Employer has double paid me, what are my rights if I want to keep the money?

[regularguy]

Hi LegalBeagles

I am new to the forum and I have some questions as I am not very knowledgable on employment law so I wanted to ask people who may be.

My employer has duplicate paid me today for 1 month's wages. They have contacted me today saying they "think" they have duplicate paid me, but they don't seem to be 100% sure to me. It is my first wage from them and I would rather not give it back since the wages they are paying in the first place are not very good. I do have a permanent contract with the employer but I have only been working there for 5 weeks and so I am still on probation. My monthly wage is £1,500, so they have paid me £3,000 in 2 separate payments. They are a large international company if that makes any difference.

My questions are:

1) Is there any way they can prove they have paid me twice if I just feign ignorance?

2) If they can prove it, what are my legal rights here? (could I be held criminally responsible at all if I don't pay them back?)

3) Can they dismiss me from my job if they can prove (or even just suspect) that they have accidentally paid money into my account and I have denied knowledge of this and not given them the money back?

4) What the chances of them just dropping it if I say my bank statement shows only 1 payment? (where else could they think the money has gone?)

5) What is the most sensible path forward for me?

I appreciate some people may take an ethical issue with this, but please appreciate having an extra £1,500 dropped into your account when you are on low income makes it not so easy to part with.

They have asked me to contact them tomorrow with a response so I would greatly appreciate fast responses

Thanks

regularguy

[atticus]

May I ask whether you wish to keep your job? If you deny knowledge knowing you have received the money that is what lawyers call a lie.

If nothing else, they can probably recoup the overpayment by deduction from your next month's pay.

[regularguy]

May I ask whether you wish to keep your job? If you deny knowledge knowing you have received the money that is what lawyers call a lie.

If nothing else, they can probably recoup the overpayment by deduction from your next month's pay.

I do wish to keep my job, yes. Is there anything my employer can do legally since it is their mistake? They seem to be extremely disorganised and they are not even sure if they have overpaid me or not.

What is the most likely outcome in this situation if I tell them I have not been overpaid?

Many thanks

regularguy

[Sam101]

Obviously they can prove where the money they paid went to, but it is also obvious that an error has been made and you could not be held responsible unless you intend not to acknowledge that you have received it..

I doubt they would even consider dismissing anyone for an obvious clerical error on their part, but I doubt anyone could ever deny the money had been received into your account.

Your bank statement will show both payments so the most sensibly way forward is to acknowledge the error they have made and ask them if they would like the second payment returned or consider it as your next month's salary. They will see you are an honest employee of the company and worth keeping after your probation period.

Always take the honest course in life and never even think about 'getting away with something' as it never pays in the long run.

As a new employee you will learn that starting on a lower than hoped for salary may lead to greater opportunity so do your best for any employer and you will be rewarded.

Do let us know how things go and always return to the forum if you need any future help or guidance.
Sam

[atticus]

If you have in fact had the money, then saying you haven't is going to be very unwise. Once they get their act together they will know how much they have paid and the details of the account to which the money went. And if I have understood your first post correctly, you are aware you have been paid twice.

There are provisions in the employment legislation under which an employer may take action against you to get the money back (another member may be able to give chapter and verse).

And look at your employment contract. It probably contains provisions allowing the employer to deduct money you owe from your pay.

[regularguy]

Obviously they can prove where the money they paid went to, but it is also obvious that an error has been made and you could not be held responsible unless you intend not to acknowledge that you have received it..

I doubt they would even consider dismissing anyone for an obvious clerical error on their part, but I doubt anyone could ever deny the money had been received into your account.

Your bank statement will show both payments so the most sensibly way forward is to acknowledge the error they have made and ask them if they would like the second payment returned or consider it as your next month's salary. They will see you are an honest employee of the company and worth keeping after your probation period.

Always take the honest course in life and never even think about 'getting away with something' as it never pays in the long run.

As a new employee you will learn that starting on a lower than hoped for salary may lead to greater opportunity so do your best for any employer and you will be rewarded.

Do let us know how things go and always return to the forum if you need any future help or guidance.
Sam

Hi Sam

Thanks for your response.

I appreciate the advice but I am not looking at staying with the company for a long time anyway.

I would rather just keep the money so my question is purely from a legal standpoint and not an ethical one. I appreciate it is not a good general life rule to live by to "get away with things".

