Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

[horseist]

I have a well documented dispute with Vodaphone after I cancelled my contracts due to degradation of service to the point where it was unuseable. I sent my intentions by recorded delivery on 2 occasions (they never replied) and made numerous calls and posted on the vodaphone forum. I paid all call charges but refused to pay the cancellation fee on closure ( £800 + debt agency charges of around £200 now). The whole process involved me being passed from pillar to post over a long period of time. At one point the debt collector agreed to accept half in full and final settlement but said my credit rating would still show an unsatisfied debt so I declined.I know the general view is that you can't get out of cancellation fees for any reason but I wanted my day in court with all the evidence I had gathered, and the pathetic result from the ombudsman ( Vodaphone customer service was not acceptable, they should pay me £30, but as I could not prove 'technically' that there had been a problem they had to believe vodaphone) . Vodaphone offered me know hope of a return to the service I had been used to and relied on for years so I felt I had no choice but to change provider. It was passed to debt collectors who I informed that I wanted to go to court. Since then nothing and I have an £800 default on my credit file that is really affecting me. Clearly this tactic is designed to force me to pay for my own sake, stonewalling is part of their business plan, but I want to fight this to the bitter end. All previous advice is that I should give in but that really doesn't sit well with me on principal. I'm sure most of their other victims feel they have to cave in, but I don't think they should get away with these sort of 'business' tactics, unethical is just one word that describes it. Out of interest I had never been with any other provider since mobiles began! So loyalty as a customer was irrelevant to them as well. Can I force them to take me to court? Or drop it?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Hi and welcome!

From your post above, you appear more concern about your credit rating rather than the debt itself. Going to court is not going to be the answer, they would take you to court if they wanted to make you pay the debt, as the court can resort to enforcement methods such as bailiffs or an attachment of earnings if the debtor refuses to make payments. You seem confident you'd win in court, however, even if that was the case, it doesn't mean the default would be removed.

You can't FORCE anyone to take you to court, neither would this achieve what you're looking for.

[horseist]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Thanks for this, should I take them to court then? Do I have any grounds due to their tactics causing me damage? It just seems completely wrong that I should be forced to pay an unjustified bill for personal expediency, isn't it time something was done about this kind of practice?

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Hi,
I work in the phone industry so, for me to help you i need to ask a few more questions (Lee, I can appreicate if you cannot comment due to a pending legal case.. i got your back love)

Firstly, you say you disconnected, how far through the contract did you disconnect, and did you disconnect or simply stop the payments?

Then I need to know, the lack of service you encountered, did the company do anything toward solving this problem? also did they make you any "goodwill" payments as apologies?

Also, if the Ombudsman has agreed the charges are just, there is very little a court will change. If you declined the £30 the ombudsman suggested, than you have basically declined all forms of compensation.

Edit:
Also, you say you want Vodaphone to take you to court, if they have sent the debt to a debt collector then they cannot (and I am sure Lee will agree here) access your account, the agreement you had with them is terminated and all the financial records go to the DCA.
It is not for Vodaphone to take you to court at this point, but the DCA for the amount outstanding, and they will not and cannot be drawn in to the problems you had with your phone.
If they have issused a default for you not paying a bill, to the best of my knowledge they are in the right to do so, as it is for the amount you "owe"

You are in a bit of a sticky place atm, but Im hoping I can clarify it for you.

[horseist]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Hi,
I work in the phone industry so, for me to help you i need to ask a few more questions (Lee, I can appreicate if you cannot comment due to a pending legal case.. i got your back love)

Firstly, you say you disconnected, how far through the contract did you disconnect, and did you disconnect or simply stop the payments?

Then I need to know, the lack of service you encountered, did the company do anything toward solving this problem? also did they make you any "goodwill" payments as apologies?

Also, if the Ombudsman has agreed the charges are just, there is very little a court will change. If you declined the £30 the ombudsman suggested, than you have basically declined all forms of compensation.

