Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

[sb3000]

Hi there,

I would be really grateful for some advice please...as I'm currently trying to sort things out with the property I live in but am hitting a brick wall.

I currently live in a property that i was born into 30 years ago and have always lived in. Before me, my father lived in the property for more than 40 years, however, he never actually had a physical copy of the deeds. Sadly, my father passed away two years ago at a young age and so far as I know that the deeds are owned by my Grandfather (father's dad), because i have seen a copy of this extract online. My Grandfather and my Grandmother had seven children with my dad included, who know have their own families with children; so collectively i have a big existing family tree that is connected to this property.

I am not one hundred percentage sure if my Grandfather was married to my Grandmother when they left the property (before my dad took over the house).

Presently, my Grandfather, my Grandmother and my Father have passed away, so it is hard to find anymore information regarding this situation to clarify ownership. At the moment, my partner and my two kids live in this house and there is a lot of work to be done - we're worried that we can't do anything until we solve the issue of obtaining ownership. I would be grateful if any advice could be given as to how to gain a copy of the deeds, how to change the deeds to my name, possibly; so i can have security on the ownership of this family home once and for all. It is all still very vague and confusing to understand.

Thanks so much for your time and help in making this matter a bit clearer for us.

Kind regards,

Sam

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Hi and welcome!

Have you tried searching the Land Registry?

To search for property ownership: http://www.landregistry.gov.uk/publi...erty-ownership

To register property owned by a deceased person: http://www.landregistry.gov.uk/publi...rty-owner-dies

[Inca]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Did any of the deceased leave a Will??

[sb3000]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Yes i have and i have found that the land registry has my Grandfather as the sole owner of the property to date.

[sb3000]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

No there is no trace of any will.

[enquirer]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Your Grandfather died intestate.
Your Grandfather is still shown as the owner of the property.
Your Grandfather may not have been married to your Grandmother.
Your Father had six other siblings, all of whom had their own children.
Your Father died intestate.

This is a real mess.

You would be wise to take this to a solicitor specialising in Wills and Probate.

[MDfrance]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

There is a loophole which has been a cause of many problems in the past but is still utilised. You seem to have done the basic checks regarding ownership, what you need to do is to get office copies so go back to the land registry website and download the OC2 form. It will cost you £11 to get the copies of full documents but it will highlight anything untoward in the entries. You could be in a position to obtain adverse possession under squatter's rights who has never been removed the statutory period is 10 years. But be very careful because even though you have been effectively in possession, depending on when your grandfather passed away, the rest of the family may still have claim on the property. Due to this and as a member of the family it may also exclude you from the right of adverse possession. Not only that is that there is a period of 6 months in which it can be contested.

However, in saying that the legal position of the estates of your late father and grandfather may need to clarified as the probate court and HMRC need to be informed. I have noticed this happening again and again in recent years, people a passing away and properties remain in their name simply because a remaining family member is too frightened and broke to deal with solicitors, probate and HMRC because of the financial implications and in the belief that they may lose their home to pay.

Your main problem is that depending on when your grandfather passed away and because of your relationship, the spectre of inheritance tax or cap gains could swing in. It really depends on the value of the property.

So you really need to seek legal advice from a solicitor who deals in both probate and conveyancing. They will tell you where you stand and the potential costs of tidying up this mess. Like anything else it depends where you live. I would even give the CAB a go, they may be able to help. The people you really don't want on your back are HMRC so it is in your best interest to sort it out sooner rather than later. So please don't let this fester as it will complicate things further and could be an issue that you will be dealing with for many years to come.

[wales01man]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Do the laws of Probate and distribution of an estate apply here?

[Inca]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

I should think the laws of just about everything apply here wales.....and it's a legal minefield that noone should touch without proper legal advice.
I have had a lot of dealings with solicitors,probate,intestacy etcetc in the last 2 years (and still going on) ,we have a really good lawyer and even she's having to pick her way carefully through it all.
For starters......Grandad owned the house..........and anyone related to Grandad could POSSIBLY have a claim on it.

I totally back Enquirer,,proper legal advice is needed..and quickly,,cos if OP is querying this..I guarantee other family members are.
Death and Estates bring out the strangest behaviour in folks

[MDfrance]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Do the laws of Probate and distribution of an estate apply here?

Yes they do!! But like anything else it is also to do with possession over a period of time in which a claim can be made against the estate, even if it is intestate. Only a probate/conveyancing specialist will be able to advise on a true legal position and options to clear it up.

I had a very difficult dealing with an estate purely because there were insufficient funds and none of the other beneficiaries wanted to put their hands in their pocket. Finding out legal standing, statutes and interpreting the law is a very difficult thing to do without the prerequisite training. At the end of the day seek professional advice when funds become available. Never deal with probate unless there is little or no value in the individuals estate because you get little thanks and will be in for a tough time and may end up taking on all the liabilities without any added benefit.

[wales01man]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Incas last line is the truest one you will ever write on here.

[MDfrance]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Death and Estates bring out the strangest behaviour in folks

Oh boy you don't know how very true this is!!!!!!

[Inca]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

Oh boy you don't know how very true this is!!!!!!

Oh I do .........I seriously thought I would end up doing time at Lizzies pleasure because of my now estranged brother.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

So you really need to seek legal advice from a solicitor who deals in both probate and conveyancing. They will tell you where you stand and the potential costs of tidying up this mess. Like anything else it depends where you live. I would even give the CAB a go, they may be able to help. The people you really don't want on your back are HMRC so it is in your best interest to sort it out sooner rather than later. So please don't let this fester as it will complicate things further and could be an issue that you will be dealing with for many years to come.

Personally, I wouldn't trust the CAB with this matter. The level of knowledge varies wildly from office to office and from adviser to adviser, some are volunteers and some are paid staff, I don't think many (or any) are legally qualified, and this is a rather complex issue as Inca has pointed out below:

I totally back Enquirer, proper legal advice is needed..and quickly,,cos if OP is querying this..I guarantee other family members are.
Death and Estates bring out the strangest behaviour in folks

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Home ownership after my grandfather and father passed away

I currently live in a property that i was born into 30 years ago and have always lived in. Before me, my father lived in the property for more than 40 years, however, he never actually had a physical copy of the deeds. Sadly, my father passed away two years ago at a young age and so far as I know that the deeds are owned by my Grandfather (father's dad), because i have seen a copy of this extract online. My Grandfather and my Grandmother had seven children with my dad included, who know have their own families with children; so collectively i have a big existing family tree that is connected to this property.

Given the length of time you've been living in the property, adverse possession may apply here:
http://www.propertylawuk.net/boundar...ossession.html
http://www.landregistry.gov.uk/profe...actice-guide-5

Having said that, the same principle may apply to other family members if they have also been living in the property for a long time. :decision: