water in cellar (neighbour problem)

[marsaday]

I have a terrace i rent out and it has a kitchen in the cellar. all has been well for many years - nice and dry. however the neighbours cellar is holding water (not converted) and the water is passing through the dividing wall into my house. they have had water in their cellar and if you look down the cellar light well it is just a pool of water (a bloody well in fact)

their drain is blocked it seems.

Does anyone know where i go from here legally. i know the cost of excavation will be very high to get down to the damaged pipe.

i am happy to work with the owner (he rents his out as well) but i havent spoken to him yet. i dont know if he will be willing to cooperate. if not what legal powers do i have to make him do the work. are there any.

i have spoken to environmental health and they will come out next week.

[Guest]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

Speak to your insurance company, this is what you pay it for. Do not try to deal with this yourself. The owner of the neighbouring property will be liable, again through his insurance company.

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

i dont have insurance as i dont have a mortgage. i have to do this on my own.

i have a solicitor, but i would rather not get involved with legals at this stage.

any advice?

[Guest]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

Having insurance is nothing to do with having a mortgage. Surely you have buildings insurance? What would you do if your tenant burnt the house down? In addition, as a landlord you are responsible for the safety of the property that your tenants are living in and your tenant can make a claim against you for damages if they are injured. For this reason you should have Landlord Liability cover. In addition you should be clear about your responsibility for maintenance under the terms of any tenancy and one of the most important pieces of legislation governing repairs is that contained within Section 11 of the Landlord & Tenant Act 1985 and which applies to leases or tenancy agreement granted on or after 24th October 1961 for less than seven years.

I hope for your sake that the owner of the neighbouring property has insurance, or you are going to need very deep pockets should he not choose to help you.

Speak with the owner of the neighbouring house and inform him that you are looking to him to fix the leak in his cellar and make good any damage that this leak has caused to your house and tell him that he must advise his insurance company as this is likely to be expensive.

You should also look at insurance, really.

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

i will sort out the insurance. i dont think the guy will be cooperative and i do not have an address for him.

i have a phone number and have left a message to speak to him.

i am pretty sure this item is not covered under any insurance (land drains are not covered i think), so he will have to pay himself and i cannot see that happening. at the moment i reckon my house is devalued by £20000 and i will find it difficult getting a tenant when the current one moves out. the problem doesnt bother them, but i cant see me renting out the house again.

[enaid]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

Who owns drainage pipes?
Some pipes belong to owners or occupiers of buildings or land. Others are owned by water companies such as Severn Trent Water. You can determine ownership from the age of the properties that are connected to the pipes and whether the pipes are drains or sewers.

Who owns a drain?
Drains legally belong to the owner or occupier of the property they are connected to even if they go under someone else's land or road. The owner or occupier is responsible for maintaining or unblocking them when there are problems.

Who owns a sewer?
Sewer pipes will often run along the front or back of several properties or towards the road. The age of the properties connected to them is important because it determines who owns the sewer.
With properties built before October 1937, the shared sewer pipe is called a public sewer. These are owned by the water company which supplies your area with water and they are legally responsible for maintaining them.
For properties built after October 1937 the shared sewer pipe is called a private sewer. These belong jointly to all the people who own the properties that connect to them. But the law says that if they are blocked or broken, it is only the owners "up stream" of the blockage or break who are responsible for solving the problem. This might sound unfair but your local Environmental Health Officer can provide advice on action to take.
So when the the Health officer has been you will know who exactly is responsible for the particular drain causing the problem.
I think you will find anything and everything is insurable, especially re the home.
Enaid x

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

i have spoken to the owner and he has had a pump installed to deal with the water. it hasnt been switched on yet. it will take a good while for my basement to dry out though.

he denies any responsibility for this though and he is in the legal profession - he works in the courts i think and so he knows his way around the issues.

i am happy this has been done and will wait and see if the problem sorts itself out.

[Amy]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

Odd that he doesn't take any responsibility but is happy to acquire a pump to pump out the water from your cellar.

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

The pump is for his cellar to pump out the water from there. The water is seeping into mine. Hopefully this will be the solution and surly must prove the water in my cellar has come from his.

He is simply protecting his own interests by denying any responsibility. He probably thinks i recorded the call

I spent £2000 last winter "tanking" my cellar because of this problem. does anyone know if i could go about reclaiming any of this money?

[TUTTSI]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

Hi Marsday

We were informed by our neighbors whose property is in the next turning to us, their back garden meets our side of our house and that there is a large amount of water and have suggested it is coming from the underneath of our house.

The neighbor called the water board and in our case it was Three Valleys and they have agreed with our neighbor and told us it is probably coming from under our house.

We have called our insurers and it appears that unless it is accidental damage we are wholly responsible for the repair. We now have to employ a specialist contractor at our own expense to see exactly what the problem is. The water company are sending a list of approved contractors.So goodness knows what this is going to cost.

As far as you are concerned as long as the water is definately coming from your neighbors property you should write holding them responsible for the damage and ask them that if they do not intend re-imbursing for your damage that they should pass this to their insurers ASAP.

Tuttsi

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

thanks tuttsi

i am seeing environmental health next week and will see what happens. they have seen the neighbours property apparently and the water board have got involved. it is nothing to do with their piping and so it is the neighbours responsibility.

[Guest]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

Read post #2 again, where I told you it was the neighbour's responsibility. If he refuses to cooperate and this costs you money, then issue a claim against him for the full amount. If he fails to pay the claim, apply for a charging order against the house you know he owns.

Start by making detailed notes, taking photographs and keeping records of conversations with him and with any others involved. This will establish a time-line and ensure that, should you be forced to issue a civil claim, you have all the pertinent details. Denying responsibility is a standard opening position in any negotiation and you should not be discouraged.

Regarding claiming money back for the work done on your cellar, if the work is unsatisfactory, which it would appear that it is, then speak with the contractor and have them come and inspect it. Was it carried out according to BS8102 by an approved contractor?

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

i did the work as i do all my own building work. i simply cannot tank the basement properly as i would need to removed the stone steps going down there. not an option.

i will keep notes etc.

is it a problem if i do not know where this person lives. obviously he owns the property, but lives 60 miles away in manchester.

[Guest]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

I spent £2000 last winter "tanking" my cellar because of this problem. does anyone know if i could go about reclaiming any of this money?

i did the work as i do all my own building work. i simply cannot tank the basement properly as i would need to removed the stone steps going down there. not an option.

Who are you going to reclaim it from and how, since you did the work yourself?

is it a problem if i do not know where this person lives. obviously he owns the property, but lives 60 miles away in manchester.

You are going to need an address in order to serve the claim, should it get that far. However, you seem to be giving up before you have even started. You have no idea if this man will pay or not and the first course of action is to approach him and tell him that his cellar flooding has damaged your property and he needs to work with you to fix it. If he choose not to cooperate, then you can take it further, finally issuing a claim if necessary.

[marsaday]

Re: water in cellar (neighbour problem)

i would reclaim some of the money from him.

i had to do all the work because of the flooding in his cellar.

i thought this solved the problem but i was wrong. because the property has been empty for some time now (his) no one has been operating the pump they had temporarily put in. now he has installed an automatic one, but it still doesnt look as though it is doing the job. his light well is still flooded.

last yr i was happy to just fix the problem. i realise now it hasnt fixed the problem and i am reliant on someone else removing the water to stop my place getting damp.

i am not happy now and so would like to take this further. for one thing the plaster board wall i created on the party wall needs replacing. We are talking £100 pounds here, so not a lot, but even so i have spent a lot on the cellar.

you see only last week have a realised all my efforts have been in vain and his cellar was the cause of the problems.