Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

[Cnc41]

Hi, would really appreciate some help on current situation if possible please.

This matter relates to an overdraft with HSBC several years back. Owing to personal issues we got into a mess with our finances in 2007 still working a way out of it now really but things are a lot better than they were thankfully! This overdraft amounted to £330, it accumulated mainly because of extra charges on HSBC’s part (awful bank!) but was passed on to MKDP which I then rightly or wrongly ignored and Robinson way got in contact at the beginning of last year. I knew I owed the money and offered £60, The Company Howard cohen then just referred it to court on the 4 April without any further communication. I responded by saying that they didnt bother to acknowledge my offer despite me following their procedures, if their reply was lost in the post then that wasn’t my fault and I felt it was unfair it was expediated to court. Several months passed and I called the court to see what had happened, apparently the company hadn’t responded and the case was stayed. Until just before Xmas when I received a notice of proposed allocation to court letter plus another letter from Howard Cohen stating that they acknowledge my offer of £60 and the client would except a Tomlin agreement of £488.19. This amount was the sum plus the interest noted on the original court letter! Can they do that? It didn’t even go through the court!

Not sure what to do, it says it is a defended claim and I need to respond by 8th jan, I really don’t want a CCJ over a relatively small amount as it will mess up any future plans. But why should they just add on the interest? Also I don’t think I had any correspondence saying Hoist took over. I think I need to send letters off but since I’ve already responded on the original claim form have I shot myself in the foot? Sorry it’s so long and thanks in advance for any help I really appreciate it

[warwick65]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

How do they want you to pay the Tomlin, have they specified a rate per month ?

A Tomlin order is a way of them securing an arrangement without having to go to court and while they can be useful they can also be dangerous as they can contain difficult clauses

[Amethyst]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

Did you keep a copy of what you wrote on the original claim form at all? That is currently in as your defence to the claim against you - so if that was just a paragraph about how you offered £60 and they ignored you, you might have to undertake some remedial work ( amend your defence which will cost you either £100 or £255 unless you're eligible for fee remission - it seems a big expense for a £330 debt )

Did you send any requests for information on receipt of the claim - agreements, default notices, notice of assignment, breakdown of the debt amount etc ?

So they have applied to lift the stay and proceed with the claim, hence you getting the allocation letter. Did you complete the directions questionnaire and return it to the court, cc'd to the Claimant ?

Do you want to still defend the claim on account of the debt being made up of charges ? If not, or there isn't a strong enough case on other grounds, you can make a counter offer to them to settle, or wait for mediation ( presumably they have ticked yes to mediation on their form? ) to try come to an agreement without a CCJ being obtained, a Tomlin order is one way to do that - as Warwick said - which allows them to ask for a judgment if you defaulted at all in payments agreed.

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

Thank you for the replies. The Tomlin agreement they are proposing is £1 pm but includes the interest amount of £158 which has been taken from the initial court papers. I do have a copy of my defence as photocopied everything I sent off. This debt stems from 2007 and I know nothing has been paid off it as it’s atill standing at the original £330. I’ve had communication over the years but only responded to RW as felt it was time to deal with it. I definitely do not want a CCJ so to get it gone perhaps I should just email them with a counter offer using one of the templates on here which then makes it formal. Imagine I would need to go in at about £150 and see what happens , would this then halt court proceedings or do I also need to contact the court to inform them that I am speaking with HC to settle out of court? Interestingly this is not showing up on any of my credit files, I monitor my report monthly with noodle, clearscore and the money saving credit club but no trace

[warwick65]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

Was there a period of 6 clear years where no payments or acknowledgements in writing were made- that would potentially make it statute barred

The fact it is not on your credit file suggests it was defaulted at least 6 years ago.