Edit:
Also, you say you want Vodaphone to take you to court, if they have sent the debt to a debt collector then they cannot (and I am sure Lee will agree here) access your account, the agreement you had with them is terminated and all the financial records go to the DCA.
It is not for Vodaphone to take you to court at this point, but the DCA for the amount outstanding, and they will not and cannot be drawn in to the problems you had with your phone.
If they have issused a default for you not paying a bill, to the best of my knowledge they are in the right to do so, as it is for the amount you "owe"

You are in a bit of a sticky place atm, but Im hoping I can clarify it for you.

Thanks.I was about a year into a 2 year agreement, I offered to give the handsets back aswell. From what you say the facts of my case are simply superseded by the fact that I rejected the Ombudsmans offer ( as derisory), surely acceptance would have closed the door too? And so Vodaphone can duck out as soon as they pass it to a DCA? Surely if they were no longer able to provide a service I had become used too with no admission of fault or offer a remedy I was within my rights to cancel the contract? Why should anybody be tied into a contract where the contractor can't supply the contracted service? This is what really baffles me.
I informed them in writing giving fair warning, and in numerous calls that if they could not restore a useable service I would have to change network. I accepted that nobody could offer 100% coverage all the time. When I first reported it they said they could not file a case as 'no mast was down' . I can't prove it, nor can I raise a posse of others affected at the time but the local rumour was that metal thieves had helped themselves to lots of copper cable in the area but vodaphone wouldn't admit it, I only mention this as a possible cause. In the numerous phone calls they accepted that my concerns and offered me a signal booster box FOC, this would need an internet connection, the phones worked at home anyway, where of course we had internet, but away from home in our area it didn't work reliably so the box was not an answer.They said there was nothing more they could do for me even though I was used to a useable service in all of my area. That is when I wrote giving them notice that I wanted out and would not accept a cancellation fee as they could no longer provide a service that they hitherto had and I could have reasonably come to expect and rely on. They did not reply, I wrote again a couple of weeks later, agin to this day no reply. I then settled the call charges and opened an account with O2 that from then until fulfills all our needs in the same area. Eventually after going through the Ombudsman process whereby the person that handled my complaint to begin with was most encouraging and sympathetic, I suddenly had contact from vodaphone engineers to tell me ( at this late stage of the debacle) that they had done tests and reception in my area did not have any issues which didn't relate to the period I had been affected by! I suspect that this was a rearguard action to bolster their intransigence. The Ombudsman wanted me to provide technical proof against the might of Vodaphone. I am a phone user, not a technician so couldn't other than all the info I had already provided. Then the DCA stepped in, I explained I was disputing the bill and that I wanted the matter to go to court as threatened so I could fight for my rights.They put it on hold and thats where its been ever since apart from my futile attempt to achieve a settlement with them that would restore my rating. I asked my own credit check agency if I could have what was now a 'default' marked on my file as 'disputed' but they advised against it as it would possibly put future lenders off.As the Ombudsman is apprently financed by the phone industry I do not feel that should have been my final opportunity to resolve the problem.
One last note..I posted on a vodaphone forum at one point and was contacted incredibly quickly by a vodaphone rep. I told them the whole story, they were very sympathetic, said theyd get back to me and did...sorry can't help.
Interestingly a similar reception situation is being reported in Gloucestershire that has made the local papers, no mast is down which seems to be the only criteria they might admit but they have been forced to admit other problems unlike during my experiences, its far too late for me to try and gather a group concering my case. Sorry for the ramble, just wanted to cover all bases, whatever the technicalities of my case , its a total ripoff and appalling behaviour on Vodaphones part.

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

from what i am reading, and you are gona hate me :behindsofa: Vodaphone have provided the Ombudsman with records of the service in your area.
This is a satelite picture of your area and all the masts etc, and shows all outages and any issues with masts, lines and coverage.

If there is a problem it flashes up in red.

A phone company MUST provide the Ombudsman with this if requested.

If they can prove there is no fault on the line (and it looks to me like they have satisified the Ombudsman) then your contract is valid. They have also offered you remedies which you have said don't work, so they have worked with you to sort the problem.

