Claim for a Debt Statute Barred

[omq187]

Hi there,

I have received a Claim Form for a debt i believe to be Statute Barred. The Claimant is Arrow Global Guernsey Limited and they are being represented by a Solicitors firm. In the Particulars the Contract date is 12.07.2008 whilst the assignment date to claimant is 20.12.2011.

I am pretty certain that there has been no payment from 2009 onwards and any previous payments were initially made from a company account where the company has now been dissolved.

The debt has never appeared on my Credit File (requested from Credit Expert) and still does not appear recently.

I have drafted the Acknowledgement with my intention to defend the claim and have also added in my Defence that i believe this debt to be Statute Barred.

Since then I have received a letter from the claimant sols first requesting more information (I am under the impression that it is up to them to prove the debt and that I have acknowledged this debt in the last 6 years).
They continue to state that a payment was received on 01.04.2010, I have no record of this payment and am confident that it wasn't made by myself.

Also, this debt or credit has never appeared on my credit report.

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Welcome aboard

Hi there,

I have received a Claim Form for a debt i believe to be Statute Barred. The Claimant is Arrow Global Guernsey Limited and they are being represented by a Solicitors firm. In the Particulars the Contract date is 12.07.2008 whilst the assignment date to claimant is 20.12.2011.

I am pretty certain that there has been no payment from 2009 onwards and any previous payments were initially made from a company account where the company has now been dissolved.

If the payments were made by you or with your authority they'd still count for the purpose of limitation.

The debt has never appeared on my Credit File (requested from Credit Expert) and still does not appear recently.

It would show now if it was defaulted over six years ago but it's rather odd that it shouldn't have been reported, although it does happen, there's no legal obligation to report to the CRAs.

I have drafted the Acknowledgement with my intention to defend the claim and have also added in my Defence that i believe this debt to be Statute Barred.

Have you actually submitted a defence on the MCOL site or just the AoS?

Since then I have received a letter from the claimant sols first requesting more information (I am under the impression that it is up to them to prove the debt and that I have acknowledged this debt in the last 6 years).

Yes, you are correct, it is YOU who should have written asking for more information from THEM, not the other way round.

They continue to state that a payment was received on 01.04.2010, I have no record of this payment and am confident that it wasn't made by myself.

Also, this debt or credit has never appeared on my credit report.

The burden of proof is on the claimant to show the debt is not SBd, by providing evidence. What have they provided in the way of proof?

[omq187]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Thanks for your response flaming parrot.
I submitted an Acknowledgement of service with the basic defence for SB matters.

They haven't provided me with any information - merely a letter to say I have not provided them with no information/evidence whatsoever on when I believe the limitation period commenced nor details provided on date of last payment. They are asking me to withdraw my defence because they have given me a date of last payment if 01/04/2010.

1) I do not believe that this debt has been acknowledged by me.
2) I don't think that the payments have ever gone out from my account - a business asked me to take the card out on my name and made the payments. The business has since liquidated and been dissolved.
3) How should I respond to the Claimant Sols - The balance is over £10k!

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Thanks for your response flaming parrot.
I submitted an Acknowledgement of service with the basic defence for SB matters.

They haven't provided me with any information - merely a letter to say I have not provided them with no information/evidence whatsoever on when I believe the limitation period commenced nor details provided on date of last payment. They are asking me to withdraw my defence because they have given me a date of last payment if 01/04/2010.

1) I do not believe that this debt has been acknowledged by me.
2) I don't think that the payments have ever gone out from my account - a business asked me to take the card out on my name and made the payments. The business has since liquidated and been dissolved.
3) How should I respond to the Claimant Sols - The balance is over £10k!

Unfortunately you have submitted a defence without going through the motions of requesting documents, etc. from the solicitors. :mmph: What sort of debt is this? A credit card? MBNA? Did you ever send a CCA request for this account?

I would put them to strict proof that a payment was, in fact, made in April 2010 as they say.

In the meantime I'd also consider sending a SAR to the original creditor (not Arrow as they wouldn't have the information). Although they have up to 40 days to respond, it would take longer than that for this to go through the motions and get to court. Although the onus is on them to prove it's not SBd, it helps to be prepared and get your statements so you can show no payments were made. :thumb:

[omq187]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

It is a Credit Card debt - Virgin Money and MBNA.
I've not written to them nor contacted them.

So I should contact Virgin for a SAR request and obtain information on the account - i.e. payments made.
How should I respond to the Claimant Sols?

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

It is a Credit Card debt - Virgin Money and MBNA.
I've not written to them nor contacted them.

So I should contact Virgin for a SAR request and obtain information on the account - i.e. payments made.

