JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

[Amethyst]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Like CPR 31.14, a Part 18 request isn't really used in small claims cases, but is still valid before allocation ( after defence when the court says if a claim is in fast or small claims track ) - presumably Di had something specific in mind related to the unfair relationship point on the overdraft ? A Part 18 request would go to the claimant ( or their solicitors) rather than the court.

So re the request for a part 18 template, there are particulars bits need including but they are quite straightforward - it needs to be QUESTIONS not requests for documents, so wording depends on what you are asking for ??

This is an example anyway if it's helpful;

In the Northampton County Court Business Centre
Claim No: [XXXXX]

[Claimants Name]
Claimant
And

[Defendants Name]
Defendant


PART 18 REQUEST FOR FURTHER INFORMATION DATED xxth XXXX 2017

TO: xxxxxxclaimantxxx

You are requested to provide the following clarification or information under CPR Part 18 and the Part 18 Practice Direction by xxth xxxxxx 2017


1: QUESTION
2: QUESTION
3: QUESTION


TAKE NOTICE THAT YOU ARE REQUIRED TO ANSWER THE ABOVE REQUEST WITHIN 14 DAYS OF SERVICE OF THE SAME UPON YOU AND IN ANY EVENT BY 4pm ON xxth xxxxxx 2017

A Statement of truth is to be completed by the Responding Party when responding to this request.

Please Reply to:
xxxxxx address xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Signed: You
Position: Defendant
Date: xxxxxxxxxxxx

You've already got a SAR sent in ( which will clarify your position on charges ) and your CPR 31.14 request for documents.

I believe some of the firms will assist with a case on a CFA ( they get their costs from the claimant) however as this is in small claims track that option may be limited - Just make sure you know what costs would be and any consequences costs wise if the case went on to lose. Some also charge a fixed price for doing a defence etc ( something in the realms of £250 I gather).

Re Mediation for small claims - it's offered at Directions questionnaire stage ( so after you file your defence) and is basically a three way phone call with the claimant and a mediator.... If you are considering mediation, just based on your priority of not having a CCJ., and their case seems a bit stronger at that point, then you can use the mediation to agree terms of payment under what's called a Tomlin ( or consent order ) which basically keeps the claim on hold in court while you make agreed payments. Keeps the CCJ away, but if you did ever miss a payment or get behind they'd be able to go back to the court for the CCJ at that point. So any agreement has to be fully affordable long term.

And of course you have the option of making payment after judgment within 28 days or just negotiating a settlement with out prejudice at any point.

So there's options if you investigate and don't think you have a strong enough defence to see the buggers off xxx

[Amethyst]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Hi

As for the consent or Tomlin order - it is part of the process and agreed top when you fill out your DQ. It saves the courts time and costs and is a guaranteed way of the claimant getting paid with the option of getting a ccj if you miss a payment and for you it is a way of settling without getting a ccj so if your defence looks dodgy it may be a win win.

I'm not sure that a consent/Tomlin order could really be deemed as part of the process when you fill out DQ. It is an outside court negotiation between claimant and defendant at pretty much any point during the claim process.

[Amethyst]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

You've already sent your CPR 31.14 request for the copies of documents.

I think maybe the Part 18 is meant for the questions you were asking in your SAR ( as the SAR is just for the data held rather than to answer specific questions )

· When did you default the mentioned account number?
· When was the account closed?
· When did you request the account be paid in full?
· When did you withdraw the overdraft facility?

It would have to be worded slightly differently as the Part 18 goes to the claimant so more ''When did Halifax withdraw the overdraft facility and for what reason ?''

[warwick65]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

I'm not sure that a consent/Tomlin order could really be deemed as part of the process when you fill out DQ. It is an outside court negotiation between claimant and defendant at pretty much any point during the claim process.

But this is the stage when you say if you are open to mediation and willing to participate

[pt2537]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Hi
You asked about how much a solicitor costs , well I am not sure but the initial consultation is free.
.

Thats right, initial consultations are free, but there are many many options such as damages based agreement, no win no fee, no win lower fee,and one that many overlook which is BTE insurance, many have home or car insurance with legal cover yet never claim on it!!

[pt2537]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

But this is the stage when you say if you are open to mediation and willing to participate

With the way the Courts are leaning towards alternate dispute resolution, mediation and other forms of ADR are always worth thinking about.

Mediation is never about who is right and who is wrong, its about taking an opportunity to try and resolve the dispute without incurring what could be many thousands of pounds of costs

https://www.burges-salmon.com/news-a...-has-no-merit/

[Diana M]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

I believe some of the firms will assist with a case on a CFA ( they get their costs from the claimant) however as this is in small claims track that option may be limited - Just make sure you know what costs would be and any consequences costs wise if the case went on to lose.

I would add that Defendants should be aware that some (not all) firms charge a "Success Fee" even if you are on a CFA (No Win No Fee).

This means that even if you win (so don't have to pay the sum claimed) you still have to pay your solicitors a fee even though they've recovered their legal costs from the losing party.

This "Success Fee" is sometimes expressed as a percentage of what you've 'won' which I find odd when you've haven't actually won anything unlike a damages claim or PPI reclaim etc.

People who receive claims for a debt often have ongoing financial problems so finding the money to pay a "Success Fee" to their own lawyer can be difficult.

Always check the small print to see if the "Success Fee" is buried in the CFA and/or ask that specific question upfront!

Di

[pt2537]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

I would add that Defendants should be aware that some (not all) firms charge a "Success Fee" even if you are on a CFA (No Win No Fee).

This means that even if you win (so don't have to pay the sum claimed) you still have to pay your solicitors a fee even though they've recovered their legal costs from the losing party.

This "Success Fee" is sometimes expressed as a percentage of what you've 'won' which I find odd when you've haven't actually won anything unlike a damages claim or PPI reclaim etc.

People who receive claims for a debt often have ongoing financial problems so finding the money to pay a "Success Fee" to their own lawyer can be difficult.

Always check the small print to see if the "Success Fee" is buried in the CFA and/or ask that specific question upfront!

Di

In our CFA, we highlight in bold, underline, and change the size of text to 18 to highlight the success fee when one is payable. CFAs often come with an uplift, but it is always open to negotiation and always review-able, especially if there are no damages paid by the otherside. Personally if the case has merits then a zero uplift isnt a problem

[JustWhatINeed]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Thanks for the further posts , i'll explain more of what i'm currently thinking in a few hours.

With regards to the part 18, would i send this to arrow global then or the solicitors or send to both?

Thanks.

Also i think i made a mistake on the sar i asked for specifics and didnt mention charges lol. Can i send another sar? or is there a limit to how many you can ask for ?

I know the original overdraft was 2100 and they inflated it to over 2600£. There's bank charges in there somewhere, not sure if the charges being within the 2100 or above the 2100 makes any difference? But i guess this is a line i can use with regards to maybe settling? Although when i did speak to them months ago i mentioned that some of this is charges and shoosmitsh were not interested in that.

[JustWhatINeed]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

sorry i read above it goes to the claimant thanks again.

[warwick65]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Hi
On the claim form, who does it say to serve documents on- that is where the part 18 requests go - usually the solicitors

[JustWhatINeed]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Damn, yes it says address for sending documents is Shoosmitshs not the claimant. Ok. i'll send to shoosmiths first thing in the morning.

Should i give them 7 days to reply ? so put reply expected by 7th of october?

If they do not reply with evidence that this debt is not statute barred, is that a good indication that they do not hold the evidence to prove their claims?

I was doing some maths the other day, i'm feeling 50/50 about whether it's barred now to be honest. I recall leaving my job a little before the royal wedding in april 2011. I would imagine (if i was still using the halifax to take wages) that maybe the last payment went in say during may, maybe the 22nd of may.

Let's assume the 25th of may, that's a little over three months to Aug. One thinks naturally i'd have received a demand to pay in full before that date.

It's a worrier this one.

If the default date was 31 of Aug, wouldn't the request to pay the overdraft in full have come before that date?

[JustWhatINeed]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Is this ok?


TO: ARROW GLOBAL LIMITED

You are requested to provide the following clarification or information under CPR Part 18 and the Part 18 Practice Direction by the 7th October 2017


1: When did Halifax bank of Scotland PLC default the account number mentioned in your court claims particulars of claim? (account number )
2: When was the bank account held with Halifax, mentioned in your court claim, officially closed?
3: What reason did the Halifax have for withdrawing the overdraft facility?
4. When did Halifax bank of Scotland plc request the overdraft mentioned in your particulars of claim be paid in full?
5. Exactly how much of the Halifax overdraft mentioned in your particulars of claim is made up of bank charges of which have been deemed unfair in law already?

TAKE NOTICE THAT YOU ARE REQUIRED TO ANSWER THE ABOVE REQUEST WITHIN 14 DAYS OF SERVICE OF THE SAME UPON YOU AND IN ANY EVENT BY 4pm ON 7th October 2017.

A Statement of truth is to be completed by the Responding Party when responding to this request. I request that this be signed by someone who represents Arrow Global Limited and not a Shoosmiths LLP Solicitor.

[JustWhatINeed]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

What is my next step after part 18 , wait to see if the cpr 14 gets any sort of response? I'm expecting it to contain nothing useful.

I'm sort of leaning towards maybe mediation although i did read if they don't give me anything substantial i can apply to have this thrown out?

[warwick65]

Re: JustWhatINeed Vs Arrow Global / Shoosmiths

Hi
This is the problem for current accounts, they can trundle on for some time before they are terminated- often for a very long time

I do know that HBOS around 2007 time did send default notices for current accounts rather than formal demands