if i bring claim against my council - can i win? if i lose, what council can bill me?

[needhelp4]

my council did not its own follow code of conduct and took me to court for school absence. court found me guilty as parents have no statutory defence. so i have got criminal record now and fined £2000; and council billed me £3000.council's normal bills for these are £1100-£1500 and wrong rates applied to my bill. if i bring claim against council, is there any chance of me winning -my point is: council staff do not have right to act outside published code of conduct. if they had followed code of conduct then the case would not have reached court. council should refund me £5000. experts please advise me if i have any chance of win? if i lose then what max council costs i have to pay? many thanks

[des8]

Before initiating court action have you complained to the council, and if that failed there is the Local Government Ombudsman to try.
The LGO can award compensation and is free.

[needhelp4]

Many thanks DES8... i complained formally to council, wrote to senior officials, councillor... none did anything. Making excuse this is legal matter ... went to court so we cannlt investigate. I know about council ombudsman but i m v worried they may also say i can appeal to court about wrong bill hence ombudsman will not look at it. Next week i will apply to council ombudsman. Not v hopeful. I wonder why council is not bothered abiut complaint reaching ombudsman... i am hence exploring court option

[lgfa92]

It is the court's decision as to what level of costs are ultimately awarded however it was is far higher than similar cases I've come across (our local council typically asks for far lower costs.) but there could be good reason for this. The costs are a judicial decision on what is 'fair and reasonable'. You'd have to make an appeal to the High Court either as case stated or for judicial review of the magistrate's decision.

If you believed the conviction was wrong in the first place you do have a statutory right of appeal to the Crown Court for conviction to be re-heard.

[needhelp4]

Many thanks LGFA92...
i researched about appealing process. Point is that i am happy with the sentence and the fine and even the costs. Point is that bill has wrong unauthorised rates and excessive number of hours work although it was a straightforward court case - just like any other education 444(1) case wherein there is nothing to prove tp court by council. Neither parent disputes absence nor parent has any statutory defence. I obtained most recent 5 bills of my council for this law 444(1) cases. They range from £1100 to £1500 only. And rates r all sane in them and obly different in my bill.
Magistrate trusted the bill was right and awarded that as we r touchwood financially well off.
so my problem is wrong bill.
so appeal is not going to address that right?
And who knows what mood judge will have and i may end up with higher court costs due to added extra prosecution costs.

m i right it is outside this court case jursdiction to verify and analyse if bill is right? Will they listen to me? They just see if i can afford or not. I know i will be found guilty of offence as my child indeed was absent from school.

please try to believe me that there is a history to this case and exorbitant bill. This is a harassment campaign against me by school attendance council team and each time i conplained about them tp senior council stagf they kept increasing my bill. Even increased my bill retrospectively- upto first hearing bill was increased by 50% on the day of first hearing new bill handed to me. No extra work done and can be done by legal team for school absemce 444(1) case. Tens of hours of extra work has been added and £20.86 per hour of investigating officer was made £75 per hour by school attendance team of council.

That is why council is tight lipped about wrong rates, wrong bill and bullying and violation of code of conduct allegation by me. They say court matter. But it is council mistake and wrong doing matter.

why would school absence court case judge at all bother about correctness of bill!!!

i m so worried ombudsman may also shrug my complaint off as legal matter.

please help that - will small claims court case be wise if ombudsman does not investigate?? Case will be that if council had followed code of conduct then case would not have reached court. And rhey deliberately did not post 12 lettersabout penalty notice and then court case intention... only filed them. I would have paid and avoided court!!!! Their aim was to take me to court and they signed false witness statement which is prosecutable offence as per council rules. They slipped phase 1 to 5 to land court case straightaway. No meeting set with me or letter sent to me - deliberately. Council staff has been corrupt and resorted to wrongdoing and bullying - no fear of any consequences.

how much prosecution costs can i be slapped of i lose? I do not think council can claim they hired experts to defend themselves hence slap me with a huge bl again????

[lgfa92]

I think it very unlikely a civil case or ombudsmen would examine the costs as it was a judicial decision and there are specific routes for disputing it. That leaves you with appeal to a higher court unless, and it's a very long shot, the magistrates court might be able to reopen the case under s142 of the magistrates court act to reconsider their decision.

[needhelp4]

Many thanks LGFA92,

i am left with no faith in magistrates. I did tell magistrate that bill had FOI charges too, for example... but she did not listen to me.
***
am i right that i m not objecting to court decision. As court did not come up with £3100 figure. Court rightly awarded the bill council asked to be paid. I m saying bill was wrong.
***

so it is the figure on the bill which magistrates or judges do not have jurisdiction to analyse or verify in school absence court case?????

