Final Decision from the FOS

[leclerc]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

When the Office of Faffing and Twaddling does deign to get involved - as it did with bank charges - it screws up the case
I don't think that they did. It was clear that the bank charges were not a penalty in the legalese of the case. In fact it was a point stated very clearly OTR by a poster prior to the test case. In fact, the OFT won twice but ultimately it was the Supreme Court that gave a decision which according to Scrivener in his opinion was wrong because they did not refer it to the European Court on the legal point. If you can tell me how they faffed the case when they won two out of three then by all means please indulge me.
Phooey!

If one excludes insurance (and related services), payday loans and debt adjusting - in other words, if one just looks at traditional banking services - the proportion decided in favour of the consumer is less than 50%.

Then there is the matter of recording in whose favour a dispute is settled. If the Fobbing Off Service agreed with the consumer on four out of seven points raised in a complaint, that would be recorded as settling it in favour of the consumer even if three of those four points were trivial and even if the three points where it sided with the bank were of paramount importance.


Which is - of course - utter nonsense.

What I clearly stated was that my initial thoughts prior to reading the stats was that the customer wins more times than the bank but clearly having read the statistics then clearly that is not the case. That could be because the cases being brought or not well presented(I have given my own example that in hindsight I would have prepared differently), or it could be that they are relying on templated examples off consumer forums and yet do not understand what they are actually arguing.
The Credit card issue btw is from personal experience and was also from the fact that it was cropping up time and time again on forums about the £12 limit being accepted by the FOS. It's not the way UTCCR works and I think that is a crap decision that they are making. Furthermore banks' and I know LloydsTSB have presented to the FOS an independent study showing that Credit card default charges cost more that the £12. I even tried to FOI it with without success as can be seen in VIP thread about that issue.
In terms of the statistics I will ask the FOS for an explanation of that statistic and come back to you when they have given me an answer.

Let me put it this way in terms of an Ombudsman of any form. Do you want an Ombudsman who is a banker dealing with complaints about a faulty Boiler when they are neither qualified to talk about it nor are they technically trained? And vice versa, do you want someone who is a qualified Boiler fault person(sorry I am quite thick on some things) dealing with the technical aspects of a financial complaint?

The system is never gonna be perfect and unfortunately that is the system that we have in place.

[leclerc]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

When the Office of Faffing and Twaddling does deign to get involved - as it did with bank charges - it screws up the case.


Phooey!

If one excludes insurance (and related services), payday loans and debt adjusting - in other words, if one just looks at traditional banking services - the proportion decided in favour of the consumer is less than 50%.

Then there is the matter of recording in whose favour a dispute is settled. If the Fobbing Off Service agreed with the consumer on four out of seven points raised in a complaint, that would be recorded as settling it in favour of the consumer even if three of those four points were trivial and even if the three points where it sided with the bank were of paramount importance.


Which is - of course - utter nonsense.

I could not be bothered to email them so I called them so here is the definition:

If it is resolved in favour of the consumer either partially or fully and the consumer accepts the resolution then it would be classed as being resolved in favour of the consumer. So yes, if they won 1 out of 7 but accepted the resolution then that is classed as being resolved in favour of the consumer.

BTW, the Supreme Court did get it wrong imho in the Bank Charges test case but until someone has the balls to take a case on in terms of bank charges and win then unfortunately it is a precedent that will cover other contracts at the moment and that is where arguments are needed to get around talking about price/cost of charges.

[Ruby]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

That figures!!! In other words what the FOS publish is massaged bull s***

More bad news I'm afraid, already had a response back from the Independent Assessor:-

She cannot look at your case because her terms of reference say that she may not review the merits of a complaint about a financial business and that covers everything that is about use of judgement and whether a complaint should be upheld, what evidence was needed, what weight the ombudsman placed on evidence. Ombudsmen are expected to use their discretion on what they view as the crux of a complaint and then investigation on that. Its the way that most ombudsmen systems work.

I'm a lost cause:confused2:

[MIKE770]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

That figures!!! In other words what the FOS publish is massaged bull s***

More bad news I'm afraid, already had a response back from the Independent Assessor:-

She cannot look at your case because her terms of reference say that she may not review the merits of a complaint about a financial business and that covers everything that is about use of judgement and whether a complaint should be upheld, what evidence was needed, what weight the ombudsman placed on evidence. Ombudsmen are expected to use their discretion on what they view as the crux of a complaint and then investigation on that. Its the way that most ombudsmen systems work.

I'm a lost cause:confused2:

Stop scratching your head = you will get splinters dealing with them = I did!!

a chap down the road was scratching his head over them - he has a Bald patch and near Bald now.

[Ruby]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

Thanks Mike I'll go and pour myself a large glass of wine instead, lol

[MIKE770]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

Thanks Mike I'll go and pour myself a large glass of wine instead, lol

Enjoy the wine!

[suffering]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

Ruby I too have had a bad experience with the FOS and would like to challenge the decision i believe you have 3 months to challenge the decision through a court but i am not sure of the proceedure i found this site with some useful information on it http://www.law-now.com/cmck/pdfs/non...d/challfos.pdf
It would be interesting to know the stats of complaints going the way of the consumer if the "no brainer" PPI was taken out of the equation

[suffering]

Re: Final Decision from the FOS

Its worth adding that what you would be challenging is the Ombudsmans "opinion", as to what he see's as "fair and reasonable" which is wide open for debate