section 8 help needed please

[Hjklm123]

Can anyone help with defence for section 8?
New tenancy 12month AST private landlord fully managed through agent.
wasn’t notified of structural damage prior to move in.

So points to note
non compliance with section 47&48 refuses to confirm identity and gave false address on AST section 8 & claim
breach of landlord & tenant act in failure to provide and maintain property
breach of landlord and tenant act after requesting to terminate agreement to circumvent contractual obligations
breach of quiet enjoyment
Misrepresentation of property - I didn’t get what I was promised in the agreement.
The AST Agreement is considered unfair under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 terms benefit only the landlord ie. Early exit of agreement tenant pays fines/fees yet landlord does not. Repairs requested within 1 month for tenant no timescales for landlord etc.
no pre action protocol - no conversation ignored all requests to discuss

Any advise is much appreciated

[islandgirl]

so what are the grounds? non payment of rent for over 2 months? Are you withholding rent? Structural damage?
We need more info sorry

[efpom]

Post up a copy of the s.8 Notice of seeking possession & state how it was served on you.

[Hjklm123]

Section 8 was served correctly emailed and posted . All dates correct.
grounds 8 10 11
Structural damage - landlord has a structural survey report which he won’t provide copy of. Internal external cracks, cold damp patches, drain issues & smell.
yes withheld rent as landlord owed me money initially then he reneged on that.

[islandgirl]

To withhold rent there is a process you have to follow.
LL has no obligation to provide the report in my view
Did you not view the property before you took it?
You can obviously defend your notice - it would help experts on here if you post it up as requested.
If you wish to avoid eviction with more certainty you can bring arrears back to below 2 months.
But why do you want to stay if it is so awful?

[Hjklm123]

Standard s8
I’ve followed process for withholding rent
yes saw before hand obviously
“And why do you want to stay if is it’s so awful” - and if anyone on here thinks it’s ok to spend their every penny on moving house for just to move out again because you’ve been duped by yet another shitty landlord you shouldn’t be offering any advice.
If you had one inkling of an idea how many shitty homes we’ve lived in because of shitty landlords and shitty agents happy to take extortionate amounts of money without doing any repairs, and I’m talking major repairs, a week after you move in all the cracks start to show and the smell of commercial clean starts to fade to reveal damp and shit all because of the simple fact they move you’ out and they’ll move another person in while making a few extra pounds in the process without spending anything in repairs. No penalty to pay because it doesn’t say they have to in their contract. Yet if you’d left of your own accord you’d be massively
out of pocket and fines and fees on top as well as the expense stress and impossibility of finding another house in the same area.

So please save me the lecture on withholding my rent and just pay up because out of principal I’m not. I’m not bowing down to another shitty landlord letting him get way Scot free for not adhering to what he has a legal responsibility to do.

If anyone does have any advise on how to write a defence it would be much appreciated.
I’m going with non compliance of section 47& 48 if I’d been given their real name and real address prior I’d have dragged his snidey fraudulent ass through the courts for his breach of contract and all mentioned above

[islandgirl]

I have been equally angry with the extremely shitty tenants I occasionally had in my time as a (very decent) landlord so understand why you wrote the above. There was no "lecture" on withholding the rent - just the question as to whether you followed the actual legal process. You say you did so have answered that question.

I think you misunderstood the advice re payments - it was merely to advise that section 8 will usually fail if arrears are less than 2 months.

LLs can make lots of mistakes with a S8 which is why you have been asked to post up the redacted notice and how it was served. I doubt anyone can help without the detail.

You may have seen these but they may help with general info re S47 and s48:

This is an interesting article https://gatehouselaw.co.uk/guess-who...e-and-address/
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/ho...tion-8-notice/

Courts are generally very reluctant to grant posession on discretionary grounds but rent arrears tend to be persuasive. It does not appear that s8 has a disrepair revenge eviction clause like s21 unless anyone knows differently?

You can certainly defend the notice of course but as usual the absolute detail will matter.
Hope this helps

[Hjklm123]

Thankyou
and apologies for the rant
When I submit defence does it need to include evidence (emails to support all I claim as well as witness statement?

Any thoughts on this article?
https://www.solicitors4landlords.com...tion-pitfalls/
It suggests that if section 47&48 is not adhered to there is no rent legally due so at the time of issue the section 8 would be invalid.

Should I manage to get the case dismissed in principle for the above I’m planning on trying to negotiate with the LL to make a plan going forward

what would you suggest? Would a court instruct this or agree to uphold any plan of action?

if it is the LL won’t negotiate that leave me with another pending section 8Would there be any benefit over a small claim against the landlord ? Or would you say it a waste of time given the LL will more than likely swiftly issue another Section8 and the issues would be already a case in the possession and can be addressed in a counterclaim?

Also can I ask the court to request to see the LL insurance and structural survey?
I believe he hasn’t told anyone about structural damage and therefore making insurance invalid, but it would also give a timeline of how long the damage has gone unrepaired.

[islandgirl]

No problem. I understand your frustration. Just a quick reply as I am busy but the linked article says
Section 48(1) of the act provides that a landlord of premises to which this part applies shall by notice furnish the tenant with an address in England and Wales at which notices (including notice of proceedings) may be served on him by the tenants.
Was there any address provided at all?
Once again as per efpom we cannot really help until we see the notice.

[Hjklm123]

Yes there was an agents address provided.
but it has been argued that it is insufficient to provide an agents address.
on court paperwork they used a different and old address not their current address as well as using a different first name.

[islandgirl]

The key case I can see said "The submission that the tenant must know who was threatening proceedings was particularly unattractive in Prempeh since the covering letter to the section 8 notice expressly stated that the agent acted for the landlord, Mrs Lakhany. There was therefore no doubt as to who was seeking possession and as a result the point taken by the tenant was purely technical." This seems to indicate an agent's address is sufficient. There may be other issues with the address of course and you may also have other grounds to resist. Without more detail it is unlikely we can help, Any thoughts on the above please atticus?

[Hjklm123]

also
The LL provided a different name on ast, claim and section 8 which they are now claiming was a typo despite being asked directly what their name was.

please can you advise if it is possible to ask the LL for insurance and structural survey? Can I do a part 18 request?

[Hjklm123]

And if I do go in with a defence of section 47 & 48 and it doesn’t go anywhere can I appeal and submit a counterclaim

[atticus]

Sorry, I don't think I can usefully add anything here.

[islandgirl]

Sorry, I don't think I can usefully add anything here.

Thank you - I just wondered if you had a view on the point of law re naming the LL