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Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement received

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  • Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement received

    Hi all,

    My story so far-

    On 26 December 2015 I received a claim from NCC from Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Shoosmiths LLP for £6,882. I dutifully sent off a CCA and CRP requests. I received letters that Cabot & Shoosmiths were looking into my requests and that the matter was 'on hold'. I did not receive any further correspondence before my defence deadline so I entered a defence on the basis that I had not received any documents to either defend or admit the case. I received a confirmation from NCC of my entered defence but then never heard anything else and presumed the case had been stayed.

    A few months later, approx Feb 2016, I received a letter from Shoosmiths stating that they could not provide the documents requested in the CCA and that they now considered the case unenforceable. Great! Or so I thought.

    Yesterday I received a rather large package from Shoosmiths. It contained a response to my defence, a copy of the original credit agreement, a list of transactions and copies of two letters sent when the account originally went into default. Shoosmiths have requested we complete an Income and Expenditure form and return it in the next 14 days.

    Now what do I do?!? :tinysmile_hmm_t2:

    The last transaction on the account was 25/06/2010 (opened in May 2005), is it possible that the case is statue barred?

    The main points from Shoosmiths letter-

    '6. We have requested a copy of the Notice of Assignment from our client which will be forwarded to you upon recipt.
    7, As the value of the claim is £6,882 on allocation this claim will be allocated to the small claims track. Your request for disclosue pursuant to CPR 31.14 is, therefore, premature.
    8. We are instructed by our client that it has now provided a response to your request made pursuant to sections 77/78 Consumer Credit Act 1964'

    Any advice is incredibly gratefully received......
    Tags: None

  • #2
    Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

    What exactly have they sent you as part of the CCA request

    there should be
    The agreement including relevant terms and conditions
    AND
    A set of terms and conditions at default

    As the account is pre 2007 , the agreement has to be in a prescribed form with the prescribed terms

    Who was the account with?

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

      Originally posted by Linus View Post
      What exactly have they sent you as part of the CCA request

      there should be
      The agreement including relevant terms and conditions
      AND
      A set of terms and conditions at default

      As the account is pre 2007 , the agreement has to be in a prescribed form with the prescribed terms

      Who was the account with?
      Hi Linus,

      The original debt was with Capital One. They have sent me-
      -the original signed agreement but no terms and conditions, the agreement refers to T&Cs but there is no copy.
      -two letters notifying that the account had gone into default from 2010, neither of these have T&Cs attached.

      I'm guessing if I ask Shoosmiths/Cabot/Capital One for the T&C's they'll be able to reconstitute them fairly easily?

      Thanks for your help

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

        They do need to have both sets of terms and conditions so as they stand they are still in breach of your CCA request
        @diana M

        It might help if you can upload the documents with personal details taken off but dont actually mark the documents they have sent you.

        If you look in the terms and conditions library there are some terms and conditions from certain times but I'm not sure if they are correct

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

          Sorry I think that should be [MENTION=87380]Diana M[/MENTION]

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

            I had a quick look at the CCA I sent back in december 2015, I never asked for T&Cs, just the credit agreement, do they still need to have included them?

            I'll try and get the letters uploaded.

            Thanks

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

              Originally posted by Millsisintrouble View Post
              I had a quick look at the CCA I sent back in december 2015, I never asked for T&Cs, just the credit agreement, do they still need to have included them?

              I'll try and get the letters uploaded.

              Thanks
              They should send a copy of the agreement (an unsigned reconstituted copy is acceptable as long as it's accurate). the T&Cs at inception plus any subsequent variations, & a statement of the account.
              CAVEAT LECTOR

              This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

              You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
              Cohen, Herb


              There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
              gets his brain a-going.
              Phelps, C. C.


              "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
              The last words of John Sedgwick

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

                Originally posted by charitynjw View Post
                They should send a copy of the agreement (an unsigned reconstituted copy is acceptable as long as it's accurate). the T&Cs at inception plus any subsequent variations, & a statement of the account.
                Many thanks.

                I have received the signed agreement and statement of the account but no T&Cs or variations.