From a technical side of things, if you have an 02 SIM in your phone, then it is 99.999999999% not a network fault if you get a signal in the area.. sound confusing? allow me to explain.

It may be a "Vodaphone" mast, but certain masts "piggyback" networks if there is only one, or only a few in that area. You saying the 02 works fine shows me that if you live in a smaller area there is no fault with the mast.

Unfortuanatly with term fees, the company cannot force you to pay it to them directly, but they can pass them on to a DCA, which Vodaphone have done, and the DCA are within their rights to claim this money.

Unless they have agreed in writing that no termination fees would be charged, the fees apply, especially if the Ombudsman has agreed them.

Can I come out of hiding now?

:behindsofa:

[horseist]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Don't hide!! I appreciate your frankness. I'm not saying 02 is any better but we are not comparing like with like, my complaint was historic. When things reached a head they measured AFTER the period in question. If they provided stats from when I had an issue either I and others at the time were liars or the stats covered or missed the truth. Thats the nub of it. Added to the most useless customer service I have ever experienced where at the beginning they acknowledged a problem through to no lucid dialogue with a thread of continuity and I get offered 30 quid? It is disgusting treatment of a longstanding loyal Vodaphone customer who wanted to leave because of their inability to provide a service they now sya didn't have a problem? You couldn't make this up if you tried

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

yeh ive heard of some things just going BUEGH where i work (not vodaphone so im not covering for them)

We do have a Vodaphone rep, but i think with it verging on a court case he might not be able to comment, hope I have helped on in some way but truth be told, i think a court case would end up costin you more

[Vodafone Company Rep]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Hi horseist,

I can appreciate the concerns you still have here.

However, as your case has been reviewed by the Ombudsman I'm afraid there's nothing further that I can do.

Edit:
Also, you say you want Vodaphone to take you to court, if they have sent the debt to a debt collector then they cannot (and I am sure Lee will agree here) access your account, the agreement you had with them is terminated and all the financial records go to the DCA.

Hi Hurricane Puffrose,

On a general note I can confirm that we'd still be able to access an account that has either been assigned or sold to a DCA.

In instances where we sell an account you're correct in saying that the information we've recorded against the credit file is replaced with the same information but in the name of the DCA who bought it.

Hope this clarifies things for you.

Kind regards,

Lee

Web Relations Team

Vodafone UK

[CleverClogs]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

However, as your case has been reviewed by the Ombudsman I'm afraid there's nothing further that I can do.

Do you believe that this saga represents good customer relations?

[Vodafone Company Rep]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Hi CleverClogs,

Admittedly these situations don't look good.

While we don't like to see customer's being unhappy with us there will always be those instances where we're unable to reach a resolution which is to the customer's satisfaction.

I would also say however that these instances are far outweighed by those where we have been able to resolve things for the customer.

Kind regards,

Lee

Web Relations Team

Vodafone UK

[Hurricane Puffrose]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Unfortunatly CC there is always the case of the unhappy customer, and Lee will probably have had similar to me where he has been screamed at, shouted at and finally told I AM LEAVING AND YOU CANNOT STOP ME!!

In these cases, all you can do is give term fees if applicable and wish them well.. and if they say on a taped conversation, I would rather go to court than pay you, then its up to them

[CleverClogs]

Re: Vodaphone won't take me to court / can i force them!

Admittedly these situations don't look good.

Were you specifically trained in the art of understatement, or does it just come naturally to you?

While we don't like to see customer's being unhappy with us there will always be those instances where we're unable to reach a resolution which is to the customer's satisfaction.

I would also say however that these instances are far outweighed by those where we have been able to resolve things for the customer.

That is really just the standard, corporate flim-flam that one might expect of any spokesperson being interviewed on broadcast radio or television: "I don't want to talk about how we messed up in this particular case. I want to talk about the many millions of happy customers who think we're wonderful."

If cases like this are really so rare, then Vodaphone could afford to make an exception and waive the cancellation fee; it might even make commercial sense, as it could minimise potential loss of sales from adverse publicity.