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

There’s a possibility but I’m guessing by responding to Robinson way last March and offering the £60 I’ve potentially jeopardised that? Will have a look through my papers to clarify though. So if items on are not on your credit file, to be honest I don’t remember if anything was ever on there in relation to this, what does that mean with regards to any court action? Can they still proceed? Thanks for the advice I really appreciate the help with this

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

Update.... I contacted the solicitors with a counter offer of £150 using a full and final settlement template. They replied today saying that the claimant would accept £200 as f&f and included a revised Tomlin agreement to be signed and returned if I agreed. Usually there seems to be cost implications with a Tomlin agreement but there’s no mention on the agreement, just that payment needs to be made within a month of agreement. I’m happy to settle at £200 if it means this is definitely full and final settlement and they can’t then pass the matter onto someone else at a later date for them to chase me! What specific wording would need to be in the response and is there anything else I need to ensure is in place before I make payment. Thanks in advance

[Amethyst]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

Would you be able to type out or scan the proposed tomlin order and schedule pls ( redacting/leaving out your personal details ). There are a couple examples of others http://legalbeagles.info/forums/show...l=1#post506055

[Diana M]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

The Tomlin agreement they are proposing is £1 pm but includes the interest amount of £158.

. . . . I definitely do not want a CCJ so to get it gone perhaps I should just email them with a counter offer . . . . . . Imagine I would need to go in at about £150 and see what happens

I'm pleased for you that they've accepted an offer (although from what you have said the debt could be Statute Barred). You've agreed to pay more than you offered so make sure you can afford it before signing on the dotted line.

Their initial offer was for you to pay by instalments but this offer appears to be a one-off lump sum payment.

The terms of the Tomlin Order are important so maybe get it checked over by your local CAB to make sure there's nothing in it which could trip you up.

You are at the DQ stage so free telephone Mediation should have also been an option to settle this claim. The settlement would be legally binding but not a CCJ (so similar to a Tomlin Order).

Here's what Jo posted on another thread about the perils of late payment under a Tomlin Order as cautionary advice to anyone signing one especially instalment based Orders (like their original £1 per month offer which they made to you) >

Anyone receiving a Tomlin Order like this should be careful. It is a Tomlin Order drafted so as to fail. The old adage if it looks too good to be true it is too good to be true springs to mind...........

Problem 1

Para 2.3 states that the payments must be made by cleared funds For a long term Tomlin Order the OP would usually (and would be well advised to) set up a standing order to ensure that the payments are not missed.

Paragraph 2.4 states that "Where the last day falls upon a weekend payment is to be received as cleared funds by no later than the last working day preceding month end." If your standing order payment date falls on a Saturday, Sunday or bank holiday the bank delays payment until the next working day.

In this case the payment falls due on 31 December 2017 which is a Sunday. The bank will pay it to PRA Group (UK) Limited on Tuesday 2 January 2018. Under the terms of the Tomlin Order the payment must be made by Friday 29 December 2017. The OP is in breach by not making payment as required and the claimant is entitled under Paragraph 4 to enter Judgment for the full amount and proceed to enforcement.

Problem 2

Another potential problem is if the claimant changes the bank account to which payments should be made and you don't receive the letter sent notifying you. Payment would be returned and the OP would be in breach of the Tomlin Order and the claimant is entitled under Paragraph 4 of the Tomlin Order to enter Judgment for the full amount and proceed to enforcement.

Problem 3

A payment term of some 1,000 years at £1.00 a month or even say 2-3 years. The £1.00 is such a small amount it would be easy to not notice if for some reason it wasn't paid by your bank or if on if the OP were to change their bank account to set it up again..

Problem 4

Should an OP die then the Tomlin Order carry's on and the Estate would need to carry on paying the £1.00 a month or the full amount will become due and payable.

Suggestions

The solution to avoid the traps is to pay say at least 12 months payments in advance (£12.00) or even longer .

For anyone already signed up to this type of Tomlin Order with this wording don't worry. Put yourself ahead on payments or if you have already missed the payment day then If PRA should seek to obtain Judgment for the full amount because you paid on a Monday instead of a Friday as payments are ongoing the Unfair Relationship provisions under s.140 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 are still applicable.

Di

[Diana M]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

just before Xmas when I received a notice of proposed allocation to court letter

Your first post says you received what appears to be a Directions Questionnaire before Christmas.

What is/was the deadline for returning that to NCCBC because I think you should still complete and file it at court just to be on the safe side (your Defence could be struck out resulting in a CCJ if you don't).

A Tomlin Order only exists once it's been filed at court so until that's happened you're vulnerable legally speaking.

