How to change access rights?

[sealeysb21]

my neighbour and son has access rights over my land outside of my fence to go to and from their property. The land includes tarmac road and grass verges. The neighbours son has been driving on one of the grass verges and ruined it, ripped up the grass and now it is "mud". We have asked him to stop but he refuses, his mother is of no help. We have sought legal advice and he has the right to cause damage as he has the right to drive on the grass, damage is inevitable we have been advised


Can the home owner, the mother agree to a gentleman's agreement to change access rights?
Would it need to be in legal documentation or could we just knock something up?
If homeowner agrees to change of access rights would this prevent her son from taking any legal action if we keep within the terms of the agreed access agreement?
If homeowner wont agree to change of access rights, is there anything I can do to change access rights?


We want to stop the grass from being damaged, not prevent them from going to and from their property.


thank you in advance

sealeysb21

[Amethyst]

Is there a reason he is driving on the verge rather than on the tarmac ? ( is the tarmac not wide enough/not all the way along to his property etc? )

[sealeysb21]

sorry to take so long to reply. Thank you AMETHYST
Imagine a capitol L. The road runs top to bottom then turns at 90 degrees to his mums drive, there is about 4 ft of the road running top to bottom past the 90 degree and it is about 20-25 feet from her gates along the bit that runs from her gates to the road, then you have the width of the road
He drives on the grass because he has the legal right to and suffers a mental condition. He does not like being told what to do and is full of hate for me. The tarmac is wide enough for two cars to pass, one with their door open. I would need to check if he can get almost diagonal and then reverse into his mums drive with no other manouvers. If he was to turn 90 degrees to his mums gates, reverse 90 degrees to mine, go back the way he had come by 20 ft he could then reverse into his mums drive.

His legal right ( due to a badly worded document 50 or 60 years ago) to drive on the grass coupled with hate coupled with mental health is the reason he drives on the grass and has killed it, it is now "mud"

I would like to restrict his access rights to the tarmac road. i own the road and grass verges either side for 18 ft from my garden wall

sealeysb21

[des8]

Basically you can't vary or extinguish a right of way without the agreement of the owner of the dominant tenement.
Having negotiated the change a deed of variation/extinguishment would have to be drawn up
The owner of the servient tenement would normally pay all costs

Sorry, but if you can't negotiate with him, you won't be able to restrict his access

Do you have a copy of the Deed of Grant or the clause in the conveyance by which the right of way is expressly granted.?
There might just be a loophole there

[sealeysb21]

No chance of negotiating with him he is not right in the head. We have tried mediation via the police but he and or his mother refused to do a face to face meeting. yes we have the document. If we negotiate with the home owner (his mother) does this override the legal documentation and would this prevent him taking legal action? She has said she knows they should not block the road yet her guests frequently block the road, this prevents us from turning around.

Would it help if I add the wording in a post? could someone look for something that would help me?

So far it seems the law allows someone to damage my land by giving him the right to drive on the grass. I guess we have two problems, damage to land and parking. I'd like to come to an amicable agreement that would allow their guests to block the road even though it would prevent us from turning but is seems they want their guests to park on my land, block the road and prevent me from turning but not allow me or my guests to park on my land.I'd also like to stop him damaging my land.

Am I being unreasonable?

appreciate any assistance given

sealeysb21

[des8]

The deed of grant or conveyance should show;
1)to whom the easement applies
2) the exact route
3) any width, height & weight restrictions on usage
4) if it includes motor vehicles or is restricted to passage on foot
5) who is responsible for maintenance

If there are no restrictions in place, and the grass verge is part of the access route, and if it extends to the lad it seems you are stuck with it , unless you can renegotiate it with his mother

By all means post up the wording

[sealeysb21]

got the wording. written in old school terminology I'd say cos I don't understand it. Green land is road and grass at sides of.road. Road goes all the way to the drive gate and if you are on the road you don't go over any grass.

