Lowell's Solicitors, Letter Of Claim, 3 mobile

**R0b** · 10th July 2018, 14:55:PM

Hello Dispydave

First things first, we need to see the letter from Lowell even though it is probably a standard template letter, it is helpful to see what we are working with. Post up the letter with personal information redacted and we can go from there.

You are indeed correct that the legislation and rules have changed somewhat since the bank charges era and in particular, debts sought by a business against an individual are now subject to the Pre-Action Protocols for Debt Claims - this came into force in October 2017 so it is relatively new and is aimed and ensuring creditors supply as much information as possible prior to issuing a claim (whereas previously they used to frequently issue a claim and supply documentation).

Being such a high balance I am guessing a device was included in the contract should I also send the CCA or could I incorporate that into a CPR request?

it's likely to be the remaining monthly instalments left on the contract when the contract was terminated, any fees or other charges plus interest which they like to calculate at 8% per annum unless otherwise stated in the contract.

The CCA is probably not applicable unless it was a hire-purchase type contract and I don't recall Three ever offering consumer credit agreements so doing that is not likely to serve any purpose. Under the Debt PAP you have the right to request further documentation so there is really no need to send a request under CPR 31.14 at this point in time.

In addition to the above, I don't think the CPR request following the issue of the claim is not (in my view) a tactic and if Lowell were smart enough would have pointed to the Debt PAP saying you were afforded the opportunity to request documents at that stage but nonetheless they are pressing ahead with the claim, subject to any defence you might put in.

As for the notice of assignment, did you actually receive this or are they claiming in the letter that this was sent to you? If tactics were being played then you would want to plead your ignorance on that point and get Lowell to prove that it was (correctly) assigned to you. In the meantime you could also make a subject access request to Three under GDPR as these requests are now free of charge but you might want to get that in as soon as possible.

I have a template response to the Debt PAP letters such as these which might assist you in these circumstances and there is also a GDPR subject access request (long and short form) if you also wish to have a look for inspiration. You can find the templates on the link below, templates 3a, 3b and 4b.

http://legalbeagles.info/forums/foru...t-of-templates

Also going to tag jaguarsuk Amethyst for further input

**dipsydave** · 20th July 2018, 20:58:PM

Damn, just spotted timeframes are limited now I have had chance to sit in front of my computer and look at this properly! The pitfalls of marriage separation Doc's are ready for uploading. Just figuring out how to upload we speak. We cannot recall the account let alone receivng any assignment documents. We have a theory tho. An account disputed a number of years ago as the phone was faulty and was sent back within the 30 days and the contract was terminated. Nothing further was received or mentioned. However we believe that dispute was older than the dates of this alleged debted account

**dipsydave** · 20th July 2018, 21:35:PM

Think the wi fi on this train I'm on is blocking part of the site and the upload buttons aren't showing

**dipsydave** · 21st July 2018, 00:06:AM

Finally managed to get them uploaded.

**dipsydave** · 12th September 2018, 00:43:AM

since the original post we have moved address and Lowell reposted the original LBA at the new address with a new time limit. So, this is what I have come up with, merging your CPR letter on here with that formerly used by Penalty Charges Forum. It still needs a little tidying up before I finish but this is what I am looking at sending.

Thoughts please?

Originally posted by Dipsydave

I am writing to acknowledge receipt of your letter before action dated 10^th August 2018 and

setting out your client’s allegations made in connection with Three Mobile and more specifically, your client’s suggestion that I am liable for the balance owed of £617.91. In accordance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (the “Protocol”), I have enclosed the completed Reply Form.

You will note from the enclosed Reply Form that I deny any liability in relation to your

client’s allegations. I wish to make it clear beyond any reasonable doubt that I DO NOT RECOGNIZE ANY DEBT TO LOWELL FINANCIAL, LOWELL PORTFOLIO 1 OR THREE MOBILE

Without prejudice to the above denial, you have supplied me with no documentation or information relating to your client’s claim. I therefore require further information from your client (as per below) and without such, I am not in a position to provide a full response to the allegations made against me within the time limits set out in the Protocol.

Given that this matter is now subject to potential legal proceedings which you are threatening to initiate, you are obliged to provide (under the Civil Procedures Rules) information to ensure that all parties are on an equal footing, and also to ensure that the claim is dealt with expediently and fairly, avoiding an unnecessary burden to the court's resources.

Under the Pre-action Practice Directions - Protocols 4.6 of the Civil Procedures Rules - I request that you supply copies of the following documents:

Confirmation whether the account has been sold on as an equitable assignment or an absolute assignment, along with a copy of the deeds, proof of the purchase and the amount paid. Please note, denying said documentation under the basis of commercial sensitivity will not be accepted in this case.
A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened. Please note that a "true copy" as defined by the Consumer Credit Act will not be acceptable in this case, and a copy of the actual executed agreement, including signature, is required.
All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to, the following:-

1. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, payments and both the amounts of credit and any repayments made to the account.

2. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations

3. Where there has been any event in the account history that has required manual intervention by any person, disclosure of any indication or notes that have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to the account held by me with Welcome Finance or Cabot Financial is required.

4. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice sent to me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.

5. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account such as payment protection or shortfall extra policies, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).

6. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.

7. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.

8. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998.

9. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.

10. Copies of statements for the entire duration of the credit agreement, from inception up to the present date

Until your client has complied with my request for further information, I would therefore

suggest that any action your client is considering be deferred. Upon receipt of the said

information, I anticipate that a full response will be provided within 30 days (I refer you

to the Protocol under the heading What happens if I fill in and return the Reply Form in

time? at page 9 which explicitly states creditors should allow a further 30 days before

commencing legal proceedings). Please therefore confirm that your client will not to

take any further action until it has provided the necessary information and/or

documentation and until you are in receipt of my full response.

If, however, your client pursues its claim notwithstanding its failure to supply the further

information as requested, I reserve the right to draw this letter to the attention of the court and seek an adverse costs order as a result of non-compliance with the Protocol

as well as any other order the court deems appropriate.

Finally, I would like to add that pursuant to paragraph 3.3 of the Protocol, I request that all future correspondence be sent to the following address:

please ignore the spacing, the result of copying and pasting from 3 different word processor programs!

**R0b** · 12th September 2018, 07:11:AM

Looks fine generally but I would make the following observations:

... your client (as per below) and without such information, I am not in a position to provide ...

Amendment in red above.

Under the Pre-action Practice Directions - Protocols 4.6 of the Civil Procedures Rules - I request that you supply copies of the following documents:

You should not confuse the PAP for Debt Claims with the PDPAC because the letter before action is only governed by one or the other, not both. For debt claims involving a business (creditor) and an individual (debtor) the PAP for Debt Claims applies, not the PDPAC so the above statement needs to be removed. The PAP for Debt Claims is already defined in the letter as "the Protocol", and I think the wording I put in my template is sufficient for this but as its your claim, it is entirely up to you how you wish to word the letter.

**dipsydave** · 12th September 2018, 22:09:PM

thanks for spotting that. I knew it needed tidying up but I would have missed that detail

**dipsydave** · 17th October 2018, 13:44:PM

So, to get back to speed. Lowells sent the Letter of Claim to old address 1, having received no response they then sent another Letter of Claim to Old Address 2, This one we responded to with the above reply lletter sent recorded delivery and was received and signed for on Saturday 15th September.

Lowell filed for court on Monday 17 september. We filed for acknowledgement and intend to defend on 3rd October. We have since moved to a new property and this address was given within the court acknowledgement - This is crucial to note

They sent a letter in response to ours stating that the address they filed against was the one they had on record - as they had two addresses it is clear they filed on receipt of the letter - and stated that this was a contract of service, not a credit account, and no agreement signature was required, however they are seeking to obtain the documentation from the original creditor.

Moving house has obviously had a significant impact on the lead times here and I wish to file a defence that the particulars of claim are vague and defendant cannot offer a defence without the appropriate information, unfortunately the original POC has been lost in the move and I cannot access them online although I can file the defence.

so, what do I actually need to put in the defence?

**Amethyst** · 17th October 2018, 15:14:PM

So as well as asking for info from the letter before claim, you have asked Lowell for documents under the CCA ( which would be refused as a phone contract ) and under CPR 31.14 ? ( agreement, termination/default and notice of assignment) and they've provided nothing at all ?

An account disputed a number of years ago as the phone was faulty and was sent back within the 30 days and the contract was terminated.

Seems a likely candidate so you can include that in the defence as an 'if this is the account' issue.

I'll grab an example for you ...

**Amethyst** · 17th October 2018, 15:43:PM

VERY ROUGH EXAMPLE TO GET YOU STARTED.... ( also, send a SAR directly to Three Mobile )

DEFENCE

1.The Defendant received the claim [Claim Number] from the Northampton County Court Business Centre on [Date you received the claim] ( add in about the issues with address and second service etc)

2.Each and every allegation in the Claimants statement of case is denied unless specifically admitted in this Defence.

