Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

[Montesoro]

Received a claim? Yes
Issue Date: 06/06/2017
Amount approx: £1920
Claimant: Arrow Global Limited
Solicitor: Drydens Limited
Original Creditor: MBNA
Particulars of Claim: Please type out in full excluding names/account numbers
1. The claim is for the sum of £1920 in respect of monies owing by the defendant on a credit agreement held by the defendant with MBNA under account number xxxxxxxxxxxx upon which the defendant failed to maintain payments.
2. A default notice was served upon the defendant and not complied with.
3. The balance owed was assigned from Britannica Recoveries S.O.r.l - Mortlake to the claimant, and the defendant has been notified of the assignment by letter.
Is the debt Statute Barred? Probably not (see below)
List any letters you have sent: None

Any Other Info:

Hi everyone,

To (try and) cut a long story short, for various life reasons (losing job, etc) I ran up several credit card bills which I couldn't afford to pay back, defaulted on them all and paid a token of £1 a month for a while but stopped this as it made no difference to the amount of phone calls and letters I received.

This was back in 2011 so from now to up to 6 months from now all of the debts will be statute barred, it is possible that this one is, but more likely it is a few months away from the 6 year cut off. I opened a new bank account which I started using from Sept 2011 that has no payments (£1 or otherwise) to any of the cards, I can't be 100% sure if I made any from other bank accounts but it is unlikely, and around this time the other accounts were so overdrawn they were no longer used. (So September could be the cut off).

I am still not in a position to repay the debt, and after speaking with the Citizens Advice Bureau they have advised me to agree with the claim and offer to pay £1 a month back.

Is it worth me trying to defend on the basis that 'I think' it is Statute barred, and hoping that the Claimant will not be able to prove that the debt is NOT statute barred?
If I defend and lose will that add a lot of extra cost on to what they say I owe?

I no longer have any paperwork or access to the older bank accounts, due to several house moves, and if I am honest burying my head in the sand and hoping it would go away, which I thought it had until now.

Any advice greatly appreciated, I have held off from sending the letters in case you think I am better off just admitting the debt and paying the token payments.

Thanks,

Montesoro

[EXC]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Bumping for [MENTION=87380]Diana M[/MENTION] [MENTION=6]Amethyst[/MENTION]

[Amethyst]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

As you're coming up on 6 years since you stopped your token payment you may well get a small influx of claims before the time runs out. Hopefully not but best to be prepared.

Poo to the CAB ( sorry CAB ) you may as well stick up for yourself a bit before rolling over and committing to a CCJ for 6 years and £1 payment for ever and a day.

So this is an old MBNA credit card ? I would follow the first steps - http://legalbeagles.info/forums/show...it-Court-Claim - get the claim acknowledged with intent to defend in full, and send off a couple of letters to ensure the claimant has the right ( and ability ) to bring the claim against you. Then go from there, play it by ear, you can always fall back to the CAB position further down the line.

They will need to show the debt was assigned from MBNA to Britannica Recoveries S.O.r.l - Mortlake and then to Arrow Global.

Did you ever have any contact with Britannica as far as you recall ?

Stat barring - you can stick it in your defence as back up as the onus of proof is on them, but if it came to a hearing / WS's you would have to disclose you were in a DMP and when that ended.... althoughhhhhhhh - any chance you can get hold of your last few statements from the DMP provider to show when the last payment was made? Worth investigating more anyway.

Do the First Steps bit first - once thats done we can ramble about the intricacies

[Montesoro]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Poo to the CAB ( sorry CAB ) you may as well stick up for yourself a bit before rolling over and committing to a CCJ for 6 years and £1 payment for ever and a day.

Firstly, thanks a lot for the reply! I am glad to hear this as that was my thought too I was just concerned about losing and the costs being potentially increased.

So this is an old MBNA credit card ?

Yes, although I am not sure which brand.

They will need to show the debt was assigned from MBNA to Britannica Recoveries S.O.r.l - Mortlake and then to Arrow Global.

Did you ever have any contact with Britannica as far as you recall ?

I am not 100% sure but I think my only contact was directly with the original creditors. I have received tons of letters with debts being passed around from various debt chasers over the years.

Stat barring - you can stick it in your defence as back up as the onus of proof is on them, but if it came to a hearing / WS's you would have to disclose you were in a DMP and when that ended.... althoughhhhhhhh - any chance you can get hold of your last few statements from the DMP provider to show when the last payment was made? Worth investigating more anyway.

I guess DMP = debt management provider? I wasn't in any formal agreement at the time. I spoke to a debt charity of some sort and on their advice sent a letter to all my creditors informing them of my situation and making token payments of £1 for a short time but that was it. At the time I had three bank accounts, two that had an overdraft that went over the limit due to charges, and an "unused" account that I switched to and which I still use now. This has no payments to any of the creditors, and I started using it from Sept 2011. I can't remember if I used one of the other accounts to pay £1 from. Not sure if there is any way to get hold of statements from the old bank accounts? They are both defaulted on my credit report with outstanding balances of £250 and £3000. (Incidentally this MBNA card doesn't appear anywhere on my credit report on any site I have used).


Sorry some of the details are a bit sketchy, it was quite a bad time in my life and things were all over the place at the time.


Anyway...I have gone through the first steps and acknowledged the claim with no issues and typed up both the letters to send tomorrow.


I just have a few silly questions:

• On the CPR letter, should I just leave it as:

1. Agreement
2. Default Notice
3. Assignment

Or do I need to specifically mention the assignment to Britannica?