                What is the best course of action to take now?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

                  Originally posted by Millsisintrouble View Post
                  I'm guessing if I ask Shoosmiths/Cabot/Capital One for the T&C's they'll be able to reconstitute them fairly easily?
                  From what you say this claim has been stayed for about six months. If the Claimant wants to take things forward they will need to apply to the court to lift the stay.

                  It seems they've decided to put pressure on you as their first line of approach, hence the I & E Form for you to complete (don't).

                  They've admitted that they don't (yet) have the NOA. The Claimant has to prove that they are entitled to claim the debt. It seems they're not able to do that (yet).

                  The onus is on the Claimant to prove their case so don't give them a helping hand by telling them where they've gone wrong, although I suspect they probably know already but hope you don't. Nothing is gained by asking them to provide the Ts & Cs.

                  The Statute Barred clock stopped ticking the minute the claim was issued in December 2015 so alas the fact that your last payment may have been in June 2010 (over six years ago) it won't be a legal argument you can run with because they've pipped you to the post.

                  Any chance your last payment may have been earlier than that? What's the date of the Default - were those "two letters" a Default Notice and Termination Notice etc?

                  In answer to your question "Now what do I do?" I suggest you do absolutely nothing. The ball is in their court right now.

                  Di

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

                    Thanks for the advice Diana its a massive help.

                    The last payment in June 2010 could well have been earlier by a few months. The two letters are a Default Notice dated 17/09/2010 and a letter titled Statement of Default that details that the account has been terminated, dated 20/10/2010.

                    I won't respond to Shoosmiths letter, hopefully they never produce the NOA!

                    Thanks again

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

                      The CPR request was sent before allocation to Small Claims Track (which, if the claim is stayed at Northampton CCBC, has not yet occurred).
                      So they are not correct in stating that it was 'premature'.
                      CAVEAT LECTOR

                      This is only my opinion - "Opinions are made to be changed --or how is truth to be got at?" (Byron)

                      You and I do not see things as they are. We see things as we are.
                      Cohen, Herb


                      There is danger when a man throws his tongue into high gear before he
                      gets his brain a-going.
                      Phelps, C. C.


                      "They couldn't hit an elephant at this distance!"
                      The last words of John Sedgwick

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

                        Originally posted by charitynjw View Post
                        The CPR request was sent before allocation to Small Claims Track (which, if the claim is stayed at Northampton CCBC, has not yet occurred).
                        So they are not correct in stating that it was 'premature'.
                        Thanks Charity, that was my thinking too. Is it possible to ask the courts to allocate the case to the Fast Claims Track rather than Small Claims?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Cabot Financial (UK) Ltd / Capital One vs Millsisintrouble credit agreement recei

                          Originally posted by Millsisintrouble View Post
                          Is it possible to ask the courts to allocate the case to the Fast Claims Track rather than Small Claims?
                          Yes.

                          You can request a claim under £10k be allocated to the Fast Track for a number of reasons usually related to legal complexity.

                          But (and it's a big but) if you lose the claim (in FT) you will be liable for the other sides's costs. Not so in Small Claims Court unless either party has been unreasonable (conduct issues).

                          Di

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hi, apologies for resurrecting an old thread but I have received more correspondance from Shoosmiths regarding this debt, and I would deeply appreciate any help that could be provided.


                            On 13 December 2017 I received a response from Cabot to my CCA request. The package contained Statements, original application, default notice and lots of pages of T&Cs (its not immediately clear which document the T&Cs are for). I did not respond to this letter.

                            On 21 March 2018 I received a letter from Shoosmiths with a response to my defence (submitted in December 2015!) stating their intention to apply for a summary Judgment. This letter also contained Notice of Assignment, the orginal credit agreement and Default Notice.

                            The NOA is the one document until now that they couldn't produce.

                            What are my options now? Shoosmiths appear to be determined to pursue this case in the courts, would it better to complete the statement of earning and negotiate a repayment? I have to admit the threat of further court action is panicking me!

                            Any advice is massively appreciated.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Diana M

                              Comment

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