Di

[Diana M]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

This debt stems from 2007 and I know nothing has been paid off it as it’s atill standing at the original £330. I’ve had communication over the years but only responded to RW as felt it was time to deal with it. . . ..

. . . Interestingly this is not showing up on any of my credit files, I monitor my report monthly with noodle, clearscore and the money saving credit club but no trace

If it's not showing on your credit file that implies that it was defaulted more than six years ago because the whole file entry is removed from the CRA file on the sixth anniversary from when the default was registered.

If you didn't make any payments (or acknowledge the debt in writing) for the eight years from 2007 until 2015 (when you responded to Robinson Way) then could this debt be Statute Barred?

If that were to be the case then it could be a negotiating tool for any settlement since SB is an absolute Defence.

However you must do what feels best for you after considering all your legal options.

Di

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

After digging around in my paperwork I’ve since discovered that I have paid something on this debt within the past 6 years so it couldn’t be statue barred. I had 2 overdrafts with HSBC and was thinking of the wrong one . From what I’ve read on here now it’s looking very likely that any default has dropped off as our financial issues started in 2007 some 10 years ago now

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

Would you be able to type out or scan the proposed tomlin order and schedule pls ( redacting/leaving out your personal details ). There are a couple examples of others http://legalbeagles.info/forums/show...l=1#post506055

Am trying to work out how to attach photos as currently using my phone, bear with me!

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

I'm pleased for you that they've accepted an offer (although from what you have said the debt could be Statute Barred). You've agreed to pay more than you offered so make sure you can afford it before signing on the dotted line.

Their initial offer was for you to pay by instalments but this offer appears to be a one-off lump sum payment.

The terms of the Tomlin Order are important so maybe get it checked over by your local CAB to make sure there's nothing in it which could trip you up.

You are at the DQ stage so free telephone Mediation should have also been an option to settle this claim. The settlement would be legally binding but not a CCJ (so similar to a Tomlin Order).

Here's what Jo posted on another thread about the perils of late payment under a Tomlin Order as cautionary advice to anyone signing one especially instalment based Orders (like their original £1 per month offer which they made to you) >




Di

Thank for the info on the Tomlin agreements, very useful with regards to watching the dates etc.

They have sent me a Tomlin agreement to sign which I am trying to attach to this thread just so someone could cast an eye over it. I was expecting them to ask for more than the offer I made and had something in reserve as we really want to get this matter closed now so I am ok with that just want to ensure everything’s watertight so there’s no possibility of anyone having a try afor more
money at a later date. I offered to make payment by 31st if Jan as that was the time that suited me so I guess they’ve gone with this above the monthly option. Mediation has been offered it would seem, they filled in the form and I have a copy and when I rang the court to query something else I confirmed I would send the form back which I’ve now done. Not sure what it can achieve tbh but will let things take their course so that there’s no possibility they can just issue me with a CCJ for not responding.

[Cnc41]

Re: Hoist portfolio holding 2 ltd

If it's not showing on your credit file that implies that it was defaulted more than six years ago because the whole file entry is removed from the CRA file on the sixth anniversary from when the default was registered.

If you didn't make any payments (or acknowledge the debt in writing) for the eight years from 2007 until 2015 (when you responded to Robinson Way) then could this debt be Statute Barred?

If that were to be the case then it could be a negotiating tool for any settlement since SB is an absolute Defence.

However you must do what feels best for you after considering all your legal options.

Di

have since discovered hat I’ve acknowledged and paid towards the debt with a previous debt company so SB extremely unlikely. Have received a Tomlin agreement which confirms the amount they want me to pay as settlement but doesn’t necessarily read as a full and final settlement. Is a Tomlin agreement actually needed if I confirm I’ll be paying the money at the end of the month as agreed? I’ve been given no account details of where to pay as yet but would def like the watertight letter from th Company to confirm what has been agreed first. Is this all standard practice, I have no prior experience of what to expect from here on in. Thanks

- - - Updated - - -

Have taken heed of this and returned the questionnaire regardless of what is happening with the settlement offer. Really don’t want to be left vulnerable and at risk of unwanted judgements. I had called a the court last week to query something and they asked if I’d sent it in so I told them it was on its way which they made a note of