CC Judgement

[d0nnyoz]

Hi

I was advised to come onto this forum from moneysavingexpert in order to get some good legal advice on my current issue.

For some time I have had threatening letters from a creditor about a credit card debt. I followed the procedures as stated by the MSE forums in requesting a CCA etc which never materialised.
After several months I then get a County Court claim sent to me.
I wrote back to the court using the form to submit my defense in that the creditor has never proven the debt in the form of a CCA.
The court acknowledge my defense and stated it was sending it to the claimant to respond within 28 days.

The claimant has now written to me stating I have 14 days to pay or they will request a summary judgement under Part 24 CPR.
I can't understand how they can do that as surely they would need to prove their case in the form of showing proof of the debt??

So my question is: How should I respond?
My thoughts are that I write to the court with a full defense in that the claimant must show prove of the debt and to date they haven't.

Any advice welcome.

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Hi Guys
I'm getting a little worried now about how I can respond to this claim. Can anyone offer some advice?

[enquirer]

Re: CC Judgement

The court acknowledge my defense and stated it was sending it to the claimant to respond within 28 days.

From what date does the 28 day period run from?

The claimant has now written to me stating I have 14 days to pay or they will request a summary judgement under Part 24 CPR.

This is only a threat - they haven't actually done anything. What date is on the document?

If they fail to respond, or respond adequately, at the end of 28 days, the court might decide to strike the claim out. Alternatively, you could apply for it to be struck out.

You can ask court staff for advice regarding procedure and what options may be available.

[basa48]

Re: CC Judgement

Hi

I was advised to come onto this forum from moneysavingexpert in order to get some good legal advice on my current issue.

For some time I have had threatening letters from a creditor about a credit card debt. I followed the procedures as stated by the MSE forums in requesting a CCA etc which never materialised.
After several months I then get a County Court claim sent to me.
I wrote back to the court using the form to submit my defense in that the creditor has never proven the debt in the form of a CCA.
The court acknowledge my defense and stated it was sending it to the claimant to respond within 28 days.

The claimant has now written to me stating I have 14 days to pay or they will request a summary judgement under Part 24 CPR.
I can't understand how they can do that as surely they would need to prove their case in the form of showing proof of the debt??

So my question is: How should I respond?
My thoughts are that I write to the court with a full defense in that the claimant must show prove of the debt and to date they haven't.

Any advice welcome.

First off I would ask if you ever signed up to a valid credit agreement with this lender and if so how likely is it that the lender can produce the signed copy in court.

Do you have good reason to think that the lender has no credit agreement or that it is seriously defective?

Second, how is it that you now appear to be in serious arrears such that you are being sued, e.g. why did you stop paying?

Did the lender issue a default notice? Was it valid? Did they advise you they were intending to take legal action.

Non compliance with s78 does not prevent a lender instigating legal action, only from getting an 'on the spot' judgement. In what way has the lender contravened s78? They can 'reconstitute' an agreement that you would have signed, which will satisfy s78. You would need to cast doubt on that reconstituted agreement to force the lender to produce the real thing.

In any case (IMO) s65 would insist the lender does have a proper agreement (but don't forget they only have to demonstrate this on the balance of probability).

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

The date of the Claim Form from Northampton County Court is 15th November 2012.
I initially responded with a defence of the full amount, stating I admit no debt to the creditor and asked for proof of debt.
I received a letter from the creditor dated 5th December 2012 enclosing a "Notice of Change of Solicitors" - why and what does this mean?
In the letter they also state that they "can discern no defence from the contents" of my submitted defence. They say they will request a summary judgement under Part 24 CPR but will refrain from doing so for 14 days to allow me to make payment.

In answer to some of the questions, yes this was a credit card agreement with a long history. Firstly, I got into trouble with payments and some were late, but they were always paid (so no money outstanding). The credit card company decided to re-assess my credit worthiness and reduced my credit limit to the actual amount that was outstanding (about £1700 at the time), but as I was struggling with payments, whenever I missed a payment, the charges would then take my debt over-limit and the debt just spiralled. I wrote to the CC company several times about stopping charges and fees whilst I got the debt under control again and they completely ignored me. Not one response!

So the debt has been passes from one to another. I go so much harassment from the current claimant that I requested a CCA and they provided a printed copy (not an original), so I suspect there isn't one. I think they even stated at one point the original lender couldn't locate a copy, but I might be mis-quoting there.

So, what do I do about this now?
My thoughts are still they need to provide proof of debt through some sort of original agreement, no?
And there was another thread here which discussed a response based on a PCR 31.14 request, which sounds like what I want - for them to provide proof of the debt essentially.

Any further advice as I think I need to respond to these guys fairly soon.

[basa48]

Re: CC Judgement

Take look here:

http://www.consumerwiki.co.uk/index....Your_Advantage

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Thanks basa48.
That is pretty much based on the content of the thread I quoted so I'll get something off to the claimaint today.
I assume I should copy in the Court as well??

[basa48]

Re: CC Judgement

Thanks basa48.
That is pretty much based on the content of the thread I quoted so I'll get something off to the claimaint today.
I assume I should copy in the Court as well??

Yes, for the court file should it get that far.

[rbsmith]

Re: CC Judgement

If you have loan agreement copy then you may produce that to the court to show about the debt repayment terms. You are also required to show the payment status. You must have efficient document proof about repayments. These things will help to manage with court statement.

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Hi
I've just received a response from the claimant and it states:

"The format of the letter [we received] is familiar to us being one readily available on the internet.
Our application for Summary Judgement is in preparation and all supporting documents will be exhibited in the evidence. As our Particulars of Claim do not mention documents, your request to produce such documents does not apply. We would also draw your attention to the CPR Part 17 as it relates to the filing of any amended defence.

The application will be issued in the New Year and will be served on you as previously advised.!

Not sure what all of this means and it would seem to me that they have all bases covered, but I am aware that these claimants have a tendency to baffled laymen with all sorts of criteria!

Any advise on what my next step is now as I am a little worried??

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Hi

Just wondered if there was any further advise on the above as I'm slightly worried now that the claimant will just progress with the court and I'll just have to accept their outcome, or am I worrying too much?

Any advise would be welcomed.

Thanks and HNY!

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Hi guys, still no update which is worrying me even more now as I feel I should be doing something.
As mentioned, the claimant states they will make an application for a summary judgement "in the New Year" and I was wondering if I could/should contact the court stating the claimant has not responded to my CPR31.14 within the timeframe and therefore I request the claim to be at least set aside??

Please, please advise?

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Hi

Can anyone offer me some further advice on this forum?? I haven't had any further advice since my post of 21st December and I'm wondering if I am doing something wrong??

To update anyone who reads this, the claimant stated they would apply for a Summary Judgement in the New Year, but there has been nothing forthcoming so far and I'm beginning to think (hope!) that the CPR 31.14 has scared them off. That might be wishful thinking though.

But I want to strike while things are lying low and apply to the court to get the case struck out or at least stayed.
Can anyone offer some advice on how I do that and how I word the letter?

Thanks.

[basa48]

Re: CC Judgement

If I were in your position I would await the claimants threat to apply for summary judgement to be applied to the court. Thus far they have been unable to provide to you or the court a reasonable basis for their claim, to wit, a credit agreement which you signed.

It is my understand from here> http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/pro...l/rules/part24 > that the plaintiffs will need to provide you with their evidence before the trial and you must be advised of the hearing at least 14 days prior.

We are now 21 days into the New Year. It is highly likely they are searching for the credit agreement. They really can't do much without it.

I would leave it a little longer (say another 14 days or so) before apply for a strike.

The problem with you going for a strike out is that the onus would be on you to prove the claimant has no case, which may not be easy if they can lash up a reconstituted agreement and show a history of payments. Whereas it is much more difficult for them to prove there is a claim by producing a valid agreement (to overcome the requirement of s61).

[d0nnyoz]

Re: CC Judgement

Many thanks Basa48.
I have had an agreement sent to me some time ago and I'm not even sure it was from this claimant. In fact, I know it wasn't from this claimant. But the agreement was not a signed agreement, it was simply an electronic copy with my name printed on it.

If I wait for another 14 days to apply for a strike, do I still need to prove the claimant has no case?
Also, how do I apply for a strike? Do I write to the court requesting this and is there a set format?

Thanks again...