Employment contract and leave query

[ostell]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

Have you got your days pay back yet (and the extra 1/2 day)?

[teaboy2]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

Feb 23rd was a Sunday! I make from 23rd of October to 23rd of February, based on 5 day week to be 89 (85 + last 4 days) days worked - not 101 and not 121 - its only 123 days if she worked 7 days a week. holidays are accrued based on number of days you work, not number of days there is in a week, as standard days off do not count towards entitlement.

So no idea where they got 101 days from or where you got 121 days from ostell, so the we need an answer to the below question.

How many days a week did you work? KEY QUESTION.

[ostell]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

The regs assume that most people work 5 days a week. If you work less than 5 you get proportionately less, if you work more than that, tough, you ain't going to get more holiday. Holidays are calculated on the length of employment, not how many days worked (apart from the rider above). See post 14 on why the number of days worked (if 5 days per week) does not come into the equation.

Again, assuming 5 day working week, the regs give 28 days paid holiday, or more correctly, 5.6 weeks. for the time he was employed that is 9.5 days using the calculator. Since the company are more generous, ie 30 days, then the holiday accrued must be more than the regs provide. The calculator gives 9.5 days for 28 days paid holiday a year so for 30 days the entitlement must be more.

[jorainbow]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

To answer queries :

I haven't received anything - their position is their calculation is correct and they calculate annual leave for each completed month worked.
101 days is 23rd October (start date) to 31st January (last day of completed month) inclusive of weekends so I am now even more confused as to what their calculations are based on!
I worked 5 days a week - Monday to Friday.
I too was confused when the HR assistant told me my leaving date would be 23rd Feb (Sunday!)

Hope this helps as I am going round in circles!!! :tinysmile_twink_t2:

[ostell]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

They may calculate annual leave for each month (starting 1st of the month) worked but if that leaves you worse off then the regs then they are being a little naughty. Have a word with ACAS and also point the company to the web pages.

The other method, which they seem to be trying to use and getting it wrong, is 1/12th of your entitlement for each month you work. you worked for 4 months therefore your entitlement is (4/12) * 30 = 10 days. This web page under "Accrual Sytem. This does not mention calendar months (ie starting on the 1st of the month so 23 Oct to 22 Nov is 1 month and so on. Now if you use this 26 days (which seems to have been magicked from nowhere) then yes you get 8.7 but 26 days annual leave is less than the regulations allow so yet again the company are being naughty.

If you use the regulatory 28 days then 4 months gets you to 9.3 days.

(I like the 10 days calculation)

[jorainbow]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

I prefer the 10 days too!

Have they covered the accrual bit in the section in the contract which states: entitlement accrues in the first or last year of service at the rate of 1/12 of entitlement per completed calendar month

I think I need a lie down!!!

[ostell]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

They have used the 1/12 per month calculation but have taken it to refer to from the 1st of any month till that months ends rather than elapsed time. The interpretation of calendar month is incorrect. You have worked for 4 calendar months.

Think of when you are renting a property. You pay so much per calendar month but if you moved in and paid on the 15th the next rent is due on the 15th of the following month and not the 1st of the following month.

Who is actually interpreting the rules?

[jorainbow]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

Thanks Ostell - I understand the logic behind that totally. I assume you mean HR as they are the people I am dealing with.

[jorainbow]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

Hello again - before I contact ACAS I asked for clarification from the college and this is what I received:

XXXXXXX College has taken all of your employment into consideration.
B. You have taken 10.5 days holiday plus 3 public bank holidays, a total of 13.5 days.
C. You had been paid for 13.5 day.
D. One day annual leave was deducting when you left.
E. We have used the terms stated in the contact.
i. Your holiday entitlement has been worked out based on completed months 30 days/12 month*3 months = 7.5 days
ii. The statutory entitlement is 20 days / 365 *101 days employment = 5.5 days. In addition you have had 3 bank holidays which fell in that period = 8.5 days
iii. You have had 13.5 days holiday (inc 3 public bank holidays), which exceed both contractual and statutory entitlement.

I am seriously confused now. Does this make any sense to anyone??

[ostell]

Re: Employment contract and leave query

Statement E.i : where did the 3 months come from? It's been 4 months
Statement E.ii : The regulations are NOT days worked, they are elapsed time, ie 4 months, hence the 9.5 (or 10!) days.
Statement E.iii : The original statement that you made was that you had taken 9.5 days (excluding Bank Holidays)


The regulations give you 9.5 days using the calculator with your start and end dates. Your contracted days gives you 10 days due using alternative method of using the months calculations. At query are the number of days you have actually taken. At the worst it would be taking back 1/2 a days pay, at best they owe you 1 1/2 days pay.

The major cause of the difference of opinion would appear to be their insistence on using the number of days employed, which is incorrect. You may care to point out to them that if they used days employed method for calculating entitlement then nobody would get the 30 days.

They can't even get it correct themselves. If, as they state, you were only entitled to 7.5 days and you actually took 10.5 why did they only deduct only 1 day when you left. It should have been 3 days according to the statements they made. I would offer to buy them a new abacus!