I would. :grin:

Although you have already submitted a defence, it wouldn't hurt to send a CCA request to Arrow. :thumb: They still have a duty to respond.

Below is a SAR letter I've often used. It should be sent recorded delivery with a PO for £10.

Dear Sirs

Ref: xxxxxxxx

Subject Access Request - S.7 Data Protection Act 1998

Under the Data Protection Act 1984 and 1998, and including the right of subject access under these acts, I hereby request that you supply me with any and all historical data in your possession which, in any way appertains to me, including (but not exhaustively) a copy of the original signed executed agreement; statements of account; duplicate statements and/or printouts of all account transactions; all internal and external correspondence sent or received by you including memos, logs, notes, screen prints and transcripts; notes of manual interventions such as telephone attendants' notes, copies of stored telephone conversations, internal and external emails; any other information held on all types of media in any relevant filing system. If you have disclosed any information to a third party (with or without my express permission), will you please include details of this in your reply, along with notes of any legal action passed or pending (to include a true copy of default notices, court orders and the like).

If you store any of the older records on microfiche, please be aware that the Information Commissioner deems this to be a relevant filing system under the Act. As such, any microfiche data must be sent to me in fully legible and comprehensible form.

Where any information that you provide includes any charges, for example returned payments, late payment fees, and so forth, would you please advise your breakdown of actual costs (liquidated damages) incurred for each charge, and the Term or Condition on which you rely upon to claim such a charge. I also require that you forward, within the above mentioned time scale, a true copy of the Terms and Conditions that were in force at the time my account was opened, and any subsequent amendments to those Terms and Conditions.

Additionally, where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any member of your staff, or any other person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my business with you. If you are unable to supply this data because there has been no such manual intervention, then please be so kind as to confirm this in your response.

I enclose the statutory maximum fee of £10.00 to access ALL data held by you about myself. You have 40 days in which to comply with this request.

Yours faithfully,

[FlamingParrot]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

How should I respond to the Claimant Sols?

I would just say something like: "It is denied that any payments were made after xx/xxx/2009. Arrow Global are put to strict proof that a payment was made after that date. Unless your clients are able to supply that evidence, I shall not be entering into further correspondence about this matter".

Strictly speaking, if you've submitted a defence, you don't need to communicate with them at all and al these issues can be left to be argued in court. The idea for responding to them is just precautionary. If they do have any evidence of a payment made in the last six years, you'd want to see it sooner rather than later, especially since you are relying purely on the SBd argument and did not request documents from either the claimant or the solicitors as a back-up plan. :ohwell:

Making up phantom payments is not unusual, there was a recent case here where the judge dismissed the so-called 'evidence' of one such payment in court:

Yay... time to chalk up another victory for the Beagles!
I just had my hearing where Lowells were represented, nevertheless the judge was not satisfied they had discharged their onus of proof that this matter was not statute barred.
The document they called a statement of account was not accepted as an accurate record, neither was it proved any alleged payment had been made therefore the claim was dismissed.
Grateful thanks to you all... @nemesis45, @FlamingParrot, @MIKE770 and @Kati I couldn't have done this without your help.

:whoo: :grin:

[omq187]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Hi There, I wrote Restons the letter with the CPR 31.14 request. This is the response received.


In response to your 31.14 request, please note the following:-
1. The claim was issued via the CCBC which is a procedure specifically provided for in the CPR. etc
2. We would also remind you that CPR 31.14 states: - "A party may inspect a document mentioned in -
a) a statement of case
b) witness statement
c) witness summary
d) an affidavil


you would have been provided with the T&C's at the tome the account was opened and hence see no reason why you require a further copy. further, the documents you have requested are not "mentioned" in the Partciulars of Claim and therefore 31.14 does not apply.


on a voluntary basis, we enclose:


1. A copy of credit agreement signed by you on 10 June 2008. The agreement was executed online which is evident from you having to tick the box to validate the authenticity and integrity of your signature
2. A reconstituted copy of the Terms and Conditions which governed the account at the time it was opened
3. Copy of statement of account dated 10 Nov 2010
4. Default Notice served by MBNA 9.12.2010


Then they are inviting me to withdraw my defence.


However, they have failed to confirm the payment details that were used to make the payments as I am confident I did not make these and that this was the Company Account that the card was on behalf of.
I have never received any of the above documents previously and they have an address 27 Weavers Court, an address where I never lived.
They are claiming that circa £14k is owed, however, looking through the list of transactions nearly £6k is a "Finance Charge".
It has never appeared on my credit file and hence I was never aware of this - it still does not appear on the same.


Do I have any scope to have this debt removed?

