Charging Orders

[Amethyst]

Re: Charging Orders

A caution can be placed without the courts or your knowledge. They have to satisfy the Land registrar of their entitlement to a stake in your property and i think the papers have to be witnessed and signed by a commisioner of oaths type person. If your home is reposessed the cautioner is not entitled to any notification but of course it can prohibit a sale and if sold then they will be notified and allowed to dispute the sale. You can fight against cautions and will have a look into it. Since 2003 cautions can't be put on already regsitered property but ones placed before then are still valid.

Who is the creditor and what/how much is the debt for? Are you considering selling the property at the moment?

[upndown]

Re: Charging Orders

The caution was placed by an unsecured creditor in 2002, because I owed him a debt.

Will the land registry have a copy or evidence that this unsecured creditor showed them proving that he was entitled to place this caution on my house? How could I find out please?

thanks for your advice above

[Amethyst]

Re: Charging Orders

Simplest way would be the call the LandRegistry and ask them. Land Registry - Land Registry

[righty]

Re: Charging Orders

I agree Ame however the problem is that the LR almost always fail to follow their own protocols when registering cautions. They usually more often than not allow the registration simply because a request is lodged & it's only when the owner attempts to sell or refinance that they discover there is a caution at which point it could have been there unseen for many years.

It's then that you have to spend time & money getting the applicant to either put up or shut up & if they don't there needs to be a risk of costly litigation for damages

1 of the most frequent culprits of this underhand practice are the local authorities regarding care home fees who neglect to tell the owner they have done it

[upndown]

Re: Charging Orders

Thanks ame & righty, I will contact the land registry and see what information they can give, you have been very helpful

[stormo]

Re: Charging Orders advice please

Hello and good afternoon,i would like some advice please on charging orders.

My wife has a CCJ against her and as a result the Creditor, a certain Creation Finance Ltd has employed a solicitor who is pursuing a claim.

There is now an application for a charging order although this is only at the Interim stage and has not been made final until the beginning of next month May 09.

Its my wifes sole debt but as we jointly own our house i have received documents from the following :-

Letter from claiments solicitor letting me know of the interim charging order against our property with details of claim and claim number etc.

Details via letter from land registry of a caution entered on our title as joint owners of the property,also have letter from solicitor informing me as an interested party.

The court hearing is set to be heard in London we live up North in S yorks i think this is a ploy so that the charging order is "uncontested".

The advice required is

1, Can the case be transferred to our local court ? if so is there a fee for this ,can the fee be waived due to means ie low income ps we only work part time at the mo so not on fantastic wages

2 I have written to Creation Finance Ltd(JJB storecard) via first class recorded delivery for a copy of My wifes Credit agreement as her right under the 1974 consumer credit act and enclosed the statutory fee of £1 which has been cashed.(12 working days not up yet due to easter Bank hols) sent 30th march.

3 If the agreement is not produced ie becomes unenforcable can the charging order be made Final.

4 any other defence against a charging order such as unfairness to other creditors /unfair extortionate interest charges which are claimed at 30 % apr
As my wifes actual amount owed has bumped up by at least £1000.

Any help would be great and much appreciated i`m wanting to fight this but wife is reluctant to do so as i`ve read on the Internet Creation Finance may be in trouble due to the downturn I also know JJB is also in financial difficulty due to the recession they can re structure and have time to pay why cant we "little people " have the same rights.

Regards S

[rosymaria]

Re: Charging Orders advice please

stormo Amethyst or 1 of the others will be along shortly to advise you - but YES definately get the hearing transferred to your local court - this is your right! You have a problem insofar as the CCJ overtakes the CCA - ie the granting of the CCJ has assumed the right paperwork was in place. Your wife should have defended the CCJ on the grounds that there was no enforcable agreement and/or the amount included unlawfull penalties. However it is not too late to hopefully get the CCJ overturned on those grounds!
To assist Amethyst etc. when was the CCJ granted please?

[righty]

Re: Charging Orders

AME I think it's important to point out that whilst at the outset it may not be beneficial for the creditor to enforce a sale if there are terms in the original agreement or it is subject to the CCA 2006 then PJCI (post judgment contractual interest) COMPOUNDED will have been applied thereby making a relatively small sum of say 10K mushroom in very few years to something like 80K.

I'm aware of at least one instance where the debt of £9,000 despite being paid monthly by order of the court has mushroomed since 1999 to it's present figure of £87,000!

Therefore whilst it's important for people not to panic it's also important that they fight tooth & nail any attempt by a creditor to obtain any kind of charging order interim or otherwise

[Amethyst]

Re: Charging Orders advice please

Hello and good afternoon,i would like some advice please on charging orders.

My wife has a CCJ against her and as a result the Creditor, a certain Creation Finance Ltd has employed a solicitor who is pursuing a claim.

There is now an application for a charging order although this is only at the Interim stage and has not been made final until the beginning of next month May 09.

Its my wifes sole debt but as we jointly own our house i have received documents from the following :-

Letter from claiments solicitor letting me know of the interim charging order against our property with details of claim and claim number etc.

Details via letter from land registry of a caution entered on our title as joint owners of the property,also have letter from solicitor informing me as an interested party.

The court hearing is set to be heard in London we live up North in S yorks i think this is a ploy so that the charging order is "uncontested".

The advice required is

1, Can the case be transferred to our local court ? if so is there a fee for this ,can the fee be waived due to means ie low income ps we only work part time at the mo so not on fantastic wages

Yes it can be moved to your local court, shouldnt be a fee but if there is you should be able to apply for remission...I think you should apply on form N244 formally - but give the issuing court a call and they should tell you how to get it transferred. If you need to use an application (form N244) then as a litigant in person you shoul dhave no trouble having it transferred.


