incme calculations for CT benefit

[seduraed]

I'll try and keep this brief .

I am self employed with a disabled wife. I rent rooms in my property on a licence to occupy basis.
I also have a small job from home on a zero hours basis which pays minimum wage on a self employed basis.

We also get working tax credit of £4318 86
my wife cannot work but has been turned down for DLA after a two years on a technicality. I earned £1800 from letting rooms after my expenses a figure accepted by the inlnd revenue and around £2000 from my job my wife also recied £1800 from the lettings.
My questions are do the council have to accept the earning figures i submitted to HMRC>

Lasttime i did this the council said my three line accounts were not acceptable and wanted to see all of my receipts.


Any advice gratefully received.

[labman]

Re: incme calculations for CT benefit

I'm very surprised your accounts were not adequate for the council.

I don't think this answers your question, but it's one of the most detailed I've seen:

Council Tax Benefit: How it is calculated and paid

I guess another obvious option is a FOI request to your council asking them.

[Bill-K]

Re: incme calculations for CT benefit

I'm self-employed and we claim WTC & CTC, also H+CTB. Mrs-K now also claims Carer's Allowance (CA) for her elderly mum, who claims Attendance Allowance (AA). Over the years, it has been my local Council who have been the most difficult to deal with. In my opinion that has been been down to two reasons. One is that they often do not seem to have anybody who really knows their job. Therefore, they jump to a 'gut-reaction' conclusion - and then seek out the relevant 'Regulations' to support their reaction, without even trying to take in the 'big picture.'

BUT - they do NOT have to take the net earnings of a self-employed individual - as declared and accepted by the Inland Revenue - as an acceptable declaration for H+CTB, it seems. Sure - they can cross-reference for verification purposes, and I have no argument with that (as long as some plonker doesn't leave his ferkin' laptop or memory stick on a train...Rodney...? !!!)

I seem to be OK if I claim a certain percentage of my rent as a tax allowance, because I use an area of our mansion as office space for admin purposes. Likewise, therefore, a percentage of our Council Tax for said purpose. BUT - what I have recently had pointed out to me - and very politely, I must concede - is that I cannot claim H+CTB where a part of my declared income includes Rent and CT as an expense against it. This might possibly be a part of the problem, and I had to concede defeat, after the very patient lady quoted me the Regulations. It made sense, and I needed to apologise.

There does seem to be a kind of 'mathematical hierarchy' with benefit calcs. Whilst we must not nessecelery accept all we are told, we must bear that in mind, I reckon.

As a further response to Labman's post, I used to send my local Council a spreadsheet which showed every aspect of my income and expenditure. I got a letter one year which said that this was not in an acceptable format. Since then, I have taken the option to fill in the damned HB part 6 claim form instead. it's only once a year, after all, dammit.

[seduraed]

Re: incme calculations for CT benefit

my problem is that my ncome isfrom my home or most of it nand letting out rooms to foreign langage students stilll I'll have another bash at the weekenda nd see if i can make sense of thesituation .

[Bill-K]

Re: incme calculations for CT benefit

I only have to send in three-line accounts to HMRC for my simple tax return, but I believe they do have the right to ask for more detail if they feel it is needed. I had to provide all my paperwork a few years ago, when they decided to inquire further, and I did so. They eventually accepted my accounts as originally submitted, and we parted company amicably.

With H+CTB, these are means-tested benefits, and there are certain differences in how the Net Income is calculated. In particular, we cannot claim a portion of our rent or CT as a business expense by virtue of the fact that we are seeking benefit in respect of those very expenses. So, our net income - as accepted by HMRC - may well be lower than our net income for H+CTB purposes.

I learned this during a recent skirmish with my own local council. I might still have the relevant SS Regs. they quoted me, if you're interested.

[seduraed]

Re: incme calculations for CT benefit

thanks bill i will try to getthe accountsin order . last time they said that my food bill was too high and only allowed part of it same with my gas and electricity. I'll send ann application off to the thievingscoundrels on monday morning .
BTW am i allowed to record conversations with them? This is just for the record as i dont trust a word they say.

[Bill-K]

Re: incme calculations for CT benefit

I have had similar arguments with them over the years, and usually found that if I provided them with a good enough reason for my claimed amounts, they would then have to make a bit more effort to explain exactly how they have calculated otherwise. I NEVER speak on the phone to them, unless it really is urgent, and if I meet them, I ask for a transcript of the meeting, or a summary of the salient points, at least. When it's down in writing, there is no further room for errors or omissions, or for the eternal fob-off "This was explained clearly in our telephone conversation." (when it clearly wasn't !!!)

But, as I understand it, there is nothing to stop you recording phone convo's. However, I believe that if you intend to use that convo for anything other than your own private reference, then you must advise the respondent at the start of the call that it is being recorded.

Another suggestion I have seen is to request that the call is recorded by them, and a copy of the recording is sent to you immediately after. I'm not sure, but I would think this is a right you have under the Data Protection Act.