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Dismissal for "gross misconduct?", legal position
Dear members,
I'm looking for an advise before turning myself into appeal process of my case with the company.
I've been working in large company in UK for almost year and a half. First they gave me 4 months of fixed term contract, due to the success and dedication for work it turned out to be a permanent contract for me since last September.
I've been rapidly increasing department's potential, performing my duties according to the policy, received salary increase on 3% this September, also received confirmation for that I can be paid for overtime, etc.
Everything was working out good so to speak. There's of course always a fly in the ointment.
I've been having troubles with my manager from the first days I've entered my duties. She is working in there for around 2 years now. Throughout this year she did everything to jeopardize my career growth, acting passively aggressive or just ignores me.
Previous employee that worked in my place has been also dismissed as per rumors. Also my colleague that was assisting me first few months with my duties has been dismissed too, I also know she tried to switch departments and was appealing the decision (from all that I know).
The issue with manager was that she has absolutely no clue of how the department should work and of the details of work and business processes. First half a year there was pure chaos that I had to clear for them in order to establish and organize normal legal work, as a confirmation of my words about her competence in this area. She's in friends with the HR
Reason why am I telling this amazingly interesting story will be justified below.
So there's a company canteen in the building, where employees usually have their breakfast and lunch.
I've started actively visiting it since January of this year (I am late bird so need an energy at mornings), I also eat out of the office too (usually lunch, sometimes breakfast) with my colleagues.
Process of visiting canteen is short: You get Your meal on the tray (drinks, food) and go to the till (there are several tills in fact, this information is also useful for what I will advise below) to checkout. There's usually till manager who "checks out" the meal and checks You out. Payment option is only one - my employee card that I top up every time when it runs out of money (basically it's similar to Oyster system).
You usually get no receipts or bills, You checkout grab Your meal and go to eat with colleagues.
So I've been suspended several weeks ago. Reason: taking items from canteen without paying for them with the ongoing investigation.
First I thought this some kind of a sick joke or a terrible error. I was honestly shocked as I've never even stole a piece of bread in my life, I was always a hardworking and honest and straightforward person. Why would I need to "steal sausages" for my breakfast? These few pounds are so not worth of that.. To me it sounds ridiculous.
On the basis of these accusations: it turned out that canteen manager witnessed me not paying for my food items via till on 1 day. I took my food and drink apparently, went to the till, there was a line so I went to another till to checkout, they said I only paid for my drink. They have statements from my card that confirm this.
Please note that there's also been responded to me by investigators that there are no till restrictions (I can pay for full meal at any till).
There are times when we purchase food for each other between colleagues, but this was not the case.
Whatsoever, they fixed 3 similar cases (all within 7 days and I've been suspended on this 7th day). Last case was also similar to first one, they say I "did not pay for food" at the till, only for drink. Then "witness" approached me same time (I was sitting and eating with colleagues), he did not mention to me anything, just checked us out and left without saying a word.
During the investigation they did everything as by the book: questioned me several times, they also questioned manager of the canteen (the one that witnessed me "not paying for food"), my two colleagues that I eat with usually (one of them is my close friend), etc.
As advised above I am very simple and straightforward person, when they asked me where how what I usually eat I could not recall, it's not on top of my head really. I said that I usually have lunch at the canteen, I take drink and food and eat a lot outside of the workplace too.
So they stated then that I've checked out at the canteen around 80 times in past 6 months, that food was not checked out during my lunch and that apparently if it wasn't that means I did not pay for it 80 times.
- I do not keep track of money on card, I just top up when I'm told that there are no money on my card
- I do not receive bills or receipts for my meal to study them out and I do not request statements ( I doubt anybody does honestly)
- I do not check out what cashier enters from my tray on the till (I always though that it's enough to just show them my tray contents and pay as I go)
- I honestly said during the investigation that this whole situation is embarrassing and surprising for me, that I'm ready to pay what I was undercharged with if there's a concrete evidence of that
- When I tried to point out that this is cashier's duty to enter details correctly, they confirmed that (this was excluded of the investigation minutes) but then stated that this is my responsibility to check if all correctly paid
- When I offered to present my bank card statements confirming that I also eat a lot during lunch break at outside places they refused them saying that my employee card statements would be enough (for what?)
