Problem Manager

[Melbat]

Hi All,
I am having a problem at work and don't really know where I stand.
I have been working there for 3 years now and been in a supervisor role for just over a year.
Recently I was off work due to stress as my manager is, for want of a better word, a bully.
I had to return as I could not afford to live off the SSP as we do not receive sick pay from work.

She discusses my work and that she is going to demote me with other people in the workplace,yet not me. We are cleaners contracted in to a supermarket so she is discussing this with people that do not even work for the same company.
She constantly belittles others and criticises their work,yet when speaking to the people in question acts like all is fine.

I am always hearing stories about what she is saying yet she has never said anything to me about demotion or my work being wrong.
This last week I have heard that she wants to check CCTV footage to see if me and a fellow colleague have been doing our job correctly,yet on the day she wants to see the footage for she came and checked my work and said it was fine.

There is a lot more that she has said but my head is all over the place at the moment as I am scared of losing my job and just feel sick knowing I have to go in there and work with her.

I have never had any warnings and to be honest I don't think she understands there are procedures to follow should she wish to do that. She was sort of thrown in to the role with no training.

I have made her manager aware there is an issue but when I returned to work a couple of weeks ago all seemed fine and I told her manager to leave it with me to see if things improved.I haven't spoken to her since.
I am not in a union.

Sorry for the messy explanation ,any advice would be welcomed.

[teaboy2]

Re: Problem Manager

Her actions are typical of a bully - And she certainly should not be talking about you behind your back to other people saying she will be demoting you etc, as that is nothing short of spiteful and callous behavior and undermines your position as a supervisor. Also if she makes false accusations about you to 3rd parties, then that amounts to slander. She has very likely put your employer (since shes your employers representative) in breach of its contractual duty of care and mutual trust as a result of her underhand spiteful behavior that is clearly nothing but a tactic to undermine you and make you a laughing stock. Not to mention putting your health and well being at risk in breach of HS laws which require the employer to protect your health and well being!

You need to raise a formal grievance with the manager above her, same one you have already spoken too, but before you do so, try and get some of your colleagues involved too by asking them to provide you with written signed statements about how they have been miss treated by her too as well as witnessing the miss treatment of others i.e. where she threatened to dismiss them or said she would demote you - Then attach the statements to the grievance letter. That way the employer will not be able to ignore the issue and will have to take action against her!

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Thank you for the reply Teaboy,much appreciated,after writing the post I thought I may have been a little over sensitive.

Since I posted yesterday things seem to have changed again. After finishing my morning shift I was asked into "the office" with another member of staff. She asked the other member of staff to take notes while she asked me questions.

On answering the questions she asked me to sign the paper,just a piece of lined A4 ,I asked for what purpose as she just said I needed to sign it,which I did. She then went on to explain that she had been looking at some cctv footage of me and a colleague and because of what she saw she was going to demote me as of last Thursday. There couldn't have been anything on the footage that would warrant this, as I did my job as was asked of me.

I have spoken to the other colleague who then rang her manager and was advised to send in a complaint via e-mail,my colleague also had to do this as she had him this morning also.
We have both sent in complaints and I have just received a call just to say she had received it and would deal with it accordingly.

I shall update when I have heard anything else.

Thank you again for your time.

[teaboy2]

Re: Problem Manager

Well she can not demote you without a full disciplinary procedure and you should have been told precisely why you were demoted, what basis she had found in the CCTV that led her to belief if there was any wrong doing on your part or poor performance etc. If performance she should have followed the performance review process prior to disciplinary process (though on the face of it shes not done a disciplinary process at all)

Any idea what that document was that you signed, were you given a copy? Were you also shown the CCTV footage in question?

And yes you need to issue a formal grievance based on her demoting you without on spurious make believe grounds, without carrying out any form of performance review or the required disciplinary process that may result in demotion. Point out her past actions i.e. gossiping etc that you mentioned in your first post, and make clear her actions amount to not only bullying and harassment in the workplace but also to a serious breach of contractual duty of care and mutual trust, not to mention a failure to protect your safety and well being (in breach of health and safety laws) as a result of her malicious actions against you that have resulted in your mental health being effect (include details as to effects her actions have had on your health too).

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi Teaboy,
The document I signed was just a piece of A4 lined paper,nothing on it apart from the questions and answers given in the meeting.I did not receive a copy.
I wasn't shown any CCTV footage either.
Thank you again for your reply,your help is much appreciated.

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi again,
I have received an e-mail from her manager to say that she is investigating the issues raised and will be in store some time this week,hopefully, to speak with me and my manager.

To be honest this has really hit me hard,I just feel sick at the thought of having to possibly be in the same room with this woman where she will probably lie and act as if she is the victim.

Do I just concentrate on the unfair demotion as I have no evidence of all the hearsay,just what I have heard from fellow colleagues,some of whom I do not think will speak up for fear of the same thing happening,which I cant blame them for really. I just feel I need to do something as this cant go on.
This past week since the demotion has been strained to say the least. Manager has barely spoken to me, or mentioned anything about the demotion,apart from telling me who my new supervisor is.