In other words my mind is made up on what my desired outcome in this situation is, so now I simply need the legal/employment advice to get away with it.

Many thanks

regularguy

[regularguy]

If you have in fact had the money, then saying you haven't is going to be very unwise. Once they get their act together they will know how much they have paid and the details of the account to which the money went. And if I have understood your first post correctly, you are aware you have been paid twice.

There are provisions in the employment legislation under which an employer may take action against you to get the money back (another member may be able to give chapter and verse).

And look at your employment contract. It probably contains provisions allowing the employer to deduct money you owe from your pay.

If they end up deducting money in small amounts I am fine with it. I just don't want to be dismissed or face legal action.

My plan of action is to at first deny knowledge the money has been paid twice, then wait to see if they either drop it or state that they are certain the money has been paid to me twice. If they persist, I will most likely just pay it them back.

[atticus]

Sorry, but I am not able to give advice of the kind you seek.

[R0b]

From a criminal perspective, the intention to keep the money and not return it knowing you have no entitlement to it would amount to theft and you could be prosecuted by the company via private prosecution or they could report you to the police and the CPS may decide to prosecute you. Deliberately lying about not receiving the money knowing you have turns the theft into a possible fraud offence and could land yourself with jail time as fraud is considered a very serious offence in the eyes of the court.

If you employer wanted to pursue via the civil courts, you would have no defence based on what you've described as far as I can see. They're entitled to the return of the money, either via what si written in the contract to claw back that amount and possible deduct it from any further wages or by way of restitution which is a separate right that your employer can rely on in the event there is nothing in the contract covering this situation. If you lose the claim and don't cough up within one month of judgment the you will have a CCJ for 6 years on your credit file and may find it hard to obtain certain kinds of jobs

[regularguy]

From a criminal perspective, the intention to keep the money and not return it knowing you have no entitlement to it would amount to theft and you could be prosecuted by the company via private prosecution or they could report you to the police and the CPS may decide to prosecute you. Deliberately lying about not receiving the money knowing you have turns the theft into a possible fraud offence and could land yourself with jail time as fraud is considered a very serious offence in the eyes of the court.

If you employer wanted to pursue via the civil courts, you would have no defence based on what you've described as far as I can see. They're entitled to the return of the money, either via what si written in the contract to claw back that amount and possible deduct it from any further wages or by way of restitution which is a separate right that your employer can rely on in the event there is nothing in the contract covering this situation. If you lose the claim and don't cough up within one month of judgment the you will have a CCJ for 6 years on your credit file and may find it hard to obtain certain kinds of jobs

Thanks ROB, for a thorough and detailed answer.

Would it be theft though since they paid into my account? If a private individual pays money into one's account by mistake, one has no legal obligation to return the money since one did not actively take it, if I am correct?

It would be hard for them to prove fraud from me not checking my bank statement very carefully and therfore not having noticed a second payment? Why should I do this after all for their mistake?


Your response seems to be an extreme worst case scenario for what could easily be a genuine mistake. I was looking more for likely outcome.

[atticus]

You are not correct. Your proposed course involves dishonesty. The potential consequences have been explained. You have been given the most likely outcome.

You are, of course, at liberty not to take the advice you have been given.

[regularguy]

You are not correct. Your proposed course involves dishonesty. The potential consequences have been explained. You have been given the most likely outcome.

You are, of course, at liberty not to take the advice you have been given.

Thank you ATTICUS.

Perhaps I have misunderstood, which part of what I said is incorrect? This is suprising to me since I have only asked questions and proposed a plan of action, and I have not attempted any statement of fact.

[R0b]

Would it be theft though since they paid into my account?

Yes. The Theft Act 1968 makes it an offence if you dishonestly appropriate something with the intention to permanently deprive the owner of it. In your original post you acknowledge that they think you may have been paid twice by mistake. Regardless of whether they are 100% certain at this point in time, you are on notice that you may have been paid more than you should have been. a reasonable person with that knowledge would check their account to verify, which you have done and confirm you have been paid twice. At the point of becoming aware and refusing to return or otherwise spend it, you are likely to have satisfied the criteria for theft.

If a private individual pays money into one's account by mistake, one has no legal obligation to return the money since one did not actively take it, if I am correct?

