Our Ironing has been stolen - SETTLED

[Sapphire]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Received this letter today:

With reference to your claim, the Council is prepared to offer the sum of £629.50 on an indemnity basis, towards the cost of replacing the damaged item(s)
If this amount is acceptable to you, please read and complete the top section of the attached form in front of an independant witness, who must complete the lower section.

Blah Blah Blah the rest is normal.

[Sapphire]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Have had a think and sent this back :

Thank you for your letter dated 4 December 2007 and note your kind offer of £629.50 which is exactly 50% of the total value of the claim.
However to replace the missing items would cost us un excess of the figure we are claiming and therefore regret I feel unable to accept your offer, bearing in mind that the majority of the items were relatively new and had hardly been worn or used.
Could you please therefore look into this matter and I await your further communication regarding full settlement.

sapphire

[Guest]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

If they refuse to increase their offer, what will you do next?

[Sapphire]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Errrrrr havn't thought that far forward to be honest. I'm hoping that they will see the error of their ways and increase the offer to at least 75%. Our argument is that we didn't buy 'cheap' stuff at the beginning so why should we be expected to now, and it is their fault isn't it. Hopefully they will just up the offer.

sapphire

[Guest]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

My personal opinion is that their offer is already more than generous and if they decide to call your bluff, you need to know what to do next.

If you were to take this as far as a court claim, the onus would be on you to prove and quantify your losses as in this case, the burden of proving your loss rests with you, the claimant - he who asserts must prove.

However, there are a number of problems with that. For example, a cursory search on Google reveals Reebok polo shirts for as little as £11.99 yet you are claiming £25 each and Reebok T-shirts are even less, yet you are claiming £35 each. You would need to show that they cost you £25 and £35 and that you cannot buy them for less, should this be challenged. You would need to do that with each and every item.

The sum of compensation that may be paid to you is limited to the loss you suffered. Under CPR you also have a duty to mitigate your loss. Losses that are not mitigated do not have to be paid by the defendant, thus reducing any sum that they may have to pay. Mitigation in this respect relates to the cost of replacing the goods at the best possible price, not replacing them at any price, depending on where you may choose to shop.

Furthermore, mitigation also relates to the notion that you are not entitled to recover those damages represented by sums that are avoidable by taking reasonable steps. If you have failed to take reasonable steps to avoid particular losses, you are not entitled in law to recover them, as you are not entitled to profit from your own neglect. This neglect may take the form of either failing to take reasonable steps or performing or allowing an act to take place that would have increased loss. In other words, you must also accept some responsibility for leaving almost £1300 worth of clothing, in a bin liner in your porch for anyone to come and take without your knowledge.

You have admitted that you did not buy "cheap" stuff at the beginning and so I would point out that, given that none of it was "cheap" why did you leave it, unattended, in a bin liner in your porch when you knew a binman was calling?

A court claim is not a means of turning a loss into a profit, or obtaining a windfall. The level of recovery is the loss to you of the clothes at their present value, which is very hard to determine.

I would urge you to think carefully about your next steps before you reject this offer as it may not be made again and you could end up having to issue a claim, with the attendant risks present in any litigation.

[Sapphire]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Thank you for your post Cetelco you have given me much to think about. I will answer your points one at a time if I can.

However, there are a number of problems with that. For example, a cursory search on Google reveals Reebok polo shirts for as little as £11.99 yet you are claiming £25 each and Reebok T-shirts are even less, yet you are claiming £35 each. You would need to show that they cost you £25 and £35 and that you cannot buy them for less, should this be challenged. You would need to do that with each and every item.

Yes I agree with you on that point and I did indeed look on google for prices, but found that to purchase the Reebok polo and T-shirts at those cut prices, would mean having to go to 'cut price shops' who generally sell seconds of inferior quality, and as Les and I had paid 'full' price for them I genuinely think that we should be entitled to be able to replace them like for like.

The sum of compensation that may be paid to you is limited to the loss you suffered. Under CPR you also have a duty to mitigate your loss. Losses that are not mitigated do not have to be paid by the defendant, thus reducing any sum that they may have to pay. Mitigation in this respect relates to the cost of replacing the goods at the best possible price, not replacing them at any price, depending on where you may choose to shop.


By saying mitigate I take it that you mean 'prove', well how many people keep receipts for months on end just in case they have to return the goods, claim or whatever.

