Sub Prime Lenders

[Ruby]

My dear LB friends,

I need to get this off my chest as it is driving me insane and was hoping to get some much needed therapy/advice from you .....

I had a sub prime secured loan with Advantage Home Lending (part of Morgan Stanley - who I believe are now JP Morgan?).

Advantage sold this account (without defaulting) to Arrow Global last year.

It has just come to light that despite their regular correspondence stating the contractual amount they expect to receive monthly, which I have been paying plus a little extra to repay the arrears, my account balance has not fallen and has actually stayed the same!?

As soon as I realised that something was amiss when I checked my credit file I wrote to them asking for an explanation. I received their response letter just yesterday.

It appears that the payments I have been making barely cover their interest that they have been charging me!

The N.O.A, I received from them when they bought the account stated that the terms and conditions will remain the same as original, which essentially means that the account is a full repayment loan not interest only. Although I appreciate that with the financial problems we have had our balance has increased over the years rather than decreased due to arrears, the fact that we are now, and have been been for a while, paying the contractual amount plus a little extra surely this should have a positive impact on our overall balance?

Some of us will be aware that JP Morgan have recently been finned billions for their gross misconduct in their involvement in the sub-prime mortgage lending industry.

Great, but what about us poor folk who have been shafted by these organisations? We are still paying the price (currently at an interest rate of 8.5%!). Arrow bought my account with a couple of hundred others for pennies are are laughing all the way at our stress and distress.

Yeah, I have been a member long enough to know a thing or two and know about the OFT Unfair Relationships act. But as with anything to do with OFT its damm useless to ordinary folk. I have taken it as far as I can with the FOS and they are not interested either.

The interest rate is linked to LIBOR but has remained the same since 2009 :confused2:. When I asked them why they said that it was for commercial reasons and they did not have to explain their decisions.

I know my only option is to take them to court, but I don't have the strength. My youngest child has special needs and I feel I am just about holding it together as it is.

[MDfrance]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

There seems to be grounds for being mis-sold the mortgage with the appalling terms provided and your now subsequent position. Hopefully you kept every bit of info and letter since day one, including your contract which you signed. if not ask for a copy of your file under an SAR. I would start by raising a formal complaint with your lender citing mis-selling and illegal manipulation of your account by the former owners compounded by themselves. Depending on what they do and chances are not much, I would then approach the financial ombudsman as the next step, if not a solicitor or CAB, even have a chat with consumer direct. The thing about these types of loans is they are often sold through financial advisors who fail to tell you the pitfalls because of the commission they get. The fact that you have been subject to a manipulated product you have a good chance of getting something back. This combined with the previous owners at the time were part of the market manipulation scandal you should be in for a better chance of success. You should also consider checking out mis selling specialist solicitors. A quick search will lead you to many a potential ambulance chaser and the GB is one of the biggest specialising in this field. There have been case in mis selling where 10s' of thousands has been recovered depending on the loan size.

Depending on your credit status I would also think of changing lender. If your status is bad then see what you can do to redress the faults, especially if they have arisen from your lender. It could be presented that your lender was the direct cause of you reduced credit rating and therefore liable for the increased costs for changing lenders. The other problem with this is the 3 main credit reference providers who sometimes have conflicting information.

To me you are definitely have a product that should not be in operation post scandal It is patently obvious that you should have been offered an alternative product and offered compensation as a result and they seem to have failed in this regard. You have a distorted financial profile through the fault of your lender and therefore you have a very good chance of success of redress.

Good luck

[Ruby]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

Thank you for you response. I have already exhausted the FOS and they have said there is nothing they can do. When I spoke to the CAB they did point out a number of anomalies. I have a lovely big fat file with every piece of correspondence neatly filed. Arrow have already said they would accept a reduced settlement figure, but considering the loan is over 50K I would need to raise some serious capital.

I feel that I need to pull myself together and get a good lawyer on my case, hopefully one that does not charge an arm or a leg.

I an not interested in re-mortgaging. This account stinks of fraud and greed and I just want shod of it. You are absolutely correct in that the only thing the broker was interest in was lining his own pocket. The product was not explained to us and certainly no pitfalls were mentioned!

Incidentally I have also forwarded some info to the OFT but have had their generic response back.

[TUTTSI]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

Ruby try Paul Tilley at Howlett Clarke in the Brighton area he is PT on forums and may well well be interested in your case on a no win no fee basis. I know he has a fairly full case load but he may be able to offer some help. xx

Thank you for you response. I have already exhausted the FOS and they have said there is nothing they can do. When I spoke to the CAB they did point out a number of anomalies. I have a lovely big fat file with every piece of correspondence neatly filed. Arrow have already said they would accept a reduced settlement figure, but considering the loan is over 50K I would need to raise some serious capital.

I feel that I need to pull myself together and get a good lawyer on my case, hopefully one that does not charge an arm or a leg.

I an not interested in re-mortgaging. This account stinks of fraud and greed and I just want shod of it. You are absolutely correct in that the only thing the broker was interest in was lining his own pocket. The product was not explained to us and certainly no pitfalls were mentioned!

Incidentally I have also forwarded some info to the OFT but have had their generic response back.

[dogtired]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

Ruby, almost the same but ours is with Kensington.
We were sold it over nine years ago by TML, who turned out to be psrt of the same group.
Had a sort of PPI added as mortgage protection.
Kensington also linked to LIBOR rates.
Intrest rate went up as soon as we hit problems.
On a plan to try and reduce arrerrs but currently struggling and frankly just about fed up of phoning them up and then saying that according to income I can afford an extra £25 a month which, like you, does not seem to be making much difference.
I hope you can get the help you need:hug:

They deny all the above and I sent a complaint to FOS.

[Ruby]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

DT the FOS are not interested/powerless in these cases. Tuttsi, thank you for your advise, I hope Paul will be interested in a case as far north as Scotland, albeit the broker we went through was based in Southend-on-sea.

If we don't do something about these sub-crime lenders soon I feel our grandchildren will still be paying for these loans ....................

[IanM]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

DT the FOS are not interested/powerless in these cases. Tuttsi, thank you for your advise, I hope Paul will be interested in a case as far north as Scotland, albeit the broker we went through was based in Southend-on-sea.

If we don't do something about these sub-crime lenders soon I feel our grandchildren will still be paying for these loans ....................

Ruby, when you did your SAR was you sent a ledger sheet showing all the financial transactions on your account from the beginning?, if so, go through it with a fine tooth comb and look closely at all the fees and charges, especially if you have had a SPO. these sub prime lenders have a habit of adding legal costs to your account the day after a hearing which can automatically put you in arrears which they then make charges on.

[MDfrance]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

Ruby another thought, try to make contact with other customers of the same who are going through the same problems. It will give a solicitor working on a no win no fee bigger impetus to pursue a class action as numerous claimants who have been misled and financially penalised as a result. As they say the more victims there are the certainty of conviction will rise exponentially.

Even if and when they supply the information in relation to the SAR, if anything is missing tell them. They will have to deal with it immediately and only you can agee a grace period for them to supply the information. If they fail to act then you need to make a formal complaint to the ICO with the details of when you sent the SAR and what was supplied and missing. They will then give you options and what they can do. Needless to say, a failure to supply all relevant information and upholding a complaint will go against them in any litigation as it shows a willingness to hide information and mislead.

The best way to get more parties involved is to trawl through the various consumer and legal forums. The more potential claimants you get on board the better case you will have.

I hope you eventually manage to set things right

[Ruby]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

MDfrance, this is exactly why I have posted my case on this website. I have also done so 'over the road' and have not had anyone so far responding to say they are in the same boat as me. Arrow did say that circa 200 accounts were sold to them in bulk so there must be at least another 199 other folk out there in the same boat as me...

I did get a breakdown of charges from the company when I did the SAR. Some I did get refunded but they have refused to refund all and since FOS can't help as the product is unregulated - I am stuck.

I am really busy for the next couple of weeks but will give Paul a call as soon as I can.

Will keep you posted.

My gut feelings have always proved me right to date and on this occasion my gut tells me that I need to see these buggers in court.

[MDfrance]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

My gut feelings have always proved me right to date and on this occasion my gut tells me that I need to see these buggers in court.

There is something very amiss in the sale on of these mortgages as they are regulated in one form or another despite the so called "unregulated" status. The fact that they purchased the loans from other lenders does open some doors due to the shear fact that the contracts have changed. I have also noticed that loans for Alliance and Leicester have been sold to them and I guess that many others from other lenders have been sold down the river too.

I see too they have recently issued an IPO and are now listed on the stock exchange and their stock is on the rise. An interesting thing this, being a listed company comes with baggage too, especially pressure from outside investors how bad news reflects on share price when issues of misconduct come to light. It seems that just like Wonga maybe Arrow are setting themselves up for a deserving rough ride not only in the media but the courts. I would suggests that you tweak your tags to the thread and add 'misselling' 'morgan stanley' as a single entry along with 'arrow global', 'advantage home' anyone else who sold loans to Arrow such as 'alliance and leicester'. The chances of finding others affected will increase when they do a search with the combination of "Advantage Home" and orc"Arrow Global" and their former lender.

I notice that they are also a registered company in the Channel Islands even though they operate out of Manchester and as you pointed out not a registered company with the FSA/FCA, they are only registered and regulated under the consumer credit act and you doing the right thing and going for them through the OFT too. Although I suggest that you read this http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/bus...dit/oft140.pdf in case this too affects your situation. There is no harm in contacting watchdog too. Let's face it there are as many corporate "rogue traders" as the cockney white van man and traveller they usually go after. Try searching for misselling and ripoff mortgage threads on twitter too, you never know what and who you may find by simply tweeting something like "my unregulated sub prime mortgage hell" #arrowglobal. Especially if you plonk it on a prominent financial media account like @bloombergtv or @cnnmoney. Whatever you do don't tweet anything that you are not 100% sure of and that can be backed up

[Ruby]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

Spoke to Paul and unfortunately he cannot look into my case because the Scottish legal system is different. It was worth a try ......

Incidentally, had a lovely chat with him anyway :tinysmile_twink_t2:

[dogtired]

Re: Sub Prime Lenders

Oh, is there anyone you could go to there?