a reply in my email , edited to remove names , titles.

Good afternoon Mr
I am writing to acknowledge receipt of your email to the ______________regarding your Council tax issues. Unfortunately the ______________ is unable to get involved in such issues and I have therefore referred the matter to Assistant Director responsible for Council tax in your borough and asked that they look into the matter urgently and respond directly to you. I have asked for a copy of the response just to keep the ______________ up to date.

Regards

Sorry ive had to edit names and titles , not building my hopes up to high just yet however its slightly reassuring someone at that level is now monitoring .
Still I was in e-mail to request details from the council and enforcement agents and thats now done hopefully I hear back soon.
btw my literature , mathematical skills far advance my written english abilities , just a pre warning for grammer errors in my posts .
However from my experience keeping it to simple English stops it becoming an argument , what they did was morally wrong and thats the basis of my issue , I want to avoid regulation arguments in favor of keeping it simple , its 2017 and to stand alone after brexit , UK needs an impeccable human rights record or its just going to end up being bought by China . Then where will they all be .

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

Im going in there as a commoner , middle class is a disillusion brought on by a few quid , there is no house of the middle class .
Diivisions amongst commoners is not good , like history proves countless times it always comes down to the commoners to get stuff done around here .

[warwick65]

Re: 11 liability orders

Im going in there as a commoner , middle class is a disillusion brought on by a few quid , there is no house of the middle class .
Diivisions amongst commoners is not good , like history proves countless times it always comes down to the commoners to get stuff done around here .

Marxists and particularly neo marxists would disagree, there are the petit bourgeoisie

As someone who spent 10 years paying arrears off it can be a never ending story but if it's stayed with the council there should be few charges other than getting the liability orders.

They should also also be sending statements, well my council did.

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

Marxists and particularly neo marxists would disagree, there are the petit bourgeoisie

As someone who spent 10 years paying arrears off it can be a never ending story but if it's stayed with the council there should be few charges other than getting the liability orders.

They should also also be sending statements, well my council did.

Sorry I do not understand or ever studied those ideals ? never had an appetite for ____isms .
Exactly my words to the enforcement agent when they requested a payment plan ," its going to carry on forever if I do that".
I have a serious problem with the administration of my account that needs to be addressed .
Its already cost this country ten fold in lost revenues from myself as an now under personal allowance player , prior to ive had as many as seven subcontractors on my books generated NI ,IRS & VAT , country has lost already for what it did to me .
Not much of a way to take gratification , it is what it is I guess

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

Sorry guys maybe I have become defiant and disobedient .
In a paragraph what happened , due to failing to collect a payment for work completed , I fell behind with council tax only a little bit of money in real terms less than £300 was my geniune arrears also I took cash to pay a bit off at the meeting .
At a one on one meeting with the council in some kangaroo court , they call a magistrates I was ordered to pay the arrears plus costs , then she a produced a ransom demand an ordered I pay this awsell was more than my arrears and costs combined with more costs.
I was vulnerable , very at the time and she got away with it on that day. Could of nailed me to a tree that day I dont do ransoms or be forced to pay taxes above my quota , ever . None of us should and just because ive been robbed I would never wish it on a neighbour.
Principle means a lot to myself
Ive never paid the ransom which was placed before my geniune arrears .

Just had post from Enforcement Agents putting my account on hold for 30 days , they want a new payment arrangement , however within my genuine councli tax arrears is an element that is no more than a ransom demand .
Strong words I call it a problem with the administration of my account .

[ploddertom]

Re: 11 liability orders

Not sure what you mean by "ransom demand"?

Each time the Council take you to Court they are allowed to add a sum for their costs & if you have 11 LO's then this will have been applied 11 times. Similarly Bailiffs are allowed to add enforcement fees to your account. The chances are the fee will be the same for £100 as it is for £1000, this is why it is important to have a breakdown as asked previously.

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

Not sure what you mean by "ransom demand"?

Each time the Council take you to Court they are allowed to add a sum for their costs & if you have 11 LO's then this will have been applied 11 times. Similarly Bailiffs are allowed to add enforcement fees to your account. The chances are the fee will be the same for £100 as it is for £1000, this is why it is important to have a breakdown as asked previously.

My break downs are on the way .
Apologies "Ransom Demand" my first , oldest liability order is for a sum equal to my single persons discount only .
My first liability order was retracting my single persons discount only, no arrears was a fully paid up year . I was eligable and entitled .

I only got into arrears late the year after , I ended up with 2 liability orders issued at once the one for the current years arrears and one for a sum equal to my single persons discount , no explanation I only know its my discount by doing the math some time later .
In short the magistrate issued my first liability order on information that was inaccurate .

[lgfa92]

Re: 11 liability orders

Apologies "Ransom Demand" my first , oldest liability order is for a sum equal to my single persons discount only .
My first liability order was retracting my single persons discount only, no arrears was a fully paid up year . I was eligable and entitled .

If you dispute the discount being removed it has to done via a valuation tribunal, the magistrates would have no power to consider it when granting a liability order.

I only got into arrears late the year after , I ended up with 2 liability orders issued at once the one for the current years arrears and one for a sum equal to my single persons discount , no explanation I only know its my discount by doing the math some time later .
In short the magistrate issued my first liability order on information that was inaccurate .

It's quite legal for that to happen - an amount becomes defaulted so a liability order is issued. Later in the year the balance becomes adjusted and a new balance becomes due. That new balance has to then go through the recovery process again, which can result in another liability order.

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

If you dispute the discount being removed it has to done via a valuation tribunal, the magistrates would have no power to consider it when granting a liability order.


It's quite legal for that to happen - an amount becomes defaulted so a liability order is issued. Later in the year the balance becomes adjusted and a new balance becomes due. That new balance has to then go through the recovery process again, which can result in another liability order.

Craig

So taking your discount from a previously paid up year because you had arrears the year after is a form of punishment ?

Putting me deeper into debt for fun is legal ? I thought a duty of care was to make things better not worse , little council minions discontented with their lives becoming twisted by the darkside using.laws to hurt the same people that pay thier wages
Was 714 taxcode gross payment cert, and vat reg before this b/s ,

Valuation tribunal my council on a list that ignore the VTS , they have no power is like begging on your knees

Thanks another realisation , slimy buggers huh ?

After 16 years of claiming single persons discount ( my gf was killed in a rta , single ever since )
In 16 years is one year of discount missing , ironically denied at the same time as I had arrears landing on the magistrates desk timed perfectly to make the magistrates believe I had maintained arrears for 2 years when the truth , truth was I only had one year of arrears , like you say the magistrates had no idea what it was for , just looked like had two years arrears .
Magistrate has the power to rip it up and shove it down the councils neck if they knew the council was using black magic to worsen a persons situation .
Black magic , you know those regulation should only be used when someones single person status is questionable or if given by error , they more clawback clauses , those guys using the darkside of law to use to do harm rather than protect from ,perfectly legal so was prima nocta , at my commital hearing I will claim the council knew of the trouble this would cause when financially and used as a form of punishment , obstruction or simply as malice .
If one goes behind with CT there is a problem more often than not , it was a debt issue , to use black magic questionable to say the least
Unlawful Victimization because I had arrears .

[Avalanche]

Re: 11 liability orders

No wonder I was denied access to the magistrates , council official did not think was necessary . More like she didnt want to take a chance on it.
I had no idea what the 03/04 order was for anyway at that time
Should of took her chances back then because this time I can explain how and why and maybe bring the magistrates onboard when they learn they was also fooled by the same black magic

[lgfa92]

Re: 11 liability orders

So taking your discount from a previously paid up year because you had arrears the year after is a form of punishment ?

No but the local authority has the power to withdraw a discount retrospectively if they feel the discount is incorrect for some reason.

Valuation tribunal my council on a list that ignore the VTS , they have no power is like begging on your knees

They can't, the VTS decision is legally binding (LGO decision's aren't)

Magistrate has the power to rip it up and shove it down the councils neck if they knew the council was using black magic to worsen a persons situation .

The magistrate cannot refuse a liability order unless there's a procedural error in issuing the notices - they cannot take in to account any personal circumstances (or discounts/exemptions/liability) when making the order.

Should of took her chances back then because this time I can explain how and why and maybe bring the magistrates onboard when they learn they was also fooled by the same black magic

Again, unless the application was flawed with regards to legislation then they cannot refuse the order.

No wonder I was denied access to the magistrates , council official did not think was necessary . More like she didnt want to take a chance on it.

There was nothing for the council to lose - a lot of the time it's simply because the council's court officer doesn't want to have to wait around for a slot in the court for the hearing. The courts generally give other cases priority and make council tax cases wait (I've known waits of several hours after the allotted time before the court heard the case).