council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

[miliitant]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

What i am trying to find out is

does capita only get paid on the amount of people identified as claiming benefit when not entitled or is their a set contract fee for their services

[alham]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Reading a link to Rother Council who also using Crapita they will be paid only for identifying each non-eligible person

[miliitant]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Yep

so the incentive is their to remove people from the discount for what ever reason

so much for due process

[outlawlgo]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

This might be worth keeping an eye on:

Government suffers defeat in lords....

"Lord Best, president of the Local Government Association, will on Tuesday propose an amendment suggesting that, rather than looking to poorer people to find the savings it seeks, councils should have discretion to reduce the discount for single people from 25 per cent to 20 per cent...…..Half of councils are proposing to set the minimum payment at 20 per cent of the full council tax or more, while about another quarter plan to set it at between 10 and 20 per cent."

[alham]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Finishing the job of Mrs T.

[Data Dolly]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

I comment on this below:

Local authorities share information about ratepayers with other agencies in order to provide services and to prevent fraud. As long as they inform you as to how they intend to use your personal information and that the Data Protection Act 1998 will be complied with, they are acting within the law.

I think this is broadly right, but mere notification is not sufficient to ensure that data protection laws are being complied with. Suppose the council is misinterpreting your data, in ways that are at odds with council tax discount law, then it is not acting 'in accordance with the law'. Clearly in such a case it is administering discounts in ways not permitted by the law and is not using data 'in accordance with the law'. Even the Audit Commission, a pioneer in the use of data mining exercises like this warns people that sharing incorrect data may amount to libel. In this case, since there is literally no such thing anywhere in the law as 'a single person discount' (read Section 11(1) of the Local Government Finance Act, often said to contain such a thing), immediate alarm bells ring in my head.

Capita, as a company, has a history of incompetence and have earned themselves the unenviable title of "Cock-Up Kings". Things they have cocked-up include -

Criminal Records Bureau (CRB)
London Congestion Charging
TV Licensing

to name but a few. In respect of the CRB, they have made some very serious mistakes that have wrecked people's lives, arrogantly asserting they "almost got it right", but refusing to pay compensation.

I would be wary of your local authority allowing Capita to handle your personal information, taking account of their history of incompetence. It might be worth writing to the CEO of your local authority, citing concerns about Capita handling your personal information, given their history. Don't be surprised if you get a reply back singing Capita's praise, but you could pre-empt that by citing the cock-ups at the CRB.

[Data Dolly]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Why they should claim to be 'verifying single occupancy' is not clear, since in law if they calculated your bill or issued the demand notice on the assumption that there was 'single occupancy' they are acting in breach of two regulations which in law they should be adhering two, both of which require them to do these actions on the assumption that the same rate and amount will apply on every day of the coming year. It is perfectly legal to be in receipt of what THE LAW ( as opposed to the numpties who are responding to you from within this council) calls a discount of 'the appropriate amount' as THIS DISCOUNT applies on ANY DAY when, put briefly, only one adult who counts has his or her sole or main residence at the dwelling. These are the facts about council tax law, as was pointed out earlier this year by the Minister in a letter to the Guardian in respect of a very similar exercise, also, it would appear, run by CRAPITA.

Dear Mr xxxx

FreEdom of Information Act 2000
Ref: XXXX

Thank you for your emails dated 8 May 2012 and 14 May 2012. I can confirm that the department has now completed a search for the information you requested. A copy of the information is marked in red.
Freedom Of Information Act 2000

DEAR SIR/MADAM

under the above act, can XXXXXX Council confirm the following with reference

CONFIRMING SINGLE PERSONS OCCUPANCY FOR COUNCIL TAX REBATE

1/XXX has confirmed that it is using an outside agency to verify single person occupancy, these agencies are Capita and the credit agencies
That is correct - this is being done as a County wide initiative in XXXX.

2/ Can XXX confirm if these outside agencies retain or delete the data supplied to them by ZZZZ after confirmation the council tax payer is entitled to the 25 % discount.Capita retains the data for a fixed period agreed with ZZZZ following the end of the SPD review. After that time the data will be securely deleted.

3/ Do these outside commercial agencies Capita and the credit agencies retain the data supplied by XXX on individual council tax payers or update their own database. Capita retains the data for the duration of the review and for the retention period agreed with XXX. During the review a secure database specific to the SPD review is updated as the review progresses.

