Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

[Fruitbat]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Many thanks indeed M1.

You are a true star.

Example 1 of https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pr...d_part06a#10.1 says that "Where the document is posted (by first class post) on a Monday (a business day), the day of deemed service is the following Wednesday (a business day)."

The statement is due by 4 May (Thursday). It's probably too large to email so am I right in thinking I need to post it by first class tomorrow?

Many thanks
F

[Fruitbat]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Hi M1 and Ostell,

Just putting together my skeleton argument.

I've noticed that PCM have included as part of their evidence a form authorising them to act that has been signed by a "managing agent" rather than the freeholder or leaseholder.

They say in their text "VCS v HM Revenue & Customs (2013) andParking Eye v Beavis (CA 2015) made it clear that a contracting party need not show they have aright to do what they have promised in the performance of a contract, nor is (in the case of aparking operator) the agreement between Operator and Landowner of any relevance."

Does this have any significance in your opinions?

Many thanks
F

[charitynjw]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Links to Beavis & VCS v HMRC

http://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKSC/2015/67.html
http://www.bailii.org/cgi-bin/format...+AND+(CUSTOMS)

I can't see anywhere in either where it categorically states that they are not under any obligation to produce a contract (or contracts) which grant them authority.

In VCS, at 22, Lord Justice Lewison distinguishes between the making of a contract, & having the power to perform it.

According to the IPC Code of Practice (Oct 2016)

PART B
Operational Requirements Applicable to All Operators
1. Establishing Yourself as the ‘Creditor’.
1.1 If you operate parking management activities on land which is not owned by you, you must supply us with written authority from the land owner sufficient to establish you as the ‘Creditor’ within the meaning of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 (where applicable) and in any event to establish you as a person who is able to recover parking charges. There is no prescribed form for such agreement and it need not necessarily be as part of a contract but it must include the express ability for an operator to recover parking charges on the landowner’s behalf or provide sufficient right to occupy the land in question so that charges can be recovered by the operator directly. This applies whether or not you intend to use the keeper liability provisions.

https://theipc.info/uploads/vjnl0XFp...01.10.2016.pdf

[mystery1]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Yep point out it is against the code of practice and not what was said by the courts. There were contracts in these cases.

M1

[Fruitbat]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Thanks charity and M1.

Seems like so much information the judges have to read and get familiar with before each hearing... Will I need to give the other side my skeleton as well or is it just for the judge?

If I do need to quote case law anywhere can I bring up a case that I haven't mentioned in the defence or WS? E.g. I mentioned in my defence that it's a penalty but only referred to Beavis and haven't mentioned any other cases that seem like they might be useful e.g. Jopson v Homeguard.

F

[mystery1]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

If you give it to the judge the other side needs a copy.

You can try, and if it's in reference to a point made you'll probably be ok. If you are trying to make a completely new point then you could struggle (bearing in mind Gladrags don't follow the rules that might not be a bad thing to get a stickler for the rules as a judge !)

M1

[Fruitbat]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Hi guys (and girls),

In your experience is it better to have a written skeleton or oral argument? I have a few nice points and I wouldn't want to give the game away too easily...

Also, in my skeleton should I be rebutting the few legal points that PCM has made in their witness statement?

BW
F

[RR113]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Hi Fruitbat,

Being in a similar situation I just wanted to find out how you got on with your defence?

[Fruitbat]

Re: Parking Control Management UK Gladstones Court Claim

Hi RR - sorry for delay.

Actually after all of the effort I decided to settle. Essentially my view was that if I lost at court then I would technically have received a CCJ (regardless of whether I was able to pay it off within 28 days and regardless of whether it was actually registered), and then I'd technically have to answer yes if anyone asked me about it in the future.

So I lost a reasonable amount of money over what is still evidently a morally corrupt practice. But the skills and experience I gained from reading and practicing legal drafting was absolutely invaluable and I wouldn't trade it.

BW
F