3.This claim is for an agreement regulated under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 between Three Mobile and the Defendant.

4: The Claimant has provided very little information with regards their claim or how the amount has arisen.

5: The Claimant has stated that the agreement was entered into on 26th March 2013. The Defendant disputes that he entered into a contract with Three Mobile on or around that date. The Claim is denied.

6: The Claimant has not provided any breakdown or details of how the sum claimed has been calculated or how it may have arisen. The Claimant is put to proof of how the sum claimed has arisen.

7:The Defendant has previously entered into an agreement with Three Mobile with regards a Mobile Phone airtime and data contract and provision of a handset. However the Defendant believes this was in 2011.

8. Due to the handset that arrived being faulty and subsequently being returned to Three Mobile, the agreement detailed in paragraph 7 was Terminated with no outstanding sums due shortly after entering into the agreement.

9. As this was over six years ago the Defendant doesn't retain any records relating to the agreement or cancellation thereof. The Defendant is uncertain whether the claim relates to that agreement without further details being provided.

10.Should the claim be based on the agreement outlined in paragraph 7 above the Defendant contends the alleged debt is statute barred by virtue of Section 5 of the Limitations Act 1980 in that no payment or acknowledgment has been made for over 6 years.

11: The Defendant has sent a Subject Access Request to Three Mobile in order to try and find out further information. He has not yet received a response from Three Mobile.

12. The Defendant has not heard anything from Three Mobile, or any third party regarding any debt owed to Three Mobile, since the termination/cancellation took place in 2011, until receipt of a Letter of Claim was received from the Claimant on xxx July 2018.

13. The Defendant request more information from the Claimant, being xxxxxxxxxxxxxx(what you asked for in the reply to the letter of claim )

14. The Claimant did not provide any information or any copies of documents to evidence or substantiate their claim.

15. Following receipt of the claim xxxxxx the Defendant wrote to the Claimant requesting xxxxxx pursuant to CPR 31.14.

16. The Claimant responded in a letter dated xxxxxxx in which they stated that this was a contract of service, not a credit account, and no agreement signature was required, however they are seeking to obtain the documentation from the original creditor. To date the Defendant has not received any further information or documents from the Claimant.

17.The Claimants statement of case states that the account was assigned from Three Mobile to Lowell on [Date]. The Defendant does not recall receiving notice of this assignment. The Claimant is put to proof that they have obtained the legal right to bring this claim.

18.It is denied that [Original Creditor] served any Default notice on the Defendant pursuant to s87 Consumer Credit Act 1974. The Claimant is required to prove that a compliant Default Notice was served upon the Defendant. The Claimant is required to prove that the any Default notice relied upon complied with the requirements of s88(4A) Consumer Credit Act 1974 and that the notice was in the prescribed form as required by The Consumer Credit Enforcement Default and Termination Notice Regulations 1983.

19.Under Civil Procedure Rule 16.5 (4) Where the claim includes a money claim, a defendant shall be taken to require that any allegation relating to the amount of money claimed be proved unless he expressly admits the allegation. Therefore, it is expected that the Claimant be required to prove the allegation that the money is owed as claimed.

20.It is denied that the Claimant is entitled to the relief as claimed or at all.

**dipsydave** · 17th October 2018, 16:48:PM

that is absolutely spot on! Beautiful!!!

Thank you very much! ;-)

**dipsydave** · 17th October 2018, 16:57:PM

as an off side however, with Lowells sending duplicate mail to different addresses and filing off the one address that responded without addressing the letter contents, would it be worth going down the vexatious litigants path? Im wondering if because they detect a sniff of me making a defence attempt they are pushing to make a claim in the hope I keel over

**Amethyst** · 17th October 2018, 17:27:PM

Basically, no. And yes of course they are making a claim hoping you'll be one of the 87% who are scared by sight of a court claim and either panic and ignore the claim or make a payment arrangement. That's the business model.

**dipsydave** · 17th October 2018, 17:49:PM

Didnt think so, want to keep this simple anyway. I had a similar case around 2 years ago with Welcome Finance. I put a PPI claim in and they registered the account as a default, sold it to cabot who then filed a court case the very same day they signed for a CPR18! Funnily enough once I filed the defence I received the standard "we will be in touch once we have the documentation" dismissal....

Lowell's Solicitors, Letter Of Claim, 3 mobile