Absolutely correct. At this point in time you have no legal obligation to return the money unless a court orders you to do so, but there are legal consequences of not returning the money as I've already described. I guess its also possible that your employer could have grounds for dismissing you for refusing to return the money or at the very least if you denied having received a double payment but it is proven that you did in fact receive it.

It would be hard for them to prove fraud from me not checking my bank statement very carefully and therfore not having noticed a second payment?

Not particularly on these set of facts. Suggest you do some research on fraud by false representation. Of course you can't predict an outcome but the fact that you've been informed of a potential double payment and therefore you would have been under a reasonable duty to check your account and upon becoming aware, notify your employer. Playing dumb or pleading ignorance may not fly for something liek this.

Your response seems to be an extreme worst case scenario for what could easily be a genuine mistake. I was looking more for likely outcome.

Not necessarily. They may sound like a worst case scenario but I would say these points are a harsh reality. More and more employers are willing to take action against those who defraud them or seek to cause them a loss or expense unnecessarily. Obviously I don't know how your employers will react but if they wanted to be really awkward, they could exercise a number of these options to heap pressure on you to repaying it.

As you have already said, you are looking to get away with it and your employer hasn't yet come back to you so all of this is just academic really. Not sure I can add anything more to this conversation.

[regularguy]

Yes. The Theft Act 1968 makes it an offence if you dishonestly appropriate something with the intention to permanently deprive the owner of it. In your original post you acknowledge that they think you may have been paid twice by mistake. Regardless of whether they are 100% certain at this point in time, you are on notice that you may have been paid more than you should have been. a reasonable person with that knowledge would check their account to verify, which you have done and confirm you have been paid twice. At the point of becoming aware and refusing to return or otherwise spend it, you are likely to have satisfied the criteria for theft.

Thanks for clarifying. But I would still add that it would have to be proven that I ever became aware.

Absolutely correct. At this point in time you have no legal obligation to return the money unless a court orders you to do so, but there are legal consequences of not returning the money as I've already described. I guess its also possible that your employer could have grounds for dismissing you for refusing to return the money or at the very least if you denied having received a double payment but it is proven that you did in fact receive it.

I didn't word this question as well as I should have. I meant "is it legal to not return money that either a private individual or a company has accidently paid into one's account, on the basis that the money now belongs to the account holder?".

However I believe you have answered this.

Not particularly on these set of facts. Suggest you do some research on fraud by false representation. Of course you can't predict an outcome but the fact that you've been informed of a potential double payment and therefore you would have been under a reasonable duty to check your account and upon becoming aware, notify your employer. Playing dumb or pleading ignorance may not fly for something liek this.

I agree, but I am not looking for it to get that far or even close. If my employer persists in investigating the missing payment my plan is to feign realisation that the money is, in fact, in my account. I know they may not believe that I didn't previously know this, but they have no proof at all, and how likely is it they would take further action having recouped the missing payment from me?

Not necessarily. They may sound like a worst case scenario but I would say these points are a harsh reality. More and more employers are willing to take action against those who defraud them or seek to cause them a loss or expense unnecessarily. Obviously I don't know how your employers will react but if they wanted to be really awkward, they could exercise a number of these options to heap pressure on you to repaying it.

Perhaps, but again I am not looking to allow it get that far.

As you have already said, you are looking to get away with it and your employer hasn't yet come back to you so all of this is just academic really. Not sure I can add anything more to this conversation.

I would say it is of practical importance if I am looking to risk potential legal investigation and/or employment consequences. Currently I am 50/50 undecided whether to feign a lack of knowledge of receiving the extra payment or just pay back the money

[R0b]

I'm not entirely sure how you can pretend to realise that you didn't know the money was in your account because you have been told that there is a suspicion you could have been double paid. Any reasonable person would check their bank account after being told they have been overpaid and I think certainly in a civil setting, the court would take a dim view of you if you were to attempt to make the suggestion that even though you were told about potential overpayment, you chose to sit on your hands and do nothing.

This thread shouldn't really have gotten this far and I'm struggling why you are even toying with the idea of keeping the money and denying any knowledge but if you want to try make a quick buck at the expense of potentially risking your job/career, I can't say I'll have any sympathy if it goes pear shaped, but I can tell you with quite a bit of certainty that the law is not on your side.