Furthermore, mitigation also relates to the notion that you are not entitled to recover those damages represented by sums that are avoidable by taking reasonable steps. If you have failed to take reasonable steps to avoid particular losses, you are not entitled in law to recover them, as you are not entitled to profit from your own neglect. This neglect may take the form of either failing to take reasonable steps or performing or allowing an act to take place that would have increased loss. In other words, you must also accept some responsibility for leaving almost £1300 worth of clothing, in a bin liner in your porch for anyone to come and take without your knowledge


I think that as I have a driveway of 45ft, and the fact that our porchway is enclosed behind glass sliding doors, also that the bag was placed inside the porch behind the sliding doors, and that my car which is a very large model, is parked in front of the doorway blocking the view of the door from the beginning of the drive, shows that I have not just left a bag unattended for anyone to just grab and walk away.

You have admitted that you did not buy "cheap" stuff at the beginning and so I would point out that, given that none of it was "cheap" why did you leave it, unattended, in a bin liner in your porch when you knew a binman was calling?

Surely anyone is entitled to leave their goods anywhere on their property without having to worry about the binman taking it away. Isn't it true that binmen are not 'allowed' to take anything away from inside your property and as I had not asked for them to take anything from my home or driveway then they have indeed broken the rules. The reason the binman came to my door was to collect a gratuity for taking away my neighbours old wardrobe and nothing else, there was no indication that the bag was for the binman to collect it was sitting in the porch and not on the side of the road.

A court claim is not a means of turning a loss into a profit, or obtaining a windfall. The level of recovery is the loss to you of the clothes at eir present value, which is very hard to determine.

I agree with you totally and am in no way trying to profit from this incident, in fact I believe that after all of this we will still be out of pocket and agree with you that it will be very hard so.

I would urge you to think carefully about your next steps before you reject this offer as it may not be made again and you could end up having to issue a claim, with the attendant risks present in any litigation.

We did think very hard about this and felt that 50% of the total value was slightly low considering the amount of money that we have lost, that is why we have replied asking them to reconsider, and to be honest if they come back with a slightly higher offer then we will most probably accept it. You know that as a general rule of thumb there is usually a low first offer and then usually a slightly higher offer follows. Anyway I suppose the worst thing is that I have had a brainstorm and posted the refusal letter now anyway so its too late to worry isn't it, and will have to wait and see what comes back.

Thank you so much for your comments Cetelco, its nice to be able to discuss this with you hun.

sapphire
Today 15:33:PM

[Guest]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Reebok is a global brand and is owned by Reebok International Ltd which in turn is a subsidiary of ****** AG and this year alone Reebok have spent over £2M per month on marketing.

They do not sell seconds of inferior quality.

Where you purchased them from will not matter - Reebok is Reebok and you cannot claim £35 for a second hand T-shirt when the most expensive, brand new T-shirt that Reebok sell, on their own official site here is £39.99.

Mitigate in this context means to lessen or make less severe and in relation to your loss and in turn your possible subsequent claim it means that you must do all that you can to ensure that you do not claim more than you have lost or more than your loss is worth today, not what it may have cost you when you purchased the items originally. Furthermore, you must be sure that you did nothing negligent that might have lead to this situation occurring.

Nobody stole from you per se and as has been suggested above, the binman probably thought he was doing you a favour in collecting a bin liner from an address he had been directed to call at.

Sometimes we need protecting from ourselves and I just want you to know what you will have to go through if the Council decide to dig their heels in and force you to issue a claim for this.

[Sapphire]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Blimey you're making me worry now, do you think I should phone them tomorrow and accept the offer, or 'chance it' and hope for a better offer. Blimey I won't sleep now for thinking of you and what you have said.

sapphire

[thephoenix]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

Hiya saff hun,

If you have already sent the letter for them to reconsider the offer, I would just wait for their reply. I doubt they will retract the offer, they will either say ' nope thats it £629.50 and no more' or increase it.
Then decide. :santa:

Oh and don't worry yourself over it.....that'll do you no good babe.

[Sapphire]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen

They increased the offer to £800 and we have accepted it on condition that the cheque is sent by return of post.

Job done I think.

saffy

[Tools]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen - SETTLED

Well done Sapphy for sticking to your guns.

[enaid]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen - SETTLED

:snowlol: Nice one Sappy, not the full amount but I think you did ok really and it will go a long way if you hang on for the sales.

[WendyB]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen - SETTLED

Good news Sapphy. Hang on for the sales then blitz the shops.:cheers:

[Amethyst]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen - SETTLED

Well done Sappherella xxxxxxxxxxx

[thephoenix]

Re: Our Ironing has been stolen - SETTLED

nice result sapphy :kisself: ...... January sales here you come............:ho: