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Active CCJ dispute/set aside

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  • Active CCJ dispute/set aside

    Hello All,

    I am looking for help with a CCJ. Firstly I have read the newbie section and i am working through the useful links posted throughout to setting aside CCJs. However, in addition, i wanted to get any advice given some specifics of my situation (i know the process is largely the same for all).

    I am aware that there will be lots of people with similar threads for asking for parking or CCJ guidance but did not want to litter others with my initial asks and will be happy to close this thread and re-routed elsewhere

    Brief Background
    - Issued a VCS parking fine 17/11/2019
    - The parking fine was correctly administered (i was late back to my car after paying for a ticket).
    - I have taken the ticket and misplaced/forgotten/lost the ticket (i had a heavy travel dependant job and also moved property)
    - I have moved property twice since the contravention
    - Car registered to old address
    - Only became aware of any escalation (and reminded of it) when being notified on credit file of a processed and therefore active CCJ
    - Contacted CCBC to ask for details of this CCJ and contacted excel parking (claimant) and been passed over to Elms (seemingly one man band legal representative)
    - Elms have responded to my requests for all details of the contravention and escalation correspondence via email including payment account details to satisfy the CCJ
    - I have not yet paid off the CCJ as i intend to set aside
    - Elms stated that i would have to get CCBC to provide all/any court documentation (understandable and it hasn't been for the lack of trying- poor responses and tel line with reduced staff and closed offices during covid)
    - I have today finally got through to a person at CCBC working from home. They told me that any court documentation would just be blank forms and have emailed the details essentially just the VCS number that i already had and description of contravention statement and that id have to pay £10 to have something resent. My ask was simply to have any correspondence from Court that may have been posted to my old address to be shared now so that i have everything i need to go and set aside. If i don't need anything here, fine.

    Summary
    I am not contesting the contravention - the original parking fine is valid.
    I am contesting the issuance of a CCJ on the grounds that i have had no escalating correspondence due this being sent to an old address and therefore had no right to reply to address the escalations and issuance in a timely manner to prevent a CCJ. Again, i am not contesting the original parking charge - does this matter? Would this mean i am asking for to pay the original fine settlement of £60 and have the CCJ set aside vs satisfying the CCJ and paying the £185 settlement or would i be appealing the entirety.
    Does the fact i am at fault for losing the original ticket play against me?
    Does the fact i am at fault for not updating car registered addresses quickly enough play against me?
    I have had other correspondence in the past that have all managed to be be sent to my current address despite living elsewhere at the time and have kept my current address as a main source for such reasons. My credit file has also had updated addresses on it and the fact the claimant have not had any contact from me is it right to suggest they haven't done enough from there side?

    On a side note .......I have also lost a highly paid job just as the pandemic hit and have had to move as a result. Whilst time has passed, as soon as i have become aware of this CCJ i have acted to track it down and contact the relevant parties and i am now looking to proceed with anything i can do to get this resolved.

    I have recently cleared off significant amount of persistent debt and on the road to recovering a financial state i once had and yet now i have a CCJ active on my file that is destroying my file and will albeit depreciatingly so impact me greatly for many years as we know. Trust me £185 is a drop in the ocean to what i have been dealing with elsewhere yet its dealing with this that would be life impacting to me.

    Thanks for any advice/thought/answers and pointers to key docs addressing my current bundle of stress appreciated
    Last edited by BlackMagic_; 4th January 2021, 18:36:PM.

  • #2
    So if the parking ticket was from VCS and the claim was from Excel then you are asking for a set aside because the claimant is not correct. Your contract was with VCS but Excel raised the claim when you had no liability towards them. I can't remember the correct word for this situation

    You have updated your V5 details so that can't be held against you.

    You could try to get Excel to agree to a set aside for £100 but they ight not be happy if you present the defence that they had no case. But they might agree if you agree to pay the amount.

    VCS v Excel occurs quite frequently. They are seperate, though connected, companies.

    If you know the ticket was from VCS then a SAR to them to get all the details again. Similar to Excel
    Last edited by ostell; 4th January 2021, 19:59:PM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks Ostell. I didn't even think about this angle as assumed they were a single entity.

      The official claimant is VCS i can confirm that. I was given an excel email address contact via telephone (perhaps incorrectly?) when enquiring, just to confuse things.

      On making contact with litigation/debt assist teams (both excel email addresses) they werent very forthcoming and indeed said the case was now with ELMS legal and i should contact them and sort any payment through them.

      Dont know if this answers your suggestion...

      Comment


      • #4
        OK forget what I said. If the PCN was VCS and the claimant was VCS then all is, unfortunately, in order. So you contact VCS and ask if they will agree to a setaside if you pay the CCJ.

        VCS and Excel, though different companies, seem to share the same offices and do occasionally get mixed up about who is dealing with what.

        Comment


        • #5
          Ok thanks. As a first step before beginning set aside applications, I will contact VCS via the vehiclecontrol.co.uk address i have but suspect i will get the same response (sorry but talk to ELMS) as i did from my contact with the excel litigation address that i was provided. Will try and follow up with a call also.

          For reference below was my initial ask sent to debt and litigation excel.co.uk


          ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Subject: PCN outstanding

          Hello,


          I have been directed to this email contact by the automated payment line.

          I am trying to settle a PCN [OMITTED] CCJ which I have only now become aware of.

          I am NOT contesting the charge as I have seen the correct application of the notice to the vehicle on record ([OMITTED]). The PCN has, over time, unfortunately progressed to a CCJ. I have however received no reminders of payment or court notice of this. Indeed I have also therefore had no receipt of a 'county court pack' mentioned to me on the automated phone line or related correspondence, as I assume from my credit records this has been sent to an old/previous registered address which has been updated post the contravention.

          I am now therefore asking for the following:

          - A method to allow me to pay/settle the PCN.
          - Any related escalation correspondence mentioned above (e.g notification/court notices etc) be forwarded to the following address:
          [OMITTED NEW ADDRESS]

          - Steps (if available) to dispute/request this CCJ notice is rescinded on settlement of the PCN

          Comment


          • #6
            You are not asking to pay as that will not remove the CCJ just flag it as settled.

            Look at the "Set Aside Application" in the shortcut panel on this page.

            Comment


            • #7
              Set Aside Application

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks. Sorry perhaps not clear. I am fully aware that a set aside is what i want and need to rid a CCJ and that full payment simply constitutes 'settled' status not ridding the CCJ - this is why i have not paid anything to date.

                The correspondence mail i sent to excel was simply me initially contacting the claimant to try and see if they would cooperate given the circumstances if i settled the the charge- to Ostell's point of contacting VCS to seek agreement of a set aside.

                As mentioned earlier on Ostell advice i will give them (VCS) an opportunity to respond to whether they agree to set aside on payment of the CCJ and in the meantime start on the set aside Application links (thanks).

                Appreciate the guidance on this.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Is there a most recommended/best example of both a SAR and request for agreement to a set-aside if you pay the CCJ? thanks

                  Others have suggested i send a SAR to VCS DPO. Do you agree?

                  Do i have to then wait and allow 30 days for a response? (I am not comfortable waiting this long given the need to press on with an application).

                  Below is a SAR email i will send (i have omitted personal info] is this satisfactory in your mind?

                  Should i be sending a seperate simple email to VCS DPO asking whether VCS willing to agree to a set aside if i settle the full CCJ payment (NOT JUST THE ORIGINAL FINE AMOUNT)





                  Dear Sir or Madam

                  Subject access request (Data Protection Act 2018 / General Data Protection Regulations (GDPR))

                  I am writing in regards to VCS contravention [id insert]

                  Name:

                  Address:

                  Previous Address:

                  Previous Address:

                  Please supply the data about me that I am entitled to under data protection law relating to myself.

                  If you need any more data from me to confirm my identity please let me know as soon as possible. It may be helpful for you to know that data protection law requires you to respond to a request for data within one calendar month.

                  If you need advice on dealing with this request, the Information Commissioner’s Office can assist you. Its website is ico.org.uk or it can be contacted on 0303 123 1113.

                  Yours faithfully



                  Last edited by BlackMagic_; 5th January 2021, 20:36:PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi,
                    I have gone back to VCS and their legal representative in an attempt to seek their consent to a set aside on payment of the CCJ charge. They have responded and agreed to this. (see below)
                    Any advice/comments on this?
                    Thank you


                    Thank you for your email,

                    Once the payment for the £185.00 was made we would be able to sign a consent order for the matter to be set aside,



                    To make the application you will need to fill in an N244 Form, once completed if you could send this across to us so that we can review this and advise of any amendments.

                    Once this is fully completed we will then be able to send you an example consent order to be completed. Once this has been filled in by yourself we can pass this over to be signed so that you can send this off to the court,

                    If you have any queries in relation to this please do not hesitate to contact us

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      You've definitely not done yourself any favours by admitting that you won't contest the charge. Even though you might have been late returning to your car, there is a legal criteria that VCS would need to comply with (and they would need to prove those requirements have been met) you have sort of ruled yourself out of a defence, which is one of the ways to get a CCJ set aside. The bar is really not that high but you have definitely scuppered those chances I think. Sometimes, it's best not to divulge certain things all at once unless you have to.

                      So you seem to be left with the limited option of setting aside the CCJ by relying on CPR 13.2 which is a mandatory set aside where there has been some irregular procedural error. You would have to argue that VCS did not take reasonable steps to ascertain your current address and the lack of response should have given them cause to think that you may not be living at that address.

                      It's fairly standard of parking companies to require payment before they will consent but by definition, a payment of a judgment debt will be deemed as an admission of liability. You can pay them as part of the set aside conditions or you can tell them no and issue an application yourself and seek a set aside. A lot of these companies don't tend to show up for a hearing like this unless they've got some solid evidence which means you could have a better chance of getting it set aside but don't count on it. Either way, I would suggest you don't make the payment.
                      If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
                      - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                      LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                      Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi Rob thanks for your post. I couldn't agree more i have made a stupid mistake in my comms to the claimant representative when trying to seek consent and left myself in a right dilemma. At this stage i am hoping i haven't completely scuppered my chances based on that alone.

                        1) Thanks for the guidance re mandatory 13.2 set aside. I have drawn up my N244 application form and have drafted a witness statement (shown below). Would it be possible for yourself /others to cast an eye over it and i would greatly appreciate any comments/suggestions if any. (I have incorporated filing under 13.2).

                        2) I need to go back to the claimant as per the email correspondence above with my N244 (really need to do this Monday!). Question. Do i have to also share with them my WS also? They haven't specifically asked but would they expect it?

                        3) Your last point re payment is a dilemma for me as i am struggling to decide what to do on that front. I understand that not paying is usually the preferred/advised option. I find it frustrating as the logic would surely mean any consent with payment is seen as admittance of liability when the facts detailed could argue otherwise but hey

                        - I have agreed with the claimant a consenting set aside on payment of the charge. i feel obliged to uphold this but of course don't want to hinder my case.
                        - Would going back on this even be an option or be used against me potentially (unsure of how i would even do this e.g on further review of the facts, context, documentation and legal consultation i no longer wish to pay the full charges as i feel they were not properly served and would like to apply for a mandatory set aside etc or something similar)
                        - Would I have any less chance by proceeding with the current consented set aside N244 WS and settlement (as i have agreed to do).


                        Thanks in advance


                        IN THE NORTHAMPTON COUNTY COURT BUSINESS CENTRE
                        Claim No. XXXXX

                        BETWEEN:
                        VEHICLE CONTROL SERVICES (VCS) LTD


                        Claimant
                        – and –
                        Defendant
                        XXXX


                        _________________________________
                        WITNESS STATEMENT OF XXXX
                        _________________________________
                        I, MR XXXX of 8 XXXX, being the Defendant in this case will state as follows;
                        1. I make this Witness Statement in support of the application for an order that the judgment in this case (Claim No. XXXXXJudgment dated 22/06/2020) be set aside.

                        2: 13.2 The court must set aside(GL) a judgment entered under Part 12 if judgment was wrongly entered because–

                        (a) in the case of a judgment in default of an acknowledgment of service, any of the conditions in rule 12.3(1) and 12.3(3) was not satisfied;
                        (b) in the case of a judgment in default of a defence, any of the conditions in rule 12.3(2) and 12.3(3) was not satisfied; or
                        (c) the whole of the claim was satisfied before judgment was entered.

                        3. I understand the claimant obtained a default Judgment against me as the defendant on 22/06/2020. However, this default Judgment has not been served at my current address. I only learnt of the existence of this claim on the 05/12/20 when I performed a check on my credit report which indicated a CCJ.

                        4. I have never received any correspondence from the claimant leading up to this Judgment, therefore I was never able to challenge or respond to the original charge, subsequent demands nor the default Judgment.

                        5. I have never received any correspondence and at no point prior to the filed date of the default 22/06/2020 did I have any contact with the claimant with regards to this contravention. It is my view that the claimant has therefore behaved unreasonably by not ensuring that they used my correct contact details and that I therefore have not had the right of reply to any escalating correspondence as a result.

