CCJ from VWFS (Car Finance)

[Unknown2023]

Hi Rob. Thank you so much, we had an amazing time and got some beautiful photos of us in our wedding attire under the northern lights.

Back to business now though. I'm ready to appeal this.
The free legal advice was pretty useless, and they weren't prepared to offer a next step solution until I send over my documents and pay them to prepare a permission to appeal form.

Meanwhile I've contacted the Courts to try and acquire the transcript of the judgment but have heard nothing back yet. Trying to call them currently but no luck getting through.

I think it's important that I obtain the judgment first so that you can see the exact wording made by the judge in terms of the decision

I've also received the order from the court along with a very smug email from VWFS requesting my payment proposal.

At what point do I notify them of my intention to appeal?

[R0b]

That's sounds like a great way to have ended your wedding!

In terms of your appeal, if you are sure you want to go down this path then I just want to be clear that it's difficult to give you any real guidance because usually appeals are based on what has happened/said on the day of the hearing. You have obviously summarised the outcome of the hearing and the judgment but you are going to have to do some work for the appeal since you were the one at the hearing.

That said, rather than me trying to explain the process, I thought it might be helpful to share this link that describes a summary overview of the appeals process: https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/...court-decision. Have a read of it through to the end and get started on drafting your Form N164.

From what you have described, there may be several grounds of appeal that you could potentially argue:

1. The Judge was wrong in law to find that the transfer of the vehicle was a separate transaction between the dealer and the defendant, rather than a transaction forming part of the negotiations with the claimant.

2. The Judge erred in finding that the transfer of the vehicle was not an advance payment or a deposit within the meaning of the CCA 1974 or the CC(A)R 2010.

3. The Judge was wrong to find that the claimant's actions of reporting the hire purchase vehicle as stolen to the police and subsequently collecting it following repossession did not amount to a breach of section 90 of the CCA.

4. The hearing was procedurally and substantively unfair such that the Defendant was deprived of a fair hearing and the opportunity to advance his arguments before the court. The Judge's treatment of the Defendant as a litigant in person through persistent interruption and talking over the Defendant amounted to an apparent bias rendering the judgment unreliable.

I'm not suggesting any of the grounds I mentioned above fit with what you are thinking of appealing about but this is the impression I am forming from reading back of the last few posts. There may be other grounds of appeal but ideally you should focus on 3 or 4 grounds at best rather than a long list as it is likely to come across as desperate when the senior judge is reading your application. Once you have decided what grounds you want to appeal on, I can try to put together a summary of those grounds based on what I understand but you will need to adapt and tweak to your liking.

Also note that point 4 is based on what you described about the judge interrupting and speaking over you, there may be grounds of bias there given you are unrepresented and it would have unlikely happened had you been legally represented. I would also say that this ground is likely going to require a transcript of the full hearing rather than just the decision because the senior judge will want to read the transcript and understand the extent of the interruption. That will come at an extra cost and is a cost I don't know if it is worth pursuing but that is a choice you need to make. Appeals based on bias are not easy to achieve as judges are granted some leeway so that might be something worth considering.

Finally, for the transcript, they are handled by companies authorised to compile a transcript of the hearing. The list of approved transcription companies can be found here using the link below. I suggest you read the guidance notes to fully understand the process, the cost and which companies you can use. Some may be cheaper than others but not by much. You will then need to fill in EX107 form and send it to the transcription company of your choice, they will reach out to the court for the recorded tape.

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ngs-form-ex107

As for responding to VWFS, you can put them on notice if you like that you intend to appeal the decision and will be filing an appellant's notice in due course. The judgment does not get stayed unless you specifically request the stay in the application, so it's possible they may take enforcement action in the interim. It's unusual to do that if an appeal process is happening because if they lose, they will then need to reverse any successful enforcement which could cost them to dip into their own pockets.

[Unknown2023]

Those 4 grounds you have suggested are very helpful. I do want to appeal it because as you rightly say, the judge did not correctly acknowledge the part exchanged car although he did acknowledge it, which doesn't actually make any sense. He's made up his own rules, or not known the legislation well enough to rule properly and listened to the barrister over me.
It was however the barrister who was talking over me and interrupting me, not the judge. Also, I did not have an opportunity to cross examine the barrister, I did cross examine his witness but I just didn't ask enough questions and the points I did raise such as asking what legislation they are bound by, we're completely ignored.
I also dare I say have a suspicion that the judge and barrister knew each other. Like I said previously there was a lot of the barrister turning his back on the judge to confer with his witness, the judge and barrister also spent many moments emailing each other privately during the hearing.
I'm also very upset that I had a new judge on the case, the previous judge who dealt with the set aside hearing was much more on my side and sympathised with the fact that I had traded my car in and then lost my new car also. He understood the situation better and I feel it would have been a much fair trial had he overseen the final hearing. Is there any way I can request to have him specifically in any new hearings that may happen?

I do feel there was a bias but as you say, it will be difficult to prove and I don't want to be seen as trying to undermine a court of law.

