Builder issues

[BaseJumper]

Hi all, i have been having some renovation work done which involved rewiring and installing a new gas / electric oven. Whenever we were asked for money we did and the relationship was very good as they helped us out after a previous builder removed an internal wall prrior to us gaining planning consent or having a structural engineers report. However our new builder has said because of our financial situation i.e lost money from previous and spent savings on the remedial works, he hasn't taken a wage despite us giving him any monies he has asked for to pay his men and materials etc. Now the job is nearly done except having the gas and electrical certificates he is demanding £7.5k or we won't get certificates or get the job finished. If we dont pay the jobs (plug sockets hanging off, front door inside needs plastering, holes on kitchen ceing need filling and the certificates will not be given and we will be taken to court. Can anyone assist if he can do this and where we stand. For info there is no written but a verbal contract.

[des8]

Verbal contracts are just as enforceable as written contracts... just more difficult to prove what was agreed.
So what was agreed?
Were there witnesses to the agreement?
Has a record been kept of what was paid and for what?

Did you make a claim against the earlier builder?

[BaseJumper]

Thanks for the prompt in the welcome forum. The previous builder is not an issue as we are taking court action, its the new ones. In the verbal agreement there was no mention of a big bill at the end or during the 20 weeks they have been on the project. Now its near finishing they are demanding a wage bill for the gaffer who its alledged didnt take a wage and if we dont pay it he wont supply the gas and electric certs even though they have been paid for.... hope thats a bit clearer of the issue

[BaseJumper]

All invoices that were supplied were paid in full we even paid ourselves outside of those for the gas cert and the electric work and cert is also being paid for outside of the agreement. So in essence all has been paid for and its his wages bill thats been demanded and we have said no then he threatned no certs, no workforce to finish the job or he will take us to coyrt

[des8]

So what was the verbal agreement?

Does the claim against previous builder include damages which might include the extra costs you have incurred?

This is obviously a complicated situation and without full details it isn't possible to give you any pointers

[BaseJumper]

The verbal agreement was he will do the job and we will pay the invoices as theybare given to us. The claim against the previous builder bears no significence on this.
the "new" builder according to his last correspondence did not take a wage as he new our financial hardship, but surely that is not our problem? If he would have added his wages on as we went along we could have managed the money accordingly but to stop all work so we have to pay his whole wage bill in one go is holding us to ransum, or dare i say blackmail

[BaseJumper]

Would there be something in the consumer protection for unfair trading regs.... agressive behaviour???

[des8]

So he is doing his job and has now produced an invoice.
You said you would pay invoices as produced.
The way you tell it here you might well be liable

You still haven't not told us much.
What was the job?
What were the stage invoices to cover?

Perhaps you need to talk to your new builder and try and sort it out.
Perhaps an agreement in writing to pay the latest invoice in instalments if you don't have the wherewithal to pay in one lump sum

Crossed with your last post.... you haven't posted anything that would suggest unfair trading or aggressive behaviour.

You still haven't said what the job was, or if you consider his demands excessive.
You only suggest the last demand was untimely

[BaseJumper]

My apologies i thought i mentioned in my first post what the job was, renovation works. All was great until this last invoice. He is threatening court action if we dont pay and he wont finish the plastering at the front door ir put all the plug sockets that are hanging out, back. Is tjat not agressive behaviour? Also not give us the safety certificates for the gas installation of the cooker or the rewiring. Yes it is untimely and why didnt he say it was going to be demanded at the end at anytime throughout all of our meetings. The stage payments were to cover materials and labour of the renovation

[des8]

The problem is that nothing was written down.

He claims he didn't include his own wages and requires them now.
It seems you didn't agree a price, so unless his demands are unreasonably high overall, you will have difficulty defending a claim.

You had an agreement to pay invoices as they were produced.
He has produced an invoice which you decline to pay...you have possibly breached the contract
If that is considered a repudiatory breach, he is entitled to down tools

There is nothing wrong telling a debtor that they will be sued if they don't pay...it is not considered threatening behaviour but a warning of possible legal lawful action

[BaseJumper]

Thank you for the above. To try and answer the above, the outstanding works as mentioned have all been paid for and it isnt him doing the work personally because he has sub-contracted them out albeit to someone who he now employs

[BaseJumper]

Having looked through all the invoices and adding up the amount paid over the 20 weeks it totals 28k so at the end he is asking for 7.5k which is about 25% extra or 25 % of the entire renovation... i think thats excessive and unreasonable

[des8]

If you refuse to pay him, and if you can't come to a compromise he is likely to initiate a court claim which you will have to defend.
You would need to instruct a quantity surveyor to obtain an estimate of what the works should have cost
At the same time you could counter claim for the cost of completing the works and for the delivery of the certificates

OR
if he doesn't launch a claim you could initiate a claim for completion of the contract (specific performance) [which he will likely defend]

But better to try and negotiate a settlement outside of court