                        6. I suggest the claimant did not make reasonable enquiries as to my current address before pursing the court order especially considering they had good reason to believe they did not hold my current contact details. Indeed, considering they received no response from me to their correspondence, this should have been a clear indication of the obsolescence of the address used.

                        4. My address changed to a short-term residency from 08/03/2019 for which I can provide proof via a tenancy agreement [Exhibit A]. During this period, I updated my electoral roll registration and credit details before moving to my current permanent address as of 17/10/2019. I have also had my license updated through DVLA and a forwarding service in place at previous addresses should there be missed post. The original contravention occurred on the 17/11/2019 by which time the registered keeper details were yet to be updated to my current permanent address. Nevertheless, had reasonable action been made to check associated addresses prior to the default judgment filing, the claimant would have been able to contact me and I would have been able to receive and respond to the correspondence. It should also be noted that it is not uncommon or unreasonable occurrence and that government acknowledge that escalating parking enforcements should not exploit this.

                        5. At the time of the original contravention, parking evidence shows that I had paid for a display & pay ticket to which I was late to return from a hospital visit, showing that there was no deliberate disregard of parking parameters or intention to avoid paying at the site. It should also be noted that at the time of the contravention my employment required significant travel and periods of stay around the UK and given the details provided in this statement, I have still therefore made timely and reasonable effort to both update and put correspondence measures in place with regards to my residency.

                        6. On becoming aware of the Judgment on 05/12/2020 I have taken timely action. I have been timely to find out the details for which the Judgment relates. This despite being significantly impacted both professionally and personally by the current Covid-19 pandemic. This has included contacting CCBC and the claimant themselves by both phone and email. This has also been particularly challenging given the vastly reduced staff and working hours currently experienced at CCBC, admitted and highlighted by CCBC themselves through their automated re-route responses [EXHIBIT B].

                        6: On 17/12/2020 I received email response from the claimant informing me that the case was with the claimant’s legal representative and that all correspondence must be through the legal representative [EXHIBIT C]. On the 22/12/2020 I received by email from the claimant’s representative, all of the correspondence documentation which had been sent to my old address to which I had not been able to respond. [EXHIBIT D]. It should be noted that this also included issuance to me of small print contract between the claimant and the company occupying the site [EXHIBIT E]. I dispute its use against me as I would not have been aware of the wording of this contract nor do I know the means by which it has come into force in my case. I also question the section 2 “the Term” entered which states fixed 12 months from 8th day of September 2017 which the contravention would have been outside.

                        7. On 06/01/2020 I received an email from the claimants legal representative consenting to the Judgment be set aside on settlement of the Judgment charge. [EXHIBIT F]

                        8. Considering this witness statement and claimant consent I therefore respectfully request that the Court sets aside the judgment in this claim.
                        Statement of Truth
                        I, XXXX, the Defendant, believe the facts stated within this Witness Statement to be true.
                        Signed: ________________________________
                        Dated: ________________________________

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          1. If there is a consent order to set aside the CCJ then a witness statement is not necessary. You simply file the N244 and consent order together.

                          What have you written in question 3 of the N244 form?

                          2. Don't need to share the WS and don't need one as per above.

                          3. Yes, technically a consent order would amount to an admission but the difference is that in the eyes of the law, the admitted judgment debt is satisfied, whereas when you set aside the CCJ, legal proceedings are still ongoing as it reverts back to the defence stage and there no CCJ is recorded since it was settled before the judgment date.

                          What you would be doing is trying to remove a debt that has been satisfied, or in the eyes or many, trying to repair their credit file. Here's a few point's of references

                          - The Registry Trust manages all CCJs and in their FAQs it says that a court will only cancel a CCJ if it was in error, paid before the court date or if the judgment amount was paid within one calendar month of the judgment. Otherwise the judgment is considered as satisfied.

                          - In the County Court Business Code of Practice (this is no longer available on HMCTS website but I believe still in force) has a comment about set aside applications:

                          "Note: Applications should contain legitimate grounds and should not simply serve to remove the defendant's name from the Register of Judgments, Orders and Fines. Such applications will not be granted and will be referred to the district judge."

                          - The legislation which governs registrations of CCJs is The Register of Judgments, Orders and Fines Regulations 2005. It makes it clear that judgments will be cancelled if the debt is satisfied within one month or otherwise set aside and reversed (See Regs. 11 & 16).