4/ Does XXX receive any remuneration from these agencies, Capita and the credit agencies on processing or retaining data on personal council tax payers from CDC, and if so, the amount received from Capita and all/any of the credit agencies
No.

FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT 2000

Dear XXXX Council

After receiving your letter today in regards to the council tax single persons discount review, i feel compelled to do a Freedom Of Information Act request. Can you please tell me,

1/ By what statute legislation are you relying on to pass my personnel data without my consent to an outside commercial agency. (CAPITA)

THE REQUEST ABOVE IS THE ACTUAL STATUTE LEGISLATION AND NOT CODES OF PRACTICE OR GUIDANCE
The Local Government Finance Act 1992 and Data Protection Act 1998

2/ By what statute legislation allows Cherwell District Council or its agents access to my personnel Credit Reference Files without my consent.
The Local Government Act 1992 and Data Protection Act 1998

3/ By passing out my personnel data to outside agencies, does XXXX Council receive any payment or remuneration by the recipient
No

4/ In section 1 of your letter, council tax single person discount review, am i obliged under statute legislation, and if so, what statute legislation, to divulge my contact telephone number or email address to Cherwell District Council or its agents CAPITA.
There is no statute obligation to provide that information although we are permitted to ask for it under the Local Government Finance Act 1992

5/ By what statute legislation are Cherwell District Council in the above practices, are not in contravention of

Article 8 of the Human Rights Act

RIGHT TO RESPECT FOR PRIVATE AND FAMILY LIFE

The right to a private life means that you have the right to carry on your life privately, without government interference, as long as you also respect the rights of other people.

that personal information about you (including official records, photographs, letters, diaries and medical records), should be kept securely and not shared without your permission, except in certain circumstances.
Article 8. Right to respect for private and family life

1Everyone has the right to respect for his private and family life, his home and his correspondence..
2There shall be no interference by a public authority with the exercise of this right except such as is in accordance with the law and is necessary in a democratic society in the interests of national security, public safety or the economic well-being of the country, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, or for the protection of the rights and freedoms of others.
XXXXXX Council is enabled by the Local Government Finance Act 1992 to carry out reviews for discounts and exemptions. It is also able to enforce a penalty where false information has been provided. Under Data Protection Act 1998 Schedule 2 paragraphs 5 and 6, data can be processed for the following reasons
5 The processing is necessary-
(a) for the administration of justice,

(b) for the exercise of any functions conferred on any person by or under any enactment,

(c) for the exercise of any functions of the Crown, a Minister of the Crown or a government department, or

(d) for the exercise of any other functions of a public nature exercised in the public interest by any person.

Therefore, the Council and its agents are acting within the constraints of the Local Government Finance Act, Data Protection Act and Human Rights Act. In effect, the Human Rights Act does not over ride the primary legislation which allows the Council to undertake discount reviews and the processing of such data that is necessary to carry out that function.

If you are not satisfied with this response, you may appeal to the Council's Freedom of Information Officer at the above address or at XXXX. If you are still not satisfied with the Council’s response you are advised to contact the Information Commissioner directly at the Information Commissioners Office, Wycliffe House, Water Lane, Wilmslow, Cheshire, SK9 5AF or on mail@ico.gsi.gov.uk. Under Section 50 of the Act you may apply to the Commissioner for a decision as to whether your request for information has been dealt with in accordance with the requirements of Part I of the Act.


THIS IS THE REPLY TO MY FOI REQUEST ON MY LOCAL COUNCIL


2/ Can XXX confirm if these outside agencies retain or delete the data supplied to them by ZZZZ after confirmation the council tax payer is entitled to the 25 % discount

.Capita retains the data for a fixed period agreed with ZZZZ following the end of the SPD review. After that time the data will be securely deleted.

3/ Do these outside commercial agencies Capita and the credit agencies retain the data supplied by XXX on individual council tax payers or update their own database.

Capita retains the data for the duration of the review and for the retention period agreed with XXX. During the review a secure database specific to the SPD review is updated as the review progresses.

THAT HAS ALARM BELLS RINGING FOR A START

[Data Dolly]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Not only that but if they remove the discount, they may well be making an administrative assumption that you were claiming or receiving it fraudulently, having also TARGETS OF THAT SORT.