[nemesis45]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Hi There, I wrote Restons the letter with the CPR 31.14 request. This is the response received.


In response to your 31.14 request, please note the following:-
1. The claim was issued via the CCBC which is a procedure specifically provided for in the CPR. etc
2. We would also remind you that CPR 31.14 states: - "A party may inspect a document mentioned in -
a) a statement of case
b) witness statement
c) witness summary
d) an affidavil


you would have been provided with the T&C's at the tome the account was opened and hence see no reason why you require a further copy. further, the documents you have requested are not "mentioned" in the Partciulars of Claim and therefore 31.14 does not apply.


on a voluntary basis, we enclose:


1. A copy of credit agreement signed by you on 10 June 2008. The agreement was executed online which is evident from you having to tick the box to validate the authenticity and integrity of your signature
2. A reconstituted copy of the Terms and Conditions which governed the account at the time it was opened
3. Copy of statement of account dated 10 Nov 2010
4. Default Notice served by MBNA 9.12.2010


Then they are inviting me to withdraw my defence.


However, they have failed to confirm the payment details that were used to make the payments as I am confident I did not make these and that this was the Company Account that the card was on behalf of.
I have never received any of the above documents previously and they have an address 27 Weavers Court, an address where I never lived.
They are claiming that circa £14k is owed, however, looking through the list of transactions nearly £6k is a "Finance Charge".
It has never appeared on my credit file and hence I was never aware of this - it still does not appear on the same.


Do I have any scope to have this debt removed?

It would help if you could post a copy of the agreement you have received please.
I would reject the alleged payments again and state that you will not be withdrawing
your defence as there is no proof of the alleged payments and you invite them to
advise their client to withdraw the claim.

Seems like they have conveniently " forgotten" about this part.

nem

[omq187]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Thanks for the prompt message.

Please see attached the T&C's that they have sent me.

[omq187]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Hi there,

I have now received an Application Notice from Restons asking the Court to deal with the Application without a hearing as they do not believe that a Hearing is necessary.

They have stated....

Take notice that if the respondant to this application for summary judgement wishes to rely on written evidence at the hearing. It must file a witness statement and serve copies on the claimants solicitors at least 7 days before the date set for the summary judgement hearing.

If the Court is not minded to deal with this application on an ex-parte basis the claimant seeks an order:

1. lift the stay on these proceedings
2. strike out the defence pursuant to CPR 3.4(2)
3. In the alternative to (2) above, an order for summary judgement against the defendant under CPR 24.4. The defendant has no real prospect of successfully defending the claim and there is no real compelling reason why the case should be disposed of at trial
4. An order that the defendant pay the Claimants costs on a contractual basis pursuant to CPR 44.5

[Kati]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

:bump: for [MENTION=55034]nemesis45[/MENTION] xx

[nemesis45]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

:bump: for @nemesis45 xx

Thanks @ Kati nem.

[nemesis45]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Hi there,

I have now received an Application Notice from Restons asking the Court to deal with the Application without a hearing as they do not believe that a Hearing is necessary.

They have stated....

Take notice that if the respondant to this application for summary judgement wishes to rely on written evidence at the hearing. It must file a witness statement and serve copies on the claimants solicitors at least 7 days before the date set for the summary judgement hearing.

If the Court is not minded to deal with this application on an ex-parte basis the claimant seeks an order:

1. lift the stay on these proceedings
2. strike out the defence pursuant to CPR 3.4(2)
3. In the alternative to (2) above, an order for summary judgement against the defendant under CPR 24.4. The defendant has no real prospect of successfully defending the claim and there is no real compelling reason why the case should be disposed of at trial
4. An order that the defendant pay the Claimants costs on a contractual basis pursuant to CPR 44.5

Good morning responding to [MENTION=49370]Kati[/MENTION] Bump.

Just taken a look at the T's & C's supplied, is this all there was?
Was there a covering letter with them, did it state that it is a
" reconstituted" agreement?

There should be two distinct sets of T's & C's one relevant when the account was opened, and one relevant as closure of the account.

The T's & C's relevant at the inception of the account Must have your name and address as it was at that point in time and the creditors name and address.

Looking back ( and I apologise for missing this post) it seems that what has been provided according to the solicitors is only the Ts & Cs at inception of the account which means the recon agreement is not complete.
But they say they have provided a copy of the " signed agreement" have you posted a copy here?
So you need to get a witness statement put together quickly.


nem

[omq187]

Re: Claim for a Deby Statute Barred

Please see attached what was sent as part of the Application Pack - note this is not what they sent me when I requested it.

What should my witness statement contain?

do you think I should instruct Solicitors?

I have still not heard from the Court regarding the above!

Many thanks