                          So that is the legal position but it is not uncommon for people to find themselves in the situation where they pay the debt first and then suddenly realise the consequences after the fact. What you are trying to do is unilaterally create an order to suit your own personal requirements which, as above, appears contrary to the law - you either pay the judgment debt or you make an application to set aside but you can't do both as that is an anomaly.

                          Having said that, I have seen some successful set asides on this forum and some that haven't (because the judges have considered payment as the matter being closed and final). It is simply the risk one has to take and hope it doesn't land on the desk of a knowledgeable court officer or a judge who wants to inquire the reason for setting aside if payment has already been made. Otherwise you will need to explain yourself and that's where it gets tricky.

                          Personally, I would make the application to set aside via CPR 13.2 on a mandatory basis and get VCS to defend it and explain how they have complied with service of the claim form. That means time and money on their part which is something they probably want to avoid since they probably wouldn't want to risk wiping out their profits if they lose i.e. having to pay the £255 application fee.
                          If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
                          - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                          LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                          Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Thanks Rob, very useful. Although still a tricky decision for me to make therefore . Thanks for providing your viewpoint and recommendation.

                            To your point 1) thanks for clarifying WS not necessary for a consent set aside. Whilst this may be the case could it do any harm to submit one anyway - would it perhaps be taken into account and help?

                            for question 3 on n244 I stated :

                            An order that the Judgment in Default be Set Aside pursuant to CPR 13.3 and the original Claim be dismissed, with no order as to costs. The Defendant only discovered the Judgment when making a credit report check and has acted promptly in filing this application and for their part, the Claimant has accepted that service of this claim was defective (due to an old address being used). See attached consent.

                            however this is when writing with intention of filing under 13.3 which we are now not since eligible for 13.2. Any suggestions here would be appreciated.

                            As a side and just to note, I will be applying with court fees waived due to me currently not working. I’m wondering whether this would actually encourage VCS to fight/defend it to you last point as they wouldn’t have a court fee to pay or would they still be liable for costs?

                            my remaining questions now would be

                            1) from my previous post, do you have any comments on my WS should I use that for my mandatory set aside?
                            2)is it frowned upon to mention the impact of this judgment on things like employment etc?
                            3) now that I have agreed consent and payment with VCS how do you advise i go back as I am changing my position in their eyes?

                            Apologies for the questions, just not wishing to make any more silly mistakes and anxious to have this submitted.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              To your point 1) thanks for clarifying WS not necessary for a consent set aside. Whilst this may be the case could it do any harm to submit one anyway - would it perhaps be taken into account and help?
                              As I've already mentioned, sometimes less is more particularly when you are on the back foot. If you start supplementing your application to set aside with a witness statement, it will need to be read by a judge and then that judge might have questions for you before he or she decides whether to allow the set aside. Consent applications are for the most part, a rubber stamp process because the parties have already agreed to an arrangement and the court will usually give effect to that. However, when you start introducing additional information or other elements to mix, that's when things can go wrong for you.

                              I would seriously caution against including a witness statement but it is your application and therefore your decision, so if it doesn't go your way then the blame falls squarely at your door. If you still insist on submitting one, then I'll take a read and provide feedback.

                              As for your other questions, I don't think the impact of the judgment will have much of an effect because you had an opportunity to make the application without paying but you chose not to and so your actions have consequences. I would expect a judge might question you around this point.

                              Very easy to go back to VCS and change your position. You can say you have looked into it further and are advised that if you agree to pay before making the application then the debt is deemed satisfied and could hurt your chances of getting it set aside. You also mention that you don't believe they took steps to ascertain your last known address and that gives grounds for a mandatory set aside, where the court must set aside the default judgment because it was an irregular judgment. You can enclose the consent order and mention that if they refuse then you will make the application anyway and seeks costs which is likely to exceed what they are claiming, so therefore it would be prudent for them to agree to this compromise.

                              I would probably also revise what you've inserted in Q3 too on a less is more perspective.

                              Happy to assist in the drafting but you need to decide what you want to do first.

                              If you have a question about the voluntary termination process, please read this guide first, as it should have all the answers you need. Please do not hijack another person's thread as I will not respond to you
                              - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
                              LEGAL DISCLAIMER
                              Please be aware that this is a public forum and is therefore accessible to anyone. The content I post on this forum is not intended to be legal advice nor does it establish any client-lawyer type relationship between you and me. Therefore any use of my content is at your own risk and I cannot be held responsible in any way. It is always recommended that you seek independent legal advice.

                              Comment

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