I do not know what I want from this,I don't want my position back, but feel I was unfairly treated. I just don't think things will change with her attitude after all this and I really don't feel comfortable there at all any more.

Sorry for waffling,I just don't know what to do as have never been in a position like this before,needless to say I am looking for new employment anyway,and have been since I started but I need to keep my job as I rely on the income and cannot afford to walk.

Thanks again for any advice.

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi again,
Still haven't heard anything from work and it now seems I am unable to receive my Tax credits any more due to my dropped hours. Do you think it would be worth me paying CAB a visit to see if they are able to help me with these matters?

Mel

[Trev1234]

Re: Problem Manager

Mel

It can't hurt to seek further advice on this so do it.

T

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Thanks Trev,will call in tomorrow and see what they say.


Mel

[teaboy2]

Re: Problem Manager

Hopefully you will be put back to your original position prior to demotion. Bascially the manager failed to follow any disciplinary procedure, yet gave you a disciplinary punishment that is no different to any other disciplinary punishment! Her actions amount to breach of contract, failure to follow disciplinary policy, breach of mutual trust and confidence and gives grounds for constructive dismissal. Though you can simply make a claim for her breach of contract and claim damages for loss of income incurred, unlawful deduction of wages (reduced rate due to demotion), including tax credit deductions - Make it clear you will be willing to take the matter to tribunal if you are not reinstated immediately (with back dated wages) to the position you held prior to the unlawful demotion that was in breach of your contract.

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Thank you for the reply Teaboy,as yet I have still heard nothing.
I do not want my old position back either if she is to remain there as it would mean working alongside her and I know she will not change,apart from possibly following correct procedure about things after this hopefully.
I rang CAB this morning and they have taken down briefly what has happened and I will be going in to see them at some point.They told me to just wait for now until I have heard anything more.
I shall keep you informed of any updates.

Thanks again

Mel

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi Again,
Had an email from her manager on Saturday saying she would be instore today to see my manager and would get in touch with me after her meeting. Just a waiting game now.

Mel

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi All,
Still not heard anything and am wondering how long I should leave it before I get in touch with her manager again. I thought I may have heard something by now as she was meant to be in store on Monday.

Mel

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi Again all,
After several emails back and forth(with her manager) I ended up walking out on the 5th October.
Although it is not something I wanted to do,I could not work in the atmosphere any more as it was beginning to affect my mental health.

After starting the grievance procedure not a lot seems to have happened. Her manager informed me via email that my manager had been dealt with regarding my "dismissal". She then suggested we have a meeting to discuss the ways forward so we could get back to the way things were. I answered, although I think this would be pointless I would attend and also asked when I was to get my position back could I have a new contract and something on paper which would set out the specifics of the job. I also mentioned that a new supervisor had been put in place,how would it affect her?
She answered that the supervisor in place at the moment had been trained up when I was on sick leave as it was necessary because I was off for several weeks(I wasn't,my sick leave was only 2 weeks and I had previously booked one week of this as holiday anyway) She also said that she couldn't see me going back to my original role as my health may suffer more and we really needed to get this meeting out of the way and see where we go from there.

It was shortly after this that I walked out as it did not seem that I was going to get anywhere with this problem,as things seem to have been done behind my back ie: replacing my role.

So, I have since spoken to an employment solicitor at CAB and he thinks I have a good case for constructive dismissal. I've been having a read up and it seems that this is hard to prove what with timings and hearsay,and no proof as such,so my thought was to try and go for the case of unfair dismissal.

Sorry for the babbling message,now to my questions:
1.I understand I have to go through ACAS for Early Conciliation first(I believe) I have been looking at the information on there and believe that I can only do this if I am going to take the case to tribunal. As I know I will not be able to afford the fees for this but may possibly get some help in the form of fee remission? Should I start early conciliation and see what happens from there,or would I get into any sort of trouble if I can't take it to tribunal?

2.What would be achieved from EC? As I don't want my job back now would I be able to ask for possibly a basic reference?

I'm still flustered about all this and really don't know where I stand any more,I have emailed her manager a few times over the past couple of weeks asking for certain documents,P45, Copy of contract and letter about supposed dismissal yet she now seems to be ignoring my emails and will not give me any contact details for someone who may help me with this.

Thanks for reading this far.

Mel

[Melbat]

Re: Problem Manager

Hi Again all,
Spoke to lady from ACAS yesterday re:Early conciliation.
She spoke to someone at employers head office and it appears they know nothing about my leaving/dismissal. The person I submitted the formal grievance to has also now left the company.
The person the conciliator spoke to said that the grievance procedure had not been dealt with in the right way either as it should have gone through HR.
I was unaware we had an HR department as I had asked on a previous occasion and told to contact the manager I have been dealing with. I also asked her when I submitted the grievance if there was anything else I should do and she said no,she would deal with it.
The conciliator said she is now waiting for a call back from the company as they are going to look into the matter.

It's beginning to look like I will not have a strong case now as I only have e-mails to and from the manager who was dealing with the complaint and has since left.

Thanks again for reading.

Mel