17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

[fuzzybrain]

Please may I ask for some advice on how to deal with this.

My daughter (who is 17) and her friends mostly 17 and a couple who are 16 went to our local Brewers Fayre for a meal after going bowling. Her friends and her have eaten at this etsablishment before and without any problems.

This is however they were asked to leave as they were under 18 and did not have an adult supervising them. They were only ordering food and did not at anytime ask for or indcate that they wanted anything alcoholic. The manageress was rude to them and made them leave (not in a particularly pleasant manner either!)

I, along with several of the other mother's have contacted this managress, i was the third, and i get the feeling the manageress wasn't happy about being called! The conversation didn't start well when she accused me of already calling her, which I stated I hadn't and this call must have been one of the the other very angry mothers - and there are 6 of us!!! I asked why she refused to serve my daughter food and she said that under 18 years are not allowed to order food if they are unaccompanied by an adult (somebody over 18) I stated i was surprised as they had previously eaten there without this concern and she said that has never happened - that she had been the manageress for 7 years and it is a licencing law. I asked where were the signs that stated this and why is it not mentioned on their website and she said that as the licencee she has a right to serve who she wishes and she will not serve food to under 18 year olds.

The manageress did confirm that at no time was my daughter or her friend's behaviour was of any concern that none of them were rude or misbehaved

She denied that she had asked my daughter to leave, to which i replied that you didn't allow her to stay and order food thus the only conclusion that i can draw from that is that she was asked to leave and that was the impression the party got also. I asked why she was discriminating against them and asked if their behaviour had warrented removal from the premises - she quoted the "as the licencee she has a right to serve who she wishes and she will not serve food to under 18 year olds" line.

The manageress was trying to hold her temper with me on the phone but I could tell she was getting wound up as she told me to stop intimindating her when i asked who i need to write an official complaint to. when i asked her to explain what she meant she said i was trying to get my own back on her by making a complaint and by asking for the details of head office was such a bully tactic to frighten her.

I guess the question is despite how it was done, is there any rule which would prevent my daughter ordering food and soft drinks at Brewers Fayre without being 18?

[ploddertom]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

http://www.pubs.com/main_site/herita...bs_and_the_law

[bluebottle]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

Whilst the licensee has the right to serve whoever they so choose, her interpretation of licensing law sounds a little off-kilter. A person below the age of 18 years is permitted to drink beer, perry or porter (heavy beer) with a meal. If the Brewer's Fayre premises has a restaurant licence only, this rule should apply. If it has a full licence (consumption of intoxicating liquor on and off the premises), then it is a different matter. To the best of my knowledge and belief, Brewer's Fayre is owned by Mitchell & Butler, whose senior management can be just as stroppy and rude as their managers. I would suggest you and the other mothers all write to the CEO of Mitchell & Butler and lodge formal complaints against this manageress. She clearly has an attitude problem and is going to do Mitchell & Butler's corporate image no end of harm. If your daughter and her friends only wanted to order meals, that is six paying customers the manageress turned away.

[michael]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

They're part of Whitbread.

Andy Harrison	Chief Executive
E-mail	andy.harrison@whitbread.com
Telephone	01582 499499
Website	http://www.whitbread.co.uk

[fuzzybrain]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

http://www.pubs.com/main_site/herita...bs_and_the_law

Thank you for the link, but they made it very clear they only wanted to order food, they never asked or mentioned alcohol.

The manageress stated to me that it was illegal and she would be breaking licensing laws she if she served food to them. Is this correct or is this her interpretation of the law?

The other mums are just as angry as I am and they are going to complain, but we are not communicating about pur complaints as we don't want them to be carbon copies and they fob this off as a witch hunt, which they would do if they were too similar (I've been accused of this one already by the mangeress!)

[fuzzybrain]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

They're part of Whitbread.

Andy Harrison	Chief Executive
E-mail	andy.harrison@whitbread.com
Telephone	01582 499499
Website	http://www.whitbread.co.uk

Thank you for this - guess who is getting a call and email tomorrow........

[bluebottle]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

Like I said, Fuzzy, the manageress either needs retraining or pointing in the direction of the nearest Jobcentre.

[fuzzybrain]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

I'd prefer to boot the little *&%^% all the way there myself. I am seriously peed off about this. My daughter and her friends are all very shy polite girls and they were in tears after being removed. They felt like criminals and it ruined a lovely day out for them.

They walked a mile to the next resurant - which was a hungry horse, where they were welcomed and they had a meal with no problems. Same type of venue, just different (and human) staff

[wales01man]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

As an ex landlord i think there is more to this than we are being told,I always thought any business restaurant and shop can refuse entry as long as it is not discrimatory do we really know how the youngsters behaving and did even one of them try to buy alcohol.
the OP should realise when they are noy with their parents they do behave differently more so when theres a few of them>
I have to wonder what they expect to come from this a freebie maybe what else can happen?