In terms of the CCJ currently, will it revert back to the original CCJ back in play now that I have been court ordered to pay VWFS?

I've heard nothing back from the Courts regarding the transcript so I will write up an EX107 and send it to one of the companies today, I've got 14 days left to get this permission to appeal submitted.

Maybe I'll request the judgment for now and if the senior judge wants to look more into the bias he will contact me to request the full transcript?

I did have another question but it's gone out of my head just now, I'll post up when it comes back to me but in the meantime I will get on with both of these forms. I really want you to be able to have a look over the judgment transcript before I submit, as there may be a way in which something has been worded by the judge which may make you think actually there is no chance of winning an appeal here, or on the flipside to that something you may see as a smoking gun where the judge really has made a poor decision

[R0b]

Unfortunately, unless the judge reserves the case for themselves (usually reserved for protracted disputes that have already had several rounds in court and the judge has good knowledge of the case), you will be allocated any available judge at the time and as annoying as that may seem, you have to deal with what comes your way.

Sometimes there may be delays with the transcript due to the court but if you get it in time, I will take a look, though as always, there is no guarantee that permission to appeal would be successful despite what the judge said or done in the transcript.

Fortunately, you don't need to submit any bundle or arguments just yet, only the N164 and your grounds of appeal, but if the court grants permission, your appeal bundle needs to be submitted within 14 days of permission being granted, so there isn't time to sit around and wait. In fact this is probably one of the very few times you would want the court to take their time reviewing the application, to allow you to do what you need to do.

I'll see if I can flesh out a bit more detail on those grounds I mentioned for guidance so you can write your grounds of appeal over the coming days, but I do have a very busy week so I can't make any promises.

The judge will only review what you put in front of them on appeal, you won't get a chance for a judge to request a full transcript at a later date (never seen that happen before) as it is your judge to ensure everything is put in front of him/her to review at the time of the appeal hearing.

[Unknown2023]

Okay so that transcript is vital at this point then. I'll have to weigh up the costs of a full hearing transcript vs the judgment, although I don't want to say it's a biased case and push my luck too much
I do worry though that perhaps my lack of experience and not being able to put up a supportive argument against the barrister is ultimately what lost the case
No that is fine, you've already given up so much of your time towards this I don't expect you to go out of your way on my behalf.
I guess my next question would be what does the appeal bundle consist of? But we can come onto that if the permission is granted.
I really need a senior judge who understands vehicle finance. And what makes this more difficult is that there are no terms and conditions set in stone anywhere regarding the scrappage scheme itself

[Unknown2023]

That's my EX107 filed and the Claimant put on notice of my intention to appeal.

Whilst filling in the N164 I notice there are some extra sections;

I wish to apply for a stay of execution, what grounds would be reasonable enough to request this?

Can I apply for extra time in section 7 sufficient for me to receive the transcript, if it doesn't arrive in time? (it should do as I ticked the 48hr turnaround service)

Am I asking the court to set aside the order, or to vary the order, or asking for a new hearing?

I will await your final draft of the grounds for appeal and evidence in support of the appeal, I understand you're busy and I will also let you know once the transcript arrives so you can read it

[Unknown2023]

I still haven't received the transcript from the court, they have not actioned the request via the transcription company.

They are genuinely the most useless court around, I haven't even been able to reach them by telephone.

I'm going to have to ask for more time for the appeal as per the N164 form, as my 21 days runs out on Tuesday, what is the likelihood this will be accepted on the basis that the Court are dragging their heels? Are there any other grounds I can fill in on the form to strengthen my request for more time?

[Unknown2023]

R0b
Please see attached judgment transcript
https://jmp.sh/s/fHi8fAvwHU1DitjvuNVg

[Frothey]

Might be a bit late on this - and ended up reading this as I was looking for something else - but on finance agreements "scrappage" cars were shown as a discount as it would have messed up VAT otherwise - if the car was 50k and they were giving you 5k for the car, the real sale value for VAT purposes was 45k which is what needed to be shown on the invoice and the finance docs. Otherwise the dealers would have ended up paying too much VAT as the PX had no value to the dealer, they were disposed of by the manufacturer and the dealer received nothing for them, apart from the registration of a new car. They were almopst like a "voucher" to receive the discount. Probably why the judge discounted that part of the argument. If that makes sense.

Good luck with the rest.

[Unknown2023]

Hi, thank you for your response. That makes sense what you are saying, unfortunately I've been advised to appeal the decision and now I don't know if I have grounds for this and am going to end up wasting more money.

The agreement did show the scrappage as a discount on some of the documents, however as a part exchange on others.

I am kicking myself as since the judgment, I have found the Audi scrappage terms and conditions which states that scrappage cannot be combined with any other discount, I actually received both and this would have been good grounds for an improperly executed agreement. However I now can't bring new evidence to the table.

I am still waiting and hoping that R0b comes back online soon as he is heavily invested in this and has advised me the whole way through my case

[Unknown2023]

I've had a response from the appeal judge today, refusing permission to appeal.

I guess that's the end of it then?