Here is the wording

In consideration of the sum of one pound paid by the Purchasers to the vendor (the receipt whereof the Vendor acknowledges) the vendor as Beneficial Owner hereby conveys unto the purchasers ALL THAT piece or parcel of land situate at Barnsley in the Parish of Twitter in the county of Essesx as the same is only for the purpose of identification only more particularly delineated and described on the plan drawn hereon and being thereon coloured Yellow TOGETHER with the right for the Purchasers and their successors in the title owner or owners or occupiers for the time being of the piece of land hereby conveyed in common with the vendor and all other persons for the time being having the like right at all times and for all purposes to pass and repass with or without horses carts and other vehicles over the piece of land coloured Green on the said plan TO HOLD the same Purchasers in fee simple subject nevertheless to the restrictive covenant in a deed of conveyance dated the fith day of March One thousand nine hundred and nineteen and made between sarah banks of the one part and susan banks of the other part so far as the same relates to the property hereby conveyed is still subsisting and capable of taking effect


can the home owners of the neighbouring properties that the above refers to, agree to a change and does agreement have to be followed by any visitors and family members?

sealeysb21

[des8]

If you want to amend the easement you will have to ask the other party for their agreement.
You may have to provide financial compensation, but she might simply agree to the change as the alteration won't massively affect them

If they agree the change, it will be binding on anyone who has use of that easement.

No one (including you!) should be blocking that access by parking on it.

[sealeysb21]

thank you DES8, alas their visitors regularly park on the area and we are unable to turn our car around. Even the son has parked on the land preventing us from turning, once our car is on our drive he comes to his car and moves it. They are well aware they and their guests should not be parking on the land. About 1/4 of our car was overhanging the land, boot area of car and we got a solicitors letter Neighbours or visitors did not want to pass and they could as I drove past the car with my other car.

thank you for the advice. Alas legal proceedings are very expensive and I want to avoid this. Who ever wrote the legal document that has the wording I showed above should have been sacked but then it was written with level headed people in mind and level headed people try to get on with their neighbours, not damage their property and block the road.

Life's such fun

sealeysb21

[des8]

If you want to take legal action your cause of action is trespass (blocking the road) for which you claim damages, and you would seek a prohibitory injunction to prevent further trespass,

I would suggest you start recording every time the road is blocked or they park on it. A diary back by dated photographs would be useful.
Write to the neighbour each time asking them to stop trespassing.(keep certificate of each posting)
If you ever decide enough is enough and take legal action a paper trail will be useful to show you have been utterly reasonable.

If you have legal expenses insurance extention to your household policy, your insurers may be able to help defray the costs of court, or failing that find a solicitor able to arrange a conditional fee arrangement.

[sealeysb21]

25/07 I cant turn around as their visitor has blocked road, I speak to visitor and explain situation
30/07 their visitor blocks road
4/08 the son tells a delivery driver to me he cant park
06/08 their visitor blocks road
12/08 their visitor blocks road
20/08 their visitor blocks road



when I say blocks road, apart from first instance they are parked on the road but we can access our drive but we cannot turn our car around. To turn around we need to reverse 80 meters to a side road. We are willing to allow their visitors to park 3 times a week and we and our visitors can park.

it is in both our interests to come to an agreement but they seem to want to flout the legally binding document and prevent our visitors and us from parking on our land. twice photos of ocardo van have been taken and neither time did they want to get by, the son did it one time as he walked home from work.

I think it unreasonable not to allow a delivery driver to park as they are there ...what 10 minutes. this applies deliveries to us and them.

legal action is expensive, our household insurance I don't think will help.

I just don't understand why they do not want to be reasonable. until I got a solicitors letter last year because the boot of my car was overhanging the land in question their visitors parking would not have drawn a comment from me, un-neighbourly to complain. Now I've had the letter I'm angry they flout the rules so often


I appreciate the advice. wife will try to get and agreement but if that fails then alas a solicitors letter will have to follow., even if she gets an agreement I expect the son to flout it but we may be better positioned legally.

all incidents we know about are recorded, this follows after someone put salt on the grass while we were on holiday. alas we cannot prove who did it

sealeysb21

[des8]

Good luck in the negotiations.