In the outcome of the disciplinary hearing they have stated that:
- My card works, there are no till restrictions (food can be paid at any till)
- I confirmed I regularly eat at the canteen
- On 3 occasions witness reported me that I took food items from canteen, they say that it's confirmed I only paid for drink
- As per my statements I did not pay for food items during lunch time (they say that this "pattern" started in January and continued until suspension, they have discovered "just now", however I stated several times that I each lunch outside a lot)
- They claim I should've noticed significant decrease in topping up my card (previously I topped up 5-10 pounds each 2-3 days and then I topped up only apprx. 5 pounds per week). To this I'd like to add that I actually was cutting my costs this year because I noticed I spend a lot on food, took some items from home to eat, and it is not a proper evidence in my opinion to judge that I did not pay for food, or is it?
- My claim that on these 3 cases and 80+ subsequent cases when I was undercharged and I can't be held responsible for cashier's errors, especially for these 80+ subsequent times which were not proven anyways has been qualified as "implausible".
They said that even if they undercharged be then I should've pointed out these errors (how could I if I did not even notice?).
Well in the end of this story I've been dismissed due to gross misconduct (as they said to me that was considered as theft). They also decided that I did not pay for my food since January 2017.
During these few weeks of my suspension and until the very outcome of the ridiculous investigation I've experienced all stages of the emotions, such as denial, rage, depression, acceptance. I lost my job, I do not even have a right for pay in lieu of notice and probably won't be eligible for Job-seekers allowance due to the sanctions imposed by dismissal under gross misconduct.
I'm writing my appeal now, however I guess that the outcome might be the same, I intend to get advise from ACAS and turn to Employment Tribunal.
It's not even a compensation I'm seeking for, my target is to at least be dismissed/resigned without this shameful gross misconduct reason for theft, that I consider to be unfair. I'm thinking that there must be some kind of conspiracy behind this investigation.For example I've read minutes of meeting with my colleagues, they are completely normal (like question followed by response "yes" or "no" + some explanation. But minutes with witnesses (managers of canteen that apparently filed a complaint) look like this: question followed by a response of apprx. 10 sentences, then second question and same thing, not like I'm a paranoid or something, but it looks like meeting did not happen, they just copy-pasted the complaint and made it look like a meeting under investigation).
I obviously don't want to work in the company that humiliated me like this, just want to restore my honor and dignity. Seeking an advise, or any thoughts what legal position I'm currently at? Do You think I stand a chance with the tribunal for being unfairly accused and unfairly dismissed?
Any thoughts
Please share some thoughts with me based on the above.
Thanks to anyone who can advise me.
I'm looking for an advise before turning myself into appeal process of my case with the company.
I've been working in large company in UK for almost year and a half. First they gave me 4 months of fixed term contract, due to the success and dedication for work it turned out to be a permanent contract for me since last September.
I've been rapidly increasing department's potential, performing my duties according to the policy, received salary increase on 3% this September, also received confirmation for that I can be paid for overtime, etc.
Everything was working out good so to speak. There's of course always a fly in the ointment.
I've been having troubles with my manager from the first days I've entered my duties. She is working in there for around 2 years now. Throughout this year she did everything to jeopardize my career growth, acting passively aggressive or just ignores me.
Previous employee that worked in my place has been also dismissed as per rumors. Also my colleague that was assisting me first few months with my duties has been dismissed too, I also know she tried to switch departments and was appealing the decision (from all that I know).
The issue with manager was that she has absolutely no clue of how the department should work and of the details of work and business processes. First half a year there was pure chaos that I had to clear for them in order to establish and organize normal legal work, as a confirmation of my words about her competence in this area. She's in friends with the HR
Reason why am I telling this amazingly interesting story will be justified below.
So there's a company canteen in the building, where employees usually have their breakfast and lunch.
I've started actively visiting it since January of this year (I am late bird so need an energy at mornings), I also eat out of the office too (usually lunch, sometimes breakfast) with my colleagues.
Process of visiting canteen is short: You get Your meal on the tray (drinks, food) and go to the till (there are several tills in fact, this information is also useful for what I will advise below) to checkout. There's usually till manager who "checks out" the meal and checks You out. Payment option is only one - my employee card that I top up every time when it runs out of money (basically it's similar to Oyster system).
You usually get no receipts or bills, You checkout grab Your meal and go to eat with colleagues.
So I've been suspended several weeks ago. Reason: taking items from canteen without paying for them with the ongoing investigation.
First I thought this some kind of a sick joke or a terrible error. I was honestly shocked as I've never even stole a piece of bread in my life, I was always a hardworking and honest and straightforward person. Why would I need to "steal sausages" for my breakfast? These few pounds are so not worth of that.. To me it sounds ridiculous.