[CleverClogs]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

I wonder if they will wish to use that hostile hostelry when they are older.

[Inca]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

Don't hold your breath waiting for a reply Fuzz...i complained to BF 3 weeks ago.

[bluebottle]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

Unfortunately, misinterpretation of licensing law is not just restricted to Brewer's Fayre. I have witnessed management and staff at major supermarkets come out with statements that have no relation to what the law says. My gut-feeling is that they have taken advice from commercial lawyers who have very limited or no knowledge of licensing law. I have seen the same happen with sales of DVDs. Commercial lawyers should stick to advising clients on Commercial Law and leave advice on other areas of the law to legal professionals working in those other areas of the law.

[fuzzybrain]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

As an ex landlord i think there is more to this than we are being told,I always thought any business restaurant and shop can refuse entry as long as it is not discrimatory do we really know how the youngsters behaving and did even one of them try to buy alcohol.
the OP should realise when they are noy with their parents they do behave differently more so when theres a few of them>
I have to wonder what they expect to come from this a freebie maybe what else can happen?

I am not a naive mum with blinkers on who thinks the sun shines out of unmentionable places in her children. I know their faults and their assests and believe I'd be the first to tear a strip off her if i thought for a millisecond she had been rude or disrespectful.

I gave a correct and full picture, I am well aware children behave differently in when woth their friends, but these are 6 of the quietest, polite manner teenagers i know. My daughter is very respectful and its not in her nature to cause problems, she just isn't capable of it - i know that any mother says that but if you knew her, you would know its just not in her nature to be troublesome. Plus she hates alcohol - she had a drink on holiday last year in Turkey and was violently sick after half a glass and vowed she would never drink again and hasn't - despite many offers at xmas etc.

However i accept there is also an exception to the rule and so i did ask the manageress who refused them service if the girls behaviour was of concern, if they were disruptive, loud, abusive or causing problems for other customers and she said no that they were well behaved and polite - even when they were asked to leave they did not become aggresive or argumentative or cause a scene. She also confirmed that none of them asked for alcohol and had not attempted to order alcohol either. Her issue was that they were under 18 and she didn't want under 18 years in her establishment without an adult present - she said it was againist licencing laws.


We have a witness of somebody that knows the girls who was dining in the restuarent at the time and tried to help them by saying he would over see them and be responsible for them and place an order for food for them but the manageress wouldn't allow that either. He has confirmed that the girls behaviour was polite and respectful towards the manageress and he has also made a complainy about the way the girls were spoken to and how the whole situtaion was handled by the manageress.

What do I want to achieve? For this situtaion never to happen to another group of teenagers that just wanted a meal and a catch up. For the to know that its not ok for them to be treated as they were and that as her mum I will always support and back her if she has been mistreated. Should I allow my daughter treated in such a manner that left her feeling embarrassed and humilated an in tears? I want an apology from the manageress to the girls and an admission that she dealt with the situation badly.

I am not a freeebie hunter looking to get something for nothing and if my daughter was given any vouchers etc she has already said that she will donate them to charity as she is not interested in profiting from this. My daughter recently donated 12 inches of her hair to charity (he hair is her pride and joy) because a ten year old girl we know has been diagnosed with cancer and has lost her hair and she wanted to do something to make her smile. When we sent the hair donation in she actually stated that she wanted the certificate to go to the little girl with cancer as she was the brave one, all she did was have her hair cut.

My daughter is modest, beautiful and caring young lady I know and did not deserve to be treated in public like this - If i don't make a stand on her behalf then I am re enforcing the manageress behaviour as being correct and my daughter deserved the public humilation she was subjected to. Sorry, but I'm a better mum than that!!!

[wales01man]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

Even the best behaved from the best families can stray/i just wrote my post from experience as a landlord even the best in society can do wrong maybe not in your daughters case but many do its human nature none of us are perfect im not nor are my sons,
Good luck with your complaint but i always understood no one has an automatic right to go in a shop retaurant or wherever i think the manageress needs better training but still think she was within her rights

[Inca]

Re: 17 daughter and 5 friends refused food at brewers fayre

Many moons ago,when God was a child,,I ran a bar frequented by both active and retired Forces personnel.
A young chap,just back from basic training came in with his parents,he was 17. At 17 years old this boy could smoke,have sex,etc all 'teenage things' and could be sent to fight for our country at a moments notice yet I could not allow him to drink alcohol on the premises.
Sometimes,,the law bemuses me.