[Data Dolly]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Their records should not show that you have declared that you ARE the only resident (taking the present to be the data on the letter). They may show that you declared that you WERE. They refer elsewhere to checking 'claims', but in this case they are making up the 'claim' that they are checking. Their records should show and all staff should understand (as the council has a duty to employ suitably trained staff) that you are receiving a discount of 'the appropriate amount' on the assumption (required by regulations 15 and 20(3)(f) that the same amount will apply on every day of the tax year in question. Google the 1992 council tax administration and enforcement regulations. Read the administrative schedule of the act and then write a formal complaint about being sent a review letter which misrepresents your legal position. Ask them where they got it: did they make it up or are they using a template provided by somebody or other?

This in my view is the way forward: too many councils are failing to administer these discounts properly. Last week the House of Lords was told that one London barrister said in his view this tax was more badly administered than any other. We have a prime example here.

well then
i received this from the council today
i draw your atention to this statement

IF YOU DO NOT CONTACT US WITHIN 14 DAYS FROM THE DATE OF THIS LETTER WE WILL ASSUME YOU ARE NO LONGERT LIVING ALONE AND THE DISCOUNT WILL BE REMOVED

for a start, the 25 % discount is statutory, they have no authority to remove it if i do not respond

when i started paying my community charge, i made a declaration that i was a single person occupancy so why do i need to respond to that letter as there is no specific statutory obligation to carry out a single person discount review,

so what authority has that piece of bog roll got over me to comply

i have made my statement once as required as a single person occupancy

comments please

[Data Dolly]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Checked the council tax discount information on Rother's web site.

The usual nonsense appears:

The full Council Tax bill assumes that there are two or more adults living in a dwelling.
I think they copy and paste eachother's web sites. The law does not work on this basis and has never worked on this basis. Somebody made it up.

Rother publishes guidance notes here

http://www.rother.gov.uk/media/pdf/a...ance_Notes.pdf

These notes list two discounts at a rate of 25, when in fact there is only ONE such discount in law. They confuse disregarded adults with 'discounts'. Not only does this suggest internal maladministration, but it is a failure in a duty to provide clear and accurate and fair data to data subjects.

The same nonsense appears later in the document when explicitly categories of disregarded adults are referred to as 'discounts'.

This nonsense was started as far as I can make out by a) The Audit Commission and especially on Les Kidner, working with the London Borough of Hillingdon b) Experian Ltd of Nottingham. It has spread like a rash over local government administration since around 2007 and as these fora and a number of similar ones make clear this is causing distress and anger to a great many entitled honest decent people.

I notice that this document mentions a 'survey' form and incorrectly threatens people with fines for not answering, and says that the 'liable adult' will be liable for these. It is once again improper to issue threats of this sort.


People absolutely have a right to be clear about what they must and must not do, but given that councils appear to have saved money by sacking anybody with the brains to get their heads round basic local government law councils clearly struggle to act properly in this respect.

One can only assume that they like Bromley are sending names for data matching by Capita (who, I believe then subcontract further to Experian etc) on the basis that they are 'claiming' a discount which does not exist. Evidence that another adult 'might' have their sole or main residence at the property is sometimes stated to be sufficient grounds to suspect you of making a false 'claim' to be living alone, in a situation where even the allegation that such a 'claim' exists is the product of misunderstanding and maladministration.

One day somebody rich and powerful will be sufficiently annoyed to get a judicial review and then there should be an end to it and a return to proper administration. But until then, I am not clear what we can do except moan to our MPs and also look carefully at the data mining provisions in part 6 of the current draft local audit bill and lobby your MP saying you think that statistically based fraud investigations (INCLUDING MOST SPD REVIEWS) are wrong. See the evidence of the ICO and of Liberty to this.

[enquirer]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Tip:

When making an FOI request, consider putting it in through whatdotheyknow.com. This puts it in the public domain. Thus, it becomes available to anyone researching the same subject or for the same organisation.

[Nic]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

I have received the same letter as you militant what bothers me is how on earth are they allowed to see who has been applying for credit at anyone's address?

[harrisonpeter]

Re: council tax single persons discount review/ experian/equifax???????

Woah. Been searching for this kind of information in google and yahoo.
Thankfully it brought me here. Even though this is a 2 year old thread it still helped me with my study.
Thanks for the infos peeps.