Training cost fee

[meek95]

Hi,

I have been tied to a consulting company for a year now. When signing the contract I was promised a job in computer security which is rather difficult to get into without much expereicnce. I would like to start with saying that the money they pay the consultants is very low (23.5k year 1 and 25.5k year 2) but the fact they promised me a way into computer security justified the temporary low pay in my case. Unfortunately with the promise they also provided 3 month training which they estimated to be worth 12k. I passed the training which was extremely easy and seemed very rushed and in most cases unreleated or tought by people who seem to know less than me about the actual topics. Following the training a company tries to find a client for you to work for. It took them 3 months to find me a client which was completely unreleated to the training I was given, and completely unrelated to computer security which I was promised. When I received the offer I Was told I cannot refuse it unless I want to pay the training fee back so I accepted the contract with the client. My company told me I have to learn as much of a new programing language as I can within a month prior to my starting day at the client site, as mentioned before I was not trained in it at all.

When I arrived at the client site I quickly realised that the position itself is even worse than I expected and it was mostly support work but as I knew that if I left the job I would be reliable to pay the training fee I stuck with it and worked as much as I can to develop other skills. About a year in the client I work for went through a lot of financial issues and let go everyone from the consulting company I work for. Following that my company offered me a trainer role at the academy, where I got trained a year ago.. again totaly unrelated to what I was trained or promised. When refused and talked to my line manager about a pay rise as I did get a lot of apprisals and I was exceeding in every way, they told me it will be 25.5k in year 2 like everyone else.

I know I can get at least 10k+ if I get another job and based on what my company said they will never find me a job within the promised computer security field and I will more than likely have move again I am trying to avoid wasting another year with the company itself. When I mentioned that I would either want a job in promised field or have a substantial payrise equivelent to what I should be getting paid, so that I can afford to live to at least mediocre standards, they told me that they don't do computer security anymore and that I will be paid the same as everyone else and if I try to leave I will be subjected to paying 12k for the training fee.

Now few things I know: in our training there were 25 people, 6 of us managed to get a client and rest were let go, without paying the training fee. I know that the client I worked for now paid my company 70k+ for me yearly which seems a bit unfair compared to the amount we receive.

I already decided to leave the company regardless of whether I have to pay or not, as I said I am not willing to waste another year in a job that will not allow me to progress and pays so little.

Now knowing that if the company tries to make me pay the training fee back I will try to take it to court, as I feel like they treat all the consultants as money bags they can get a lot out of but we will get nothing in return. Also I don't know how lawful it is for them to expect me to pay the full training fee even though I worked for them and made them money a full year. Besides all of that, none of the training I received was in any way related to what I was doing for my client.

Is it lawful for the company to demand full training cost? Is it lawful for them to demand anything from me where they did not provide me with relevant training? Based on the fact that they offer me a trainer job I can assume that people that trained me were in similar position so the 12k they put on the contract seems unjustified, can I use that agains them in court if it gets to that point?

I apologise for such long post but I do not know how much information I require to put here and I would appreciate anyones help with the case and maybe some advice when it comes with dealing with it

[ULA]

In a nutshell you want to know whether you have to pay back the cost of the I2k training. Have you signed any of the following:

1. A contract of employment that contained a training cost clawback clause if you left within a stated period of time after the training was concluded?

2. An agreement prior to starting the training that if you left you would be required to pay back the cost of training?

If you did sign one of the above documents did it contain a sliding scale arrangement i.e. the amount you would have to pay back would reduce of the period of time due to the "recovered" benefit the company received because you undertook the training.

[meek95]

Hi Ula,

I did sign an agreement prior, but it did not state anything about sliding scale.
"If, having accepted employment under clauses 6a or 6b, your employment with us is terminated within a period of 2 years from the Employment Start Date you agree to pay to us a sum equivalent to the Training Cost."
It never states anything about paying less with time.

[ULA]

Based on what you have said then unfortunately you have agreed to repay the training costs if you leave within 2 years. Sliding scales are often in such clauses as most employers accept they have benefit of the training over time which offsets the training. So it may be worth having that discussion with you employer if you decide to leave within the two years.

[meek95]

So does it mean as long as you sign the agreement and then the employee doesn't deliver on any of their promises or quality of training I would still be liable to paying full training cost? In case that happens I'm assuming I can take it to court and let the judge decide?

[ULA]

You have signed an agreement to pay back the training costs so yes. Did you at the time or any time subsequently raise an issue in regard to the training that was provided, if not then you may have less of a case and you will need to provide all the documentary evidence to support a claim that the course was not to the quality described.

As already stated an argument of a sliding scale and that the employer has received 12 months benefit of the training that you have undertaken so you should not be required on that basis to pay the full cost back, would be one you can use. Such sliding scales are "normal" in the event training costs are to be recovered.

In the agreement to repay the training costs was their a right to deduct this from salary, in which case you may find if you leave the company within the two years that they will deduct as much as they can from your final salary and then request a payment plan for the remainder, unless the details in such an event are included as part of the agreement.*

[meek95]

Yes there was, a lot of us had issues with the quality of the training and the fact that the contents of the training kept changing from what we were told.
There was a statement in the agreement that they are allowed to deduct from salary.
I have received answer from the comany and amongst few things they say they mentioned this: "I've also instructed our HR/Payroll team to freeze any/all forthcoming salary payments for you".
I'm assuming that this is lawful but in case when I take them to court and they lose they will have to give all of it back?
They also mentioned this:
"We'll obviously need to have a conversation around your ability to pay the fee's within the expectant 30 days, "
no where in the contract it states that I have to pay it within 30 days. Quote from the contract:
"If, having accepted employment under clauses 6a or 6b, your employment with us is terminated within a period of 2 years from the Employment Start Date you agree to pay to us a sum equivalent to the Training Cost."
In case when they send me the invoice I will file a case against them, how should I go about doing that? Do you have any advice with finding a lawyer in this case as I believe that they do not deserve the training fee or at least not a full one.