**

please can u share your thoughts y a small claims court case should refuse to look at the council bill to see it is wrong with wrong worked hours and hourly rates?
**

so what should i do? This is gross unfairness if except appealing about school absence sentence i have no other option left.

ombudsman should actually order council to correct bill irrespective of anything else. There r rules and regulations to be followed. Council staff is not entitled to ask just whatever a few number of staff members want.

if bill was of person A then i have no problem as they can charge me anything. But council is a public body and has duty of care

[needhelp4]

my council did not its own follow code of conduct and took me to court for school absence. court found me guilty as parents have no statutory defence. so i have got criminal record now and fined £2000; and council billed me £3000.council's normal bills for these are £1100-£1500 and wrong rates applied to my bill. if i bring claim against council, is there any chance of me winning -my point is: council staff do not have right to act outside published code of conduct. if they had followed code of conduct then the case would not have reached court. council should refund me £5000. experts please advise me if i have any chance of win? if i lose then what max council costs i have to pay? many thanks

logal government ombudsman has refused to investigate my complaint.

[needhelp4]

i was convicted on 30 july 2019. so 5 months ago. but i wasted not a single day. i gathered evidence via FOI and wrote to councillor and complained to council and on 11 november i complained to LGO. they all have refused to investigate saying it is court matter.

can someone please advise me what can i do via courts now.

1. should i request magistrate case to be re-opened under s142?

or

2. should i get decision reviewed by high court/appeal to high court/appeal to crown court?

-----------------------
1. i am most worried about council costs. can either of above cost me more in terms of council's costs?

2. if i appeal in one of the following ways, in which of the below options can i represent myself? i do not want to hire a solicitor.

i was convicted on 30 july 2019. so 5 months ago. but i wasted not a single day. i gathered evidence via FOI and wrote to councillor and complained to council and on 11 november i complained to LGO. they all have refused to investigate saying it is court matter.

can someone please advise me what can i do via courts now.

1. should i request magistrate case to be re-opened under s142?

or

2. should i get decision reviewed by high court/appeal to high court/appeal to crown court?

-----------------------
1. i am most worried about council costs. can either of above cost me more in terms of council's costs?

2. if i appeal in one of the following ways, in which of the below options can i represent myself? i do not want to hire a solicitor.

There are four mechanisms under which a*decision*of a*magistrates'*court*may be challenged:

1. reconsideration by the same*magistrates'*court;
2. appeal*to the Crown*Court;
3. appeal*to the High*Court*of Justice (Queen's Bench Division) by way of case stated; and.
4. judicial review in the High*Court*(Queen's Bench Division).

many thanks,

[lgfa92]

You are getting deep in to the realm where you need a solicitor to deal with it, attempting to do it yourself is simply going to cause you nothing but problems.

A s142 is very, very unlikely to considered after this time and you're out of time on a standard appeal to the crown court.

[needhelp4]

thanks*LGFA92. can you suggest any cheap solicitors or do i just have to go searching.

[lgfa92]

Call around some local solicitor and ask if they do this kind of work. You can usually get a free initial consultation.

[needhelp4]

hello, i phoned many solicitors and none offered free advice but casual chat briefly. one volunteer organisation did give me half hour free advice. but mainly i did not get any consistent or clear advice.

my options are:

1. judicial review - but it will be v expensive and difficult to win plus i do not think council did anything illegal
2. appealing the decision - i am out of time and due to above reason this is not an option for me.
3. file a new case of public law violation by local authority - i do not know if this is required. **can anyone please throw some light on this??? violating code of conduct when dealing with resident falls under this category??
4. **i want to take action against council. i want to go for 'small claim civil court case against council.
a solicitor refused to help me saying there has been judgement on my case already. but judgement was in criminal court for the school offence. i want to bring civil case for violation of code of conduct by council - done by them deliberately - and not treating me as per rules and causing me financial and other damages. i want to claim for compensation.
5. can u now please try to advise me that apart from bearing costs of council's court costs and administrative cost of applying to small claims court, what other risks i can face please?
6. this is civil matter against council's actions 'before' they applied for court case for school absence; and previous was criminal matter for school absence for my child - so is there anything to stop judge from accepting my civil court case?
7. i want to know how to fill court case form - which law is applied here?
8. council staff harassed me but should i mention this or not????
9. i now want to know what to mention in claims form to court and what not to mention??
10. can failure to follow council's published code of conduct be considered by judge to rule in my favour? i will say that if they had followed code of conduct then i would not have let case reach court.
11. really i am back to my own devices and i need your help - i am willing to work hard on this matter.


thanks a lot volunteers and i hope u all r keeping safe!!