Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

[laetitia74]

Received a claim? Yes
Issue Date: 21-4-2017
Amount approx: 6000
Claimant: n/a
Solicitor: stephensons
Original Credit: solicitor

Particulars of Claim:
claim is for fees owed for legal services from 2011-2013

Stat Barred? Yes

Have sent: Acknowledged the Claim

Other Info:
Hi all, this is a rather weird one. My solicitor sent me no bills while working for me from 2011- 2013- she was an eccentric type and we became friends, she even came round for coffee and lunch now and then! I believe she didn't bill me because she expected me to pay in a lump sum at some point in the future.
Her legal services were not great and I ended up having to conclude the matter myself. I have, as she knew, serious mental health issues (two chronic diagnosed disorders, amounting to a disability).
Anyway... I found out via email from stephensons in August this year that a CCJ had been taken out against me for 6k plus interest, total nearly 10k.
I got this judgement immediately set aside because the muppets who issued it hadn't got it signed or sealed (!!)

The bills they are claiming on don't look like final bills according to solicitors act 1974 and they haven't submitted any evidence to the contrary, just a denial that they are not final.
The solicitor was last in touch with me in 2014 and I made no efforts to evade her or payment (as hadn't received any bills!), although I did complain about the very poor pace of the case. She knew very well i was moving house, because I told her I would be moving that Spring, and I think she had my new address but obviously cannot prove it.At very least she knew that I had moved, so presumably they were not justified either in sending the chaser and claim to my old address this year.

So, it is now a defended claim. I haven't received a hearing date for it yet. Solicitor has rejected an offer of 4k and asked for full amount of 6k (but no interest
One immediate question: the first invoice for 2.5k is dated May 2011. So, could it now be statute barred or does the fact they made a (set aside) claim in April mean it was resurrected?

Also I have been in touch with the solictior and offered a settlement of 4k which he has refused. He wants 6k in immediate payment, which i don't have, and said as he knows I have property he wants me to take a secured loan to pay him back (??) or if I do pay in instalments he wants a charge on my house while I pay. (This of course would mean I couldn't raise any further loans while I pay him off, doesn't it?)

Did my offer of 4k also represent acknowledgement of that invoice? I was careful to say in my defence to the claim that I believe it to now be statute barred.

Many thanks all
Laetitia

[Kati]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

tagging [MENTION=7765]Joanna C[/MENTION] [MENTION=87380]Diana M[/MENTION] [MENTION=551]pt2537[/MENTION] ??

[laetitia74]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

I would like to make clear I realise I do owe this legal firm something as they did perform work for me (although I ended up having to negotiate the matter to a conclusion myself :/) but I do feel their debt recovery methods have been aggressive, their service and billing are clearly not efficient and I think its out of order for them to demand full payment immediately, after several years hiatus. I also feel they haven't paid any attention to my MH status in being so aggressive etc (in fact they have called me 'embarrassing and incoherent' for telling the truth about all this in my defence; I have ADHD among other serious issues, thus can't be expected to have reminded THEM to bill me.)
It appears the solicitor acting for me never sent me any final bills or reminders for payment, even by email, I've checked all records. She did send one in 2015 saying she was about to retire, but it was in my 'unread' list as sent to an old address I don't check often.
I think what then happened is another solicitor reviewed her file, realised an invoice was about to be statute barred and immediately issued the CCJ without bothering to check on the electoral register where I now lived.

[warwick65]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

Hi
With regard to the SB

When was the first claim issued , was it within 6 years of the original invoice

With regard to your MH, I think it would be only reasonable for them to expect some sort of proof, a letter from a MH professional. Or have you already provided this ?

As you were able to conclude the previous case yourself I wonder if they may use this as evidence of your ability.

Sorry to sound glass half empty

As this is now a defended claim , I assume in the small claims court, you have the opportunity to go to mediation. Not quite sure what your defence is though

[laetitia74]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

well, my defence was to the original claim, and particularly the enormous amount of interest. They knew very well I wasn't at the address they sent it to as the solicitor had been told I'd moved years ago. Yes first claim was issued within the 6 years.

If you are not happy with a solicitors service you have the right to have the bill 'assessed' by the solicitors conduct authority. That's really what I want, as I haven't been happy with the fact nothing happened (over 5 years!!) in my case and I had to conclude it myself. If they demand full payment now I am not given the chance to get the bills assessed. Plus, they are suing on bills which are not finalised and which were not presented to me! That's incredibly poor practice. I also raised a complaint with the solicitors as soon as I found out about the CCJ which they are refusing to answer as they are saying its an attempt to avoid payment, etc.

There's an entire file of 'proof' regarding my MH, which was also well known to the solicitor, but which got much worse following a complete breakdown and suicide attempt in 2013.... and yes they have had it, and declared it irrelevant. However, I have done a bit of research and it appears you can't use aggressive enforcement methods against a person with MH difficulties. I just don't know what exactly qualifies as 'aggressive'

MH such as I have is a fluctuating condition, worse at some times than others- and does not affect intellectual ability. in fact one of my conditions is bipolar so I can be very efficient/fast at times and in chaotic despair the next. Today is a good day, eg I don't feel suicidal. I won't go into too many details of the case, but it was concluded through a personal agreement, not my amazing brains (family law issue).

My main argument with them is they expect me to stump up 6k immediately when they know I'm off sick from work. And how many people have 6k? I also doubt I'll get a personal loan for that much, with my employment status being what it is. Also I am going to need personal loans in the future I'm sure as I'm not likely to return to employment, so I'd really rather not have a charge on my house if I can avoid it. ( I realise I may not be able to avoid it).

[warwick65]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

Thank you for the comprehensive reply. I was I'm afraid playing devils advocate.

From their perspective can you see why they think your complaint is intended to avoid payment, you have not made any mention of complaining at the time. I have no idea if you did but it would help your case if you had done.


So to sum up, you admit you owe the money but do not want a charge on your house, I get that, maybe some mediation as part of the court process would settle this. It is most definitely a bad idea to take out a loan to pay off this debt.

Hopefully someone will give more opinions now the culture is a little clearer.

[laetitia74]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

From their perspective can you see why they think your complaint is intended to avoid payment, you have not made any mention of complaining at the time. I have no idea if you did but it would help your case if you had done.


So to sum up, you admit you owe the money but do not want a charge on your house, I get that, maybe some mediation as part of the court process would settle this. It is most definitely a bad idea to take out a loan to pay off this debt.

.

Hi, I think if they didn't bill me, how could I be 'avoiding payment'? Their only response has been to lie about that, frankly. Their solicitor knew I'd moved and probably the new address was in their file which they didn't bother to read before sending out a court claim. Am I, with bipolar and ADHD supposed to do their accounting and billing job for them? One of the bills dates from 2011. I didn't move until October 2013. If I was a delinquent client why were they still acting for me??

I don't get the arrogance of these people... but I guess that's lawyers for you (I'll confess I used to be one before I got ill... and this lot's methods are not efficient or clear, believe me )

I did complain at the time, but not formally enough- I told my solicitor I was getting really annoyed with the lack of progress. Then when I sorted it out myself relatively quickly I was even more pissed off, but she'd stopped communicating with me at that point. i actually think the case got boring for her or something. She then retired anyway and I think that's why I heard nothing until 2017! And I doubt she would testify I'd complained anyway- doesn't look good for her!

I don't think they should be able to claim full fees as a. they didn't sort the matter out for me (for 4 years prior to 2013!) b. they have pursued the claim in a really aggressive nasty way, and without proper documentation b. I've offered 4k already while off sick from work, which they've turned down.

I just want to submit the bills to the Solicitors Conduct Authority, and if they agree I am not due any sort of compensation or a reduced bill, I'll have to cough up, but its going to take time to save the money up anyway. It seems pretty aggressive of them to try to force me to take out a loan, or take a charge on my house for what for them is a small amount of money.

i guess perhaps I should seek specialist Mental health and debt advice as I'm not sure how aggressive/intrusive they are allowed to get. I suspect the Solicitors Code of Conduct holds them to much higher standards than your average creditor, but they don't seem interested in any of that.

Thanks very much for your attention to my problem.

[Amethyst]

Re: Court Claim - n/a / solicitor - 21-4-2017

As well as defending the case have you actually made a complaint to the SRA or the Legal Onbudsman ?

Have they now provided you with a full break down of the amounts and copies of the invoices they obtained the judgment on ?

Did you receive no invoices at all even before you moved in 2013 ?


SRA Code of Conduct

Fee arrangements with your client

IB(1.13)

discussing whether the potential outcomes of the client's matter are likely to justify the expense or risk involved, including any risk of having to pay someone else's legal fees;
IB(1.14)

clearly explaining your fees and if and when they are likely to change;
IB(1.15)

warning about any other payments for which the client may be responsible;
IB(1.16)

discussing how the client will pay, including whether public funding may be available, whether the client has insurance that might cover the fees, and whether the fees may be paid by someone else such as a trade union;
IB(1.17)

where you are acting for a client under a fee arrangement governed by statute, such as a conditional fee agreement, giving the client all relevant information relating to that arrangement;
IB(1.18)

where you are acting for a publicly funded client, explaining how their publicly funded status affects the costs;
IB(1.19)

providing the information in a clear and accessible form which is appropriate to the needs and circumstances of the client;
IB(1.20)

where you receive a financial benefit as a result of acting for a client, either:

(a)

paying it to the client;
(b)

offsetting it against your fees; or
(c)

keeping it only where you can justify keeping it, you have told the client the amount of the benefit (or an approximation if you do not know the exact amount) and the client has agreed that you can keep it;

IB(1.21)

ensuring that disbursements included in your bill reflect the actual amount spent or to be spent on behalf of the client;

Complaints handling

IB(1.22)

having a written complaints procedure which:

(a)

is brought to clients' attention at the outset of the matter;
(b)

is easy for clients to use and understand, allowing for complaints to be made by any reasonable means;
(c)

is responsive to the needs of individual clients, especially those who are vulnerable;
(d)

enables complaints to be dealt with promptly and fairly, with decisions based on a sufficient investigation of the circumstances;
(e)

provides for appropriate remedies; and
(f)

does not involve any charges to clients for handling their complaints;

IB(1.23)

providing the client with a copy of the firm's complaints procedure on request;
IB(1.24)

in the event that a client makes a complaint, providing them with all necessary information concerning the handling of the complaint.

Acting in the following way(s) may tend to show that you have not achieved these outcomes and therefore not complied with the Principles: