Can I get a abandoned van removed from my driveway when the owner refuses to do so?

[RageSloth]

I agreed to let someone have use of my driveway for a few months. His small van has been there for 6 months now. Recently hunted him down and he's refusing to move it. Is it within my rights to get it towed to the side of the road or at least to the vehicle's registed address? The vehicle was untaxed as of 6 weeks ago, last MOT 2 years ago. I think this counts as abandoned, I gave him a one week ultimatum saying if he doesnt move it by that time, then I will.

Thanks.

[des8]

You need to act with compliance to theTorts (Intererence with Goods) Act 1977 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1977/32/contents)
Schedule 1 applies so suggest you read it.

Basically you need to write (recorded) to him telling him to move it or you will dispose of it.
You need to obtain the best price possible (rom your description it sounds like scrap value but usually it is via auction)
From the price obtained you can deduct your expenses, but the balance goes to the owner.

Don't just move van on to the road... it is uninsured and you will be liable if it is involved in an accident.

Depending on how you deal with it, DVLA might need to be informed of change of keeper or scrapping

[islandgirl]

I have used the Torts Act several times and it usually works - it is amazing how quickly people crawl out of the woodwork when they think their goods will be sold...I would do a signed for letter and a letter with proof of postage (free) from 2 different post offices. Often people refuse signed for mail. There can be then no doubt legally that it arrived. May be overkill but a) ensures proof of delivery and b) makes the owner think you are very serious!

[R0b]

You need to act with compliance to theTorts (Intererence with Goods) Act 1977 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1977/32/contents)
Schedule 1 applies so suggest you read it.

Basically you need to write (recorded) to him telling him to move it or you will dispose of it.
You need to obtain the best price possible (rom your description it sounds like scrap value but usually it is via auction)
From the price obtained you can deduct your expenses, but the balance goes to the owner.

Don't just move van on to the road... it is uninsured and you will be liable if it is involved in an accident.

Depending on how you deal with it, DVLA might need to be informed of change of keeper or scrapping

Des I'm sure we've talked about this before but can you point me in the direction of the law that says the person responsible for moving the car is liable? I've got a relevant issue and I'm still convinced there would be no liability so long as it was parked safely on a public highway rather than ditched in the middle of the road causing an obstruction.

[des8]

For starters there is sec 143 of RTA 1988 which requires a person using a vehicle on the highway to have third party insurance in place.
A person placing a vehicle on the highway is using it, even if it is only for parking.
The law is clear that it is the user who needs insurance (and this is as well as the registered keeper's duty for licencing etc!)

If a parked car is responsible for damaging third party property (late handbrake failure for example) the person who parked the vehicle, even if not the owner is liable.
i dealt with a case many years ago where that happened.
The last person to drive the vehicle was driving under his own insurance, as the owner's insurance only covered the owner.
The hand brake was applied when the car was parked on a slight slope.
The driver was unaware that the rear discs would shrink as they cooled off and the brake could fail. You can guess what happened!
Te third party claim was paid by the driver's insurance.
Damage to the driven car was not covered as the driving other cars is limited to third party
The owner's insurers paid for the damage to his car and considered proceding against the driver to recover their loss,

I should probably have worded the warning better
Perhaps "if it is uninsured you may liable if it causes an accident or loss to a third party"

[R0b]

Thanks

Personally, I can't see that there is much more of a risk than normal if the car was moved.

I guess the first question to understand is how the vehicle is going to be moved. If the OP has a key to the car or intends to break the glass in order to move it him/herself then the requirement of third party insurance would apply. But if the OP were to instruct someone else i.e. a recovery company to move it (or anyone for that matter), then surely any liability would transfer to the recovery company, not the OP.

As for the liability if the vehicle causes damage, I guess that depends on what lens your looking at it from whether civil or criminal. From a criminal point, 'driving' means physical acts i.e. hands on the steering wheel and guiding it but I can't find anything to suggest that moving the vehicle from one site to another constitutes driving.

From a civil point, I guess it's possible but for me, liability would depend on the facts. Common sense would suggest that parking a vehicle on a hill could reasonably cause damage so the OP could put take reasonable steps to prevent any damage occurring i.e. parking stumps or chock wheels at the front/back of the vehicle. I'd also be pointing the finger to the owner of the vehicle for failing to maintain it should it ever get to that stage... You have a right to remove items that are trespassing on your property so that should also be taken into account as to liability.

Ultimately it is a risk, but isn't everything these days? It comes down to the OP to decide what he wants to do, either sit and hang around with the vehicle on the drive or take steps to remove it and recover the costs from the owner via legal proceedings. Also to mitigate any potential liability for the vehicle causing damage, I'd be reporting the vehicle 5 minutes after it's removed from the drive if the OP has reason to believe it is uninsured.

[islandgirl]

We once moved a car left blocking an access by towing out of the way. We were accused of criminal damage. No charges in the end but a very stressful time.

[des8]

I agree the risks (criminal and civil) are small, but they are not non existant.

The person who puts an uninsured car on the road commits an offence
The person who sits in the drivers seat whilst a car is towed or pushed is the driver and should have a licence and insurance

If the car is towed by rope or chain it needs to be insured, taxed & mot'd
if the car is towed on a bar it is considered as a trailer and the car insurance probably covers the situation (byt check your policy)

Obviously if you have it trailered to a private location there is no risk at all

You might have a right to move items that are trespassing on your property, but you can't just dump them on the road.
I think its called fly tipping, but in the case of a vehicle it is use of the road by a vehicle.

And the Op has been pointed in the direction of the legal no risk way of removing the vehicle.
Might delay things by two or three weeks, but it's been there for 6 months so what's a few extra days?

[RageSloth]

Firstly thanks all, I will sort something shortly, but first more information. I get the sense the guy is a conman. He actually moved it there with a tow truck initially which I hadnt realized was happening. The the tyres are flat and it seems in a poor condtion in general. Someone said that it wasnt even allowed to be towed wihout an MOT? I dont think it was by chain etc, I don't recall sadly. It's a small van btw, with what appears to be junk in it, I worry he will try to lie and claim it's valuable stuff.

We once moved a car left blocking an access by towing out of the way. We were accused of criminal damage. No charges in the end but a very stressful time.

I have read that the owner can sue for damage, but how is he going to prove it?

[RageSloth]

I agree the risks (criminal and civil) are small, but they are not non existant.

The person who puts an uninsured car on the road commits an offence
The person who sits in the drivers seat whilst a car is towed or pushed is the driver and should have a licence and insurance

If the car is towed by rope or chain it needs to be insured, taxed & mot'd
if the car is towed on a bar it is considered as a trailer and the car insurance probably covers the situation (byt check your policy)

Obviously if you have it trailered to a private location there is no risk at all

You might have a right to move items that are trespassing on your property, but you can't just dump them on the road.
I think its called fly tipping, but in the case of a vehicle it is use of the road by a vehicle.

And the Op has been pointed in the direction of the legal no risk way of removing the vehicle.
Might delay things by two or three weeks, but it's been there for 6 months so what's a few extra days?

It's not fly tipping when concerning a vehicle, different laws.

I have a few other posts to make over the next 5 mins if anyone is readdng this right now.

[RageSloth]

You need to act with compliance to theTorts (Intererence with Goods) Act 1977 (https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1977/32/contents)
Schedule 1 applies so suggest you read it.

Basically you need to write (recorded) to him telling him to move it or you will dispose of it.
You need to obtain the best price possible (rom your description it sounds like scrap value but usually it is via auction)
From the price obtained you can deduct your expenses, but the balance goes to the owner.

Don't just move van on to the road... it is uninsured and you will be liable if it is involved in an accident.

Depending on how you deal with it, DVLA might need to be informed of change of keeper or scrapping

Thanks! The only people I can get to towe it are a scrap company anyway, so the road option isnt available to me.
They said that as long as I photo a witness with a sign left on the vehicle stating that within a week if the owner doesnt collect it then I can claim ownership of the vehicle and they will come to scrap it. Also I still don't think I am allowed to make a profit which is fine.

I guess this covers the scrapper at least with a high enough rate in cases like this and he can still profit overall even in the rare cases that it doesn't.
But does it cover me? I know the DVLA allows me to claim it as long as I fill out a v62 form and prove I have tried to track down the owner. However I dont know if that applies when the owner is found and REFUSING to move it.

Also he's claiming to have moved into a hostel after a brief period of being homeless. I know for a fact that he has a working prius atm and he seems to think he can force me to be his continued free storage service for his busted van.

I seriusly doubt he had any period of homelessness and dont care if he did as now hes apparently in a hostel anyway. But just in case, If the address that I get from the DVLA has his old address, am I still covered?

[RageSloth]

I have used the Torts Act several times and it usually works - it is amazing how quickly people crawl out of the woodwork when they think their goods will be sold...I would do a signed for letter and a letter with proof of postage (free) from 2 different post offices. Often people refuse signed for mail. There can be then no doubt legally that it arrived. May be overkill but a) ensures proof of delivery and b) makes the owner think you are very serious!

If I do this instead of the photo of a notice on the car, the torts acts says I need to include my name, does that mean I have to include my surname, I'd rather not and it will cost me through the DVLA to get his address, not sure if the scrappy will reimburse this, but If it protects me better I suppose I should suck it up.

Why 2 post offices and why would people refuse signed mail?

[RageSloth]

Surely it is the owners responsibilty to keep their correct address up to date on the DVLA's records yes, so if he has actually moved then it's not my fault ?

[des8]

Fly tipping is a generic term which covers a number of offences created by a complex series of statutes.
The bit about abandoned cars is in Section 2 of the Refuse Disposal (Amenity) Act 1978

Under the act referred to in post 2 schedule 1 states " The notice shall be in writing and shall be sent by post in a registered letter, or by the recorded delivery service."
If the only way of finding him is via his address from the DVLA, then that is the route you should take.
You can argue that it was not possible to discover his address and place a notice on the vehicle, and it might suffice, but it is not the correct way to go about it.
If you are concerned that he will claim the contents are valuable, create a photographed inventory and follow correct procedures

A V62 form does not give you any ownership rights as it only registers you as keeper

[RageSloth]

So I will do what the scrappy said, and pay the small fee to get his address and send the letters to him. Additionally legally claiming it in the more efficient DVLA way would cost another small fee, but I don't think it applies to the goods in the car too, so I don't think I'll bother with that avenue.