2 I have written to Creation Finance Ltd(JJB storecard) via first class recorded delivery for a copy of My wifes Credit agreement as her right under the 1974 consumer credit act and enclosed the statutory fee of £1 which has been cashed.(12 working days not up yet due to easter Bank hols) sent 30th march.

This would only be of use if you were going to go back and try to setaside the original judgment - so need to know a bit more of the circumstances surrounding the original CCJ. Did your wife enter defence/admission etc?


3 If the agreement is not produced ie becomes unenforcable can the charging order be made Final.

as above really.

4 any other defence against a charging order such as unfairness to other creditors /unfair extortionate interest charges which are claimed at 30 % apr
As my wifes actual amount owed has bumped up by at least £1000.

In the terms of the original contract theres probably a paragraph allowing them to charge interest after judgment. Again this needs to go back to the original CCJ and ask the court to cancel the interest/set it at a sensible rate...have installments been set/been paid/ordered by court etc?

Any help would be great and much appreciated i`m wanting to fight this but wife is reluctant to do so as i`ve read on the Internet Creation Finance may be in trouble due to the downturn I also know JJB is also in financial difficulty due to the recession they can re structure and have time to pay why cant we "little people " have the same rights.


Yes we do but we have to work bloody hard to get them.

If the CCJ is sound and you can't go back to get it set aside then yes defend the final charging order - need to know value of property vs mortgage/charges outstanding, who lives there, any special circumstances, also installment offers, how much is the total debt and total charge order for ?


Regards S

Do you still have the original CCJ order from the court ?


Sorry so many questions but it will help. The Charging Order if it is finalised can be paid by installment and you should get the court to order this, then so long as you continue ordered payments they cant try for a sale order. But obviously it is better not to have them secure the debt against your home.

Also after you reply I;ll move your posts and replys to your own thread and call it Stormo v Creation finance charging order

[Amy]

Re: Charging Orders

Remission or exemption from court fees should be applied for using the EX160.

http://www.hmcourts-service.gov.uk/c...orms/ex160.pdf

[righty]

Re: Charging Orders

I agree with AME you should 1st attempt to have the CCJ set-aside as that now supersedes the original CCA. Should you be successful in setting-aside we are back to the original status-quo which will enable you to dispute your liability to pay the debt

Perhaps you could explain a little more about your circumstances. Also for the setting-aside to be made easier it's important that no admissions have been made otherwise it can be an uphill struggle
------------------------------- merged -------------------------------
Almost forgot If you tell the court your seeking a set-aside & ask for a continuance (later date) on the charging order hearing to allow you time to present your application it should be granted

[stormo]

Re: Charging Orders stormo v creation finance

Hello Amethyst and all who kindly replied, right this is going to get a bit complicated but i`ll try to steer a path through it

Asked my Mrs after you had replied for any other documents she might have so here goes.

1 wife received court pack from London in January 2009 ,in the pack was the claim form for sum owed to JJB sports (creation finance Ltd).
This gave the claim number was was officially stamped etc. and was served on 20th Jan 09.

They state that the account defaulted in October 2008 but wife states no default notice was ever received under the agreement which is covered by the 1974 CCA.
the official termination of the agreement was 6 th january this year.
A further sum of £250 was added to the owed amount dont know about other costs included or extra but these are £85 court fee and £80 solicitors fee (Creation finances ltd)

Also Creation claiming interest on the amount of 30.90 % from termination to settlement also claiming for full amount owed.

2, wife filled in form N9A and returned to Creation Finance Ltd.,no acknowledgement received when she did the income and expenditure exercise in order to reduce her payments.,this was returned completed in the time allowed 7 days ?

3 no copy of CCJ is avaiable wife hasnt received this along with No default notice isuued despite them saying it has been

4 wife paid nominal amounts to creation from Feb for £20 via cheque which was cashed and a further sum of £20 In cash in march via giro slip at the bank,dont know what the CCJ ordered her to pay as we havent got the judgement papers.

My objectives are :-

1 to get case moved to our local court

2 to dispute non receipt of Default notice and non receipt of CCJ paperwork

3 to date no copy of original agreemnt re 1974 cca

4 To prevent if possible Charging order to be Final .


In my own mind think they will get it but i`m no lawyer and will fight it best i can.

Will argue that a charging order will be unfair to other creditors my wife has.

JJB and creation finance are the pits and hope they fail

I have read they are in trouble and Barclays have helped them with Millions of pounds in loans ,they also need 75% of the retail shop landlords to agree to a CVA (Company voluntary arrangement) cos they cant pay their bills

Regards S

[Amethyst]

Re: Charging Orders

Give the court that issued the claim forms a call now with the claim reference number and ask them for copies of the paperwork (the judgment etc)

With the N9A thats a full admission and offer to pay so unfortunately I think the default notice/CCA agreement will be irrelevant and the probability of being able to set aside judgment is very low.

So that leaves us with defending the charging order and asking for redetermination of the installment amount and having the interest stopped.

What was the offer to pay on the N9A your wife made £20 a month ?

Let me know what the court say when you call them.

[rosymaria]

Re: Charging Orders

Without wishing to be in any way rude or intrusive are there any mitigating circumstances that could be brought into play with a possible objective to still getting the CCJ overturned?? Feel free to ignore me stormo but does your wife have any medical problems that could have led her to return the N9A without realising the implications of doing so?

[righty]

Re: Charging Orders

How much is the total sum that has been claimed??. Cos if it's a few hundred quid applying for a charging order was/is an abuse of process