Court Summons

[Andy Thomas]

Dear Team,

Please can anyone give me some guidance and assistance with this matter, relating to a parking fine as follows:

My wife took her elderly disabled mother to her bank HSBC in Bramhall, and parked outside the branch, which was on land managed by CEL. She did not purchase a ticket from the machine, as she did not think she was liable, as she is a disabled blue badge holder.

The large sign that was on the wall next to the machine had been taken down, I have pictures of where it had been previously displayed, and the only sign across the road was approx 25 meters away. My wife has to assist her mother, as she could not leave her unaided.

Some weeks later she received a fine through from CEL, for not displaying a ticket. and I have written back to the company requesting them to cancel the ticket, and we have not had a reply. They also somehow managed to find my wife's mobile no, and were sending her text demands for the payment.

After several months we have now received a court summons, to which I have to defend the case, and I am not quite sure how to go about this, can anyone assist please?

It seems very unfair that someone who is disabled is being treated this way, and that CEL are quite dogmatic in pursing the fine.

Many thanks

[Kati]

Re: Court Summons

tagging [MENTION=5553]charitynjw[/MENTION]??

[charitynjw]

Re: Court Summons

Hi Andy Thomas, welcome to LB. (& good afternoon, [MENTION=49370]Kati[/MENTION] )

Firstly, you'll need to acknowledge that court claim within 19 days of the issue date.
For now, defend in full.
Tick yes for mediation.
Do not contest jurisdiction.
Do not put any dialogue at all in the 'defence' section.

Do you have any pictures of the current site signage?
Do you have that Notice to Keeper?
Could you post them up? (Obscuring your personal details but leaving all dates visible).
I'm guessing there wasn't a windscreen ticket issued, but could you confirm?
Do you have any idea when the change from the previous parking scheme took place?

[Kati]

Re: Court Summons

Do you have any pictures of the current site signage?
Do you have that Notice to Keeper?
Could you post them up? (Obscuring your personal details but leaving all dates visible).

or email them to me with a link to this thread (he ALWAYS seems to forget that lol ) xx

[Andy Thomas]

Re: Court Summons

Hi Kati,

Many thanks for replying to my message.
From your transcript, the details to date are:

Firstly, you'll need to acknowledge that court claim - Done this within 14 days on-line.
For now, defend in full. -Have marked as defend in full
Tick yes for mediation. - not sure about this point
Do not contest jurisdiction. - Not contested
Do not put any dialogue at all in the 'defence' section. - No dialogue put in.

Do you have any pictures of the current site signage? - Yes, I will e-mail over
Do you have that Notice to Keeper? Is this the original PCN, if so yes, and can e-mail
Could you post them up? (Obscuring your personal details but leaving all dates visible).
I'm guessing there wasn't a windscreen ticket issued, but could you confirm? - No ticket issued, just camera entering area and leaving.
Do you have any idea when the change from the previous parking scheme took place? - Really not sure, as we were not aware blue badge holders were not exempt.
Thanks again, Andy

CAVEAT LECTOR

[Andy Thomas]

Re: Court Summons

Kati,

Please could you have a look at the details on the e-mail, I would appreciate your advice.

I believe I have until Thursday to file a defence, and not sure if it can be done on line. The e-mail will come from baronfleet.

Many thanks again
Kind regards,
Andy Thomas

[Kati]

Re: Court Summons

here ya go [MENTION=5553]charitynjw[/MENTION]

[charitynjw]

Re: Court Summons



What is on that large sign on the white & grey post?
The NtK is out of time for PoFA, but you appear to have ID'd the driver in your 14/11/2016 email?

[Andy Thomas]

Re: Court Summons

Hi Kati,

Thanks for the e-mail back, not sure what is on the post opposite. the last time I looked the sign was on the same side as the post you point out but about 4 cars down.

Also not sure what you mean by the notice being out of time for Pofa, and Id'd the keeper? Do you think this may not be resolvable?

Thanks again for your time.

KR, Andy

[charitynjw]

Re: Court Summons

Hi Kati,

Thanks for the e-mail back, not sure what is on the post opposite. the last time I looked the sign was on the same side as the post you point out but about 4 cars down.
The signage forms the basis of the alleged contract.
The parking company are (probably) claiming that there was a breach of that contract by the driver.
Hence it is important to know what the 'contract' terms were at the time.

Also not sure what you mean by the notice being out of time for Pofa, and Id'd the keeper? Do you think this may not be resolvable?
The contract is with the driver.
In England/Wales, liability can be transferred to the registered keeper via Schedule 4 Protection of Freedoms Act 2012. (PoFA)
But PoFA is very strict, & if the driver at the time is identifiable, the parking co can avoid PoFA & go after the driver via contract law.

Thanks again for your time.

KR, Andy

####

[Kati]

Re: Court Summons

[MENTION=5553]charitynjw[/MENTION] ... more pics xx

[charitynjw]

Re: Court Summons

Would the sign opposite the pizza joint be relevant?

[Andy Thomas]

Re: Court Summons

Hi Kati,,

It may, although my wife was not in a position to leave her mother unattended. This whole issue seems to be unfair, considering we have a disabled person to move around.

Please let me know, and again, thanks for your advice.

KR, Andy

[charitynjw]

Re: Court Summons

Have you contacted the bank to see if they could intercede, given the circumstances?

The site signage is important.
The wording forms the basis of the alleged contract with the driver.

[ostell]

Re: Court Summons

The sign at the entrance is too high to be readily noticeable by a driver entering from the left. It is too far to the right of the entrance.
What are the other conditions in the car park, where are the signs giving the conditions?

Yes, contact the bank certainly.

You will be querying the contract they have to charge customers.