On the basis of these accusations: it turned out that canteen manager witnessed me not paying for my food items via till on 1 day. I took my food and drink apparently, went to the till, there was a line so I went to another till to checkout, they said I only paid for my drink. They have statements from my card that confirm this.
Please note that there's also been responded to me by investigators that there are no till restrictions (I can pay for full meal at any till).
There are times when we purchase food for each other between colleagues, but this was not the case.
Whatsoever, they fixed 3 similar cases (all within 7 days and I've been suspended on this 7th day). Last case was also similar to first one, they say I "did not pay for food" at the till, only for drink. Then "witness" approached me same time (I was sitting and eating with colleagues), he did not mention to me anything, just checked us out and left without saying a word.
During the investigation they did everything as by the book: questioned me several times, they also questioned manager of the canteen (the one that witnessed me "not paying for food"), my two colleagues that I eat with usually (one of them is my close friend), etc.
As advised above I am very simple and straightforward person, when they asked me where how what I usually eat I could not recall, it's not on top of my head really. I said that I usually have lunch at the canteen, I take drink and food and eat a lot outside of the workplace too.
So they stated then that I've checked out at the canteen around 80 times in past 6 months, that food was not checked out during my lunch and that apparently if it wasn't that means I did not pay for it 80 times.
- I do not keep track of money on card, I just top up when I'm told that there are no money on my card
- I do not receive bills or receipts for my meal to study them out and I do not request statements ( I doubt anybody does honestly)
- I do not check out what cashier enters from my tray on the till (I always though that it's enough to just show them my tray contents and pay as I go)
- I honestly said during the investigation that this whole situation is embarrassing and surprising for me, that I'm ready to pay what I was undercharged with if there's a concrete evidence of that
- When I tried to point out that this is cashier's duty to enter details correctly, they confirmed that (this was excluded of the investigation minutes) but then stated that this is my responsibility to check if all correctly paid
- When I offered to present my bank card statements confirming that I also eat a lot during lunch break at outside places they refused them saying that my employee card statements would be enough (for what?)
In the outcome of the disciplinary hearing they have stated that:
- My card works, there are no till restrictions (food can be paid at any till)
- I confirmed I regularly eat at the canteen
- On 3 occasions witness reported me that I took food items from canteen, they say that it's confirmed I only paid for drink
- As per my statements I did not pay for food items during lunch time (they say that this "pattern" started in January and continued until suspension, they have discovered "just now", however I stated several times that I each lunch outside a lot)
- They claim I should've noticed significant decrease in topping up my card (previously I topped up 5-10 pounds each 2-3 days and then I topped up only apprx. 5 pounds per week). To this I'd like to add that I actually was cutting my costs this year because I noticed I spend a lot on food, took some items from home to eat, and it is not a proper evidence in my opinion to judge that I did not pay for food, or is it?
- My claim that on these 3 cases and 80+ subsequent cases when I was undercharged and I can't be held responsible for cashier's errors, especially for these 80+ subsequent times which were not proven anyways has been qualified as "implausible".
They said that even if they undercharged be then I should've pointed out these errors (how could I if I did not even notice?).
Well in the end of this story I've been dismissed due to gross misconduct (as they said to me that was considered as theft). They also decided that I did not pay for my food since January 2017.
During these few weeks of my suspension and until the very outcome of the ridiculous investigation I've experienced all stages of the emotions, such as denial, rage, depression, acceptance. I lost my job, I do not even have a right for pay in lieu of notice and probably won't be eligible for Job-seekers allowance due to the sanctions imposed by dismissal under gross misconduct.
I'm writing my appeal now, however I guess that the outcome might be the same, I intend to get advise from ACAS and turn to Employment Tribunal.
It's not even a compensation I'm seeking for, my target is to at least be dismissed/resigned without this shameful gross misconduct reason for theft, that I consider to be unfair. I'm thinking that there must be some kind of conspiracy behind this investigation.For example I've read minutes of meeting with my colleagues, they are completely normal (like question followed by response "yes" or "no" + some explanation. But minutes with witnesses (managers of canteen that apparently filed a complaint) look like this: question followed by a response of apprx. 10 sentences, then second question and same thing, not like I'm a paranoid or something, but it looks like meeting did not happen, they just copy-pasted the complaint and made it look like a meeting under investigation).
I obviously don't want to work in the company that humiliated me like this, just want to restore my honor and dignity. Seeking an advise, or any thoughts what legal position I'm currently at? Do You think I stand a chance with the tribunal for being unfairly accused and unfairly dismissed?
Any thoughts
Please share some thoughts with me based on the above.
Thanks to anyone who can advise me.
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