• The bit in red at the bottom of the CPR letter: For your information and records I enclose a copy of the formal request for a copy of the credit agreement relating to this claim, pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act 1974, which has been posted to your client with the statutory fee of £1 today,

I assume that is to be kept in as I am sending the CCA letter as well?

• The issue date of the claim is 06/06/17 so I understand that my defence needs to be filed by 10^th July at the latest, is that correct? (35 days). Can I make it a bit earlier on the letter if I want to? E.g. 6^th July. As I am busy over 7th-10^th!!

Thank you for your help

[warwick65]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Hi
Your defence is due 33 days from the date on the claim form providing you have acknowledged

A couple of points
In you CPR31.14 letter ask for the agreement , default notice, notice of assignment and Deed of assignment

BUT when you get to the defence they need to provide the Notice and Deed of assignment from MBNA to Britanica and then from Britanicca to Arrow Global

I would also send a SAR to MBNA - it will cost £10 but will be worth it

If it is any help I had an MBNA card that went from MBNA to Britannica and they kept chasing me even though they could not comply with my CCA request ( all they had was a signature box) but after it was sold to AG I have not heard from them sine 2013 after I queried the validity of the CCA


Remember the CCA letter goes to Arrow Global ( who will come back with some guff as to how they are not the creditor but don't let that worry you- if they aren't the creditor they can not bring a claim, or so I believe)

The CPR 31.14 goes to the solicitors so yes leave the bit in about the copy ( again, they are not very good at reading letters so may come back asking for the fee of £1 - that can be safely ignored )

Send the letters by Royal Mail Signed for and keep copies of letters and receipts from the post office. I always print off the proof of deleivery from the RM website as well - I have a whole filing cabinet and 10GB in google drive of files amd letters I have sent and received

[warwick65]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

If you want old statements from bank accounts , they will charge you per statement BUT if you send a SAR asking for everything, this should include all statements and costs £10

Just out of interest, did you get letters from ARDEN debt recovery in Solihull ( who in my experience must have employed the most illeterate and stupid people on gods earth) and then from another bunch of idiots in Stockport

It might be relevant that Britannica did not have a consumer credit licence in the UK and were based in Luxembourg , hence they had to use debt collectors in the UK

[Montesoro]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Thanks for all of this! I have amended my letter to ask for:

1. Agreement
2. Default Notice
3. Notice of Assignment
4. Deed of Assignment
   

I have definitely received letters from Arden but can't be sure it related to this debt.

I will send the SAR letter to MBNA as well and see what they come back with then.

Regarding the defence due date, presumably I can file it before the 33 days is up if I want/need to?

[EXC]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Regarding the defence due date, presumably I can file it before the 33 days is up if I want/need to?

Yes that's when it's due by, not on.

[warwick65]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Thanks for all of this! I have amended my letter to ask for:

1. Agreement
2. Default Notice
3. Notice of Assignment
4. Deed of Assignment
   

I have definitely received letters from Arden but can't be sure it related to this debt.

I will send the SAR letter to MBNA as well and see what they come back with then.

Regarding the defence due date, presumably I can file it before the 33 days is up if I want/need to?

It is generally recommended that you leave the filing of your defence to the latest possible date just in case the claimant produces any documents at the last minute.

Remember it can be filed online via MCOL although if, say you were out of the country on the due date I would file it before you go as I am not sure if you can get onto MCOL when abroad.

9th July is a Sunday so you have until 4pm 10th I think

[Montesoro]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

The trouble is I am away for the weekend (in the UK) but can't guarantee I will be back in time to submit the defence so was thinking of doing it on the Friday morning (7th July) before I leave.

I have sent off the CCA and CPR letters this afternoon, so just the SAR letter to send and then wait for a while.


The postal order has "For Statutory Purposes" as the payee but now I am wondering is that incorrect? Should it have had Arrow Global as the payee and "For Statutory Purposes" written somewhere else?!

[charitynjw]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

The trouble is I am away for the weekend (in the UK) but can't guarantee I will be back in time to submit the defence so was thinking of doing it on the Friday morning (7th July) before I leave.
No problem.

I have sent off the CCA and CPR letters this afternoon, so just the SAR letter to send and then wait for a while.


The postal order has "For Statutory Purposes" as the payee but now I am wondering is that incorrect? Should it have had Arrow Global as the payee and "For Statutory Purposes" written somewhere else?!
Yes, Arrow as payee on the CCA, MBNA on the SAR. 'For statutory purposes only' across the top.

####

[Montesoro]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Yes, Arrow as payee on the CCA, MBNA on the SAR. 'For statutory purposes only' across the top.

Gah! Any idea what will happen about me sending it incorrectly?! Presumably they won't be able to cash it?

[warwick65]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Hi

For the sake of a little over £1 I would resend the CCA request to AG with a new cheque or postal order made out to AG. I always include the number of the cheque or postal order in my CCA requests, I also take scans of the letters and postal orders.

Personally I do feel the 'for statutory purposes only' is something of a red herring, it may have been useful in the dark ages when banks returned paid cheques to the customer for their records but now, once cashed they will never see the light of day again. If it makes you feel better though there is no harm in adding it.

In this type of thing it is all about being able to evidence a letter and payment was sent and received so anything you can keep will help

[charitynjw]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

Quite honestly I would send another one just in case.

[warwick65]

Re: Arrow Global Limited V Montesoro

As per my post above, it is quite possible they will play silly buggers with you and say you haven't sent the payment , of course if they can not cash it they would be correct. Therefore I would resend

Gah! Any idea what will happen about me sending it incorrectly?! Presumably they won't be able to cash it?