Ambiguous Contract

[Guest]

Hello,
I signed a contract for attending a training course at work. However having read it thoroughly it seems to be very ambiguous missing important information. I'm trying to find someone who can look over it and tell me if it is legally binding as it makes no sense. Could someone point me in the direction of a company that could do so. Im unsure if it comes under contract law or employment law.

Many thanks

[paulajayne]

Redact company and personal info and post it up here.

[Mikef8619]

Hi,
ive attached a screen shot of the contract.
I'm issue is half was down the page it says if the required amount of shifts a not completed I would have to make a contribution however it never says what the required amount is.

[paulajayne]

I would just ask them to clarify and amend the contract to state what is required.

[Mikef8619]

It's a bit to late for that as they are now asking for money back. I'd worked there full time since the send of the course and done other time so would have thought I'd have reached any required amount of shifts....

Do where can I find what that amount is though. So trying to find out if they can deduct money from my wage based on this contract... If the required amount of say another handful of shifts it would be worth me staying longer or doing ot shifts but can't find this info

[ULA]

It would appear that you signed this agreement in Jan of this year, when did the training finish? Are you in the process of leaving? It does appear to be a bit confusing, however they have given a sliding scale repayment schedule from when training finished, to a period 12 months out, effectively to get benefit of the training they have paid for, which is very normal for these types of agreement.

If you are leaving then it would appear that the repayment is based on the amount of time you have been employed since the end of the training up until the date you leave. Effectively the closer you get to 12 months from the end of the training the less you have to repay. Have you been told how much they are expecting you to pay back?

[Mikef8619]

Yeah, the training finished end of Feb I believe. They are asking for approx £900 to be deducted from my last wage.

I read this as if I didn't complete a certain amount of shifts then the sliding scale would come into effect. It's only now I am leaving I've realised they didnt specify the amount of shifts required..

Tbh they have even provided me a certificate or any form of recognition or proof that I attended/ completed to course so I'm not happy about that either.

[ULA]

Assuming you leave at the end of July then you have only completed 5 months since the end of the training course. Given the sliding scale they have indicated in the letter that should in fact mean the repayment should be £1254.12 and the £900 they are asking you to pay is in fact the equivalent of 5 months.

Can you ask your employer to provide proof of your attendance/completion of the course so that you have this evidenced for a future employer, particularly if you have to repay some of the cost.

[Mikef8619]

Hi,
no I have to give 3 months notice so can't leave until mid September so I believe the £900 correct.

So going forward I should ask what the required amount of shifts actually is and request a certificate for course completion..

I'll give this a shot and see how far I get.

Thanks

[ULA]

Ok those calculations work through then, sorry I assumed one months notice.

I think that your suggested course of action would be the right thing to do now and you can see what they come back with.

If and when they do and you have any further questions, just come back to this thread.

[Mikef8619]

Hello, I contacted HR and they pretty much just ignored my question stating I signed the contract so the money would be deducted. So absolutely no help.

I sent the contract to a solicitor who stated:

"It seems from the document provided that a reducing percentage is required to be paid if you have not done sufficient shifts, but you are right, there is no reference to them"

So I am a bit at a loss of what to do. Can't tell you how much stress this is causing.

Thanks

[ULA]

I presume the solicitor offered not advice as to how to deal with the matter. I am wondering whether you can go back to your employer along the lines of:

Dear xxx

Further to my email/correspondence of xxxxx (date) I am disappointed to have not received any response. Having taken legal advice it is clear from the agreement that the repayment of the course fee on a reducing scale is only required in the event that sufficient shift are not completed. However the agreement you presented me with and asked me to sign does not indicate, as is required to be bound by the terms, the number of shifts I am required to complete. In order to try and resolve the position please can you provide me with the details of the number of shifts I am required to have worked in order for the reducing payments not be be applicable.

Many thanks
xxx

I am not saying this will provide the answer but it is worth a try.

[Mikef8619]

That's a brilliant letter, thank you very much. I will be sure to let you know the response.

Can I ask though, seeing as in their reply they ignore my question and stated they will be deducting the money, is it worth me mentioning something along the lines that If they do this I will be seeking to have this resolved through an employment tribunal?

Many thanks

Michael

[ULA]

By all means you can add that in at the end.

Please do come back and update us as to any response.

[Mikef8619]

Hi, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. They ended up taking the money out of my pay before I even got to send the email. I have gone to ACAS and used the letter below as my case however they are refusing to use early conciliation simply reiterating the same jargon that as previous.
I now the the prospect of going to employment tribunal... Would anyone happen to have any advice on this and my case..

Many thanks

Michael

£895 was deducted from my pay on 27th August to reimburse for training I had received in February 2020. I am aware there is a clause within my contract to do this however having taken legal advice it is clear from the contract that the repayment of the course fee on a reducing scale is only required in the event that sufficient shifts are not completed. However the contract my manager presented me with and asked me to sign does not indicate, as is required to be bound by the terms, the number of shifts I am required to complete.

I emailed **** requesting this information as adviced to do so from HR however this was ignored and instead I received confirmation of a deduction which I do not agree to.

Further to this within the contract it is stated reimburment is required as the course is transferable however to date I have not received any certificate or any confirmation whatsoever that I have indeed attended making it anything but transferable.

I was told by both **** and **** that the deduction would be made from my final salary in September however without in notice to me the deduction was made a month early in August and has left me in severe financial difficulty and resulted in my take home pay being below the national living wage.

I do not agree to any further deductions and request the £895 is reimbursed immediately. Once I receive clarity of the criteria of what repayments may be owed, I will discuss with you a repayment plan