Another Dodgy Secondhand Car Dealer

[Greenfrog]

Hello everyone
I've read a few similar cases to mine on this forum and now thought I'd ask the community for some specific advise on my case.

Four months ago I bought a second hand car for my wife. The car cost £7.5k and was bought at a distance, so delivered by trailer to me. Intially the car ran well and seemed in great condition. The dealer was also very helpful during the purchase and delivery. Importantly the car came with a six months warranty.

A few weeks later the car started to develop a fault whilst driving, within a week or so the car was undriveable. I called the dealer and asked for the details of the warranty to be passed on. At this point he advised me that he had 'forgot' to purchase the warranty and instead would pay for any repairs after I've intimated the work to completed at a local garage.

After a few months (we're up to the present day), both the local garage and the main suzuki garage are at a loss to what's causing the problem. Suzuki have advised that further investigation will start to get very expensive. At this point I've paided around £950 in repairs.

I passed all this information back to the dealer with my suggestion that we reverse the trade. My argument is that if he has the car returned he can fix the car more cheaply locally and I can be rid of it. I've requested full refund of £7,500 plus the £950 in repairs.

Initially the dealer was non committal but receptive to the idea and said he'd discuss with the garage owner and get back to me. I've had to chase several times, the last time I got through he made some vague excuse about his delivery driver being on holiday and Covid restricts. Manifestly very obvious attempts to delay the process.

Now we're up to today. It's occurred to me that I can't force the dealer to accept the car, not can I necessarily make a small claims court claim for the entire amount (car value and repairs) since I am still in possession (I may well be wrong about this). So far as I can see my only practice option is to continue with the repairs till the car is fixed then send the bills over, cross my fingers for payment, then proceed to make a claim assuming payment is not made.

I sent the dealer an email and text message this morning saying that I can no longer chase him via the phone and that if I hadn't heard from him by the end of today to arrange a return, I would continue with the repairs and provide a bill. The dealer's last instructions to me was to get the repairs done and charge (we talked about returning the car, but never agreed). So my logic is that I am still acting under the dealer's instructions as no subsequent agreement has been.

One of my concerns is that, apart from the recent text messages, all this has been conducted via phone calls, so there is no record - since we were in good terms, there didn't seem to be a reason to do otherwise. I do have a copy of the advert with the 6 month warranty.

I summary I'm looking for advice regarding how I should proceed with the car repairs. As I mentioned before, the car presently doesn't run, so I don't see an option other than to continue with the repairs.
Also, if this does progress to a court claim I want to position myself as favourable as possible and not trip up somewhere. So any help on this front would be great.

Any help would be really appreciated. Thank you for reading so far!

[echat11]

Hi Greenfrog

You are covered by the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

How did you pay for the car? What is the actual date of purchase?

[Greenfrog]

Hi Echat1,

Thanks for your reply, apologies for the delayed response - I missed your reply.

I paid for the car via a cash transfer, not a credit card unfortunately. The date of purchase was the 14th June and the first fault appeared 6 weeks later (a bit late than I initially recalled).

A later development is that the dealer has asked me to return the car at my own cost for the dealer to repair and return. I've replied stating that I can't return the car without the outstanding bills paid. Also the point of the warranty was that I could get the repairs done locally. Frankly I don't really trust the dealer the fix the car responsibly and return it, there has been a significant breakdown in trust.

How would apply the Consumer Rights Act to the dealer? My concern is that although I believe he should refund the sale, I can't force him too. Likewise I can't make him pay the repair bills. The only course of action that occurs to me (in my limited experience of these matters) is to pay the bills personally, the proceed with the small claims court.

One positive which came of the dealer's most recent email is that he has stated the he requested me to fix the car locally - I was previously worried that this has only been discussed on the phone and I had no proof.

Thanks again

[des8]

Be useful to have a time line i.e. dates at which things were said and done

Nevertheless it seems you rejected the vehicle using your final right to reject
The dealer has the right to one attempt to bring the vehicle to a satisfactory condition.
This has to be done entirely at the traders expense (includes parts, labour, transport costs) and also within a reasonable time and without significant inconvenience to the consumer,

From your account it seems the trader has been unable to repair the vehicle in compliance with those conditions.

I therefor would write (first class with free certificate of posting from PO) to the trader reiterating that because of the above you were confirming your rejection.
Tell him where the vehicle is located for him to collect, again this is at his cost.
Tell him you want a refund of your purchase price plus costs incurred, and if that is not forthcoming within 14 days you will initiate court action without further reference.

Note FYI that he can make a deduction for usage, but this should only be around 10p -15p per mile

[Greenfrog]

Hi DES8,

Thanks for your reply. That sounds very positive.
The dates are as below:

14th June - car purchased, delivered to my home address which is 170 miles from the dealer
26th July - I notified the dealer that the car had developed a fault. Dealer advised to take to a local garage for repair (he would cover the cost)

Onward from this date till 22nd October - various attempts to repair, the car was moved to the main Suzuki dealership at the request if the car dealer for more investigation

21st October - Suzuki dealership advise they have not been able to fix, however they can continue to work on the car. They also recommended I return the car as they believe it is not in good condition and will continue to be problematic. On this date I messaged the dealer to advise I would like to return the car.

At this point the dealer became evasive and would not return my calls. I did finally receive an email from the dealer stating that onus is now on me to return the car to the dealer for him to repair and return (email sent 27th October). I replied advising that I need all the outstanding bills paid before we can discuss a return. Frankly I don't trust the dealer to return the car for repair and would only be interested in a full refund.

I'm hoping, based on the above timelines, that I can request a full refund of bills paid and car cost from the dealer. My only concern is how long this may take, assuming he is not co-operative. This is my wife's car, she's a nurse and needs transport to travel clinic to clinic. So if this process were to take a year, for example, that would be very problematic for us.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply to this thread. Initially I felt quite powerless, now I feel reasonably optimistic about our chances.

[des8]

It is for the dealer to meet the cost of returning the vehicle to his premises whether for repair or rejection!

As you notified the dealer within 30 days of taking delivery of the unsatisfactory condition of the vehicle, you retain your right to a full refund of purchase price without deduction for usage.
You allowed him one attempt at repair ands this has not occurred " within a reasonable time and without significant inconvenience" and so now exercise your right to short term rejection.

So now write as previously suggested.
If you are lucky you might get your refund without actually initiating court action.

[Greenfrog]

Hi DES8
Thanks for your reply. I received the car on the 14th June and notified of the problem in the 26th of July, so I don't believe this will fall within the initial 30 day period.

I've been browsing the Consumer Rights Act 2015, and it looks like I can reject based on my 'final right to reject', rather than my 'early right to reject', if I am understanding that correctly?

Thanks

[des8]

Oops, yes final right to reject as post 4 (confusing your thread with another similar & reading July as June doesn't help my mental processes)

[smintram]

Greenfrog Start a claim online...That's what I did. See if he acknowledges the claim. They usually wake up at that point. If it's still within 6 months of the sale, send him a letter of complaint under the CRA 2015 demanding that he repairs the vehicle at his own cost..(you've done all this, and he has had his 1 chance to repair too but this is for purposes of procedure) send mail by Signed for, and keep copies of all letters and posting receipts, and keep all correspondence from everyone.
He'll ignore that. Then send a letter before action...He'll ignore that too. give him 14 days, and issue a claim against him, and add the money you spent, plus court fees to the claim. That should get his attention. If you're lucky, he'll ignore that too.
Most people won't go down the legal route to recover, and they know it...they just hope you'll give up and go away.
If you discover the fault within the first six months after buying the car, it is presumed to have been there since the time of purchase - unless the retailer can prove otherwise. During this time, it's up to the retailer to prove that the fault wasn't there when you bought it - it's not up to you to prove that it was.
Also, I made the dealer email me instead of speaking to him, in order that there was a record of events that could be used in evidence.

[Greenfrog]

Thanks everyone for your help, I've received a lot of great advice, so really appreciate that.

I've view sent a final warning letter (signed for), referencing the customer rights act 2015 as advised above. Taking into account the comments on this site, I feel confident I have a solid case.

The letter was received last week, so far I've not received a response from the dealer, which is a bit disappointing.

I wondered from other people's experience of it's worth sending a follow-up email just prior to the 14 day warning period? For obvious reasons, is prefer this not to go to court. So I'm thinking of send an email stating that I will initiating court action in a could of days, including the additional cost costs. I also considered leaving some negative reviews of the business online (I know he's sensitive to these), then offering to remove if we can settle before I initiate proceeding.

However I don't want to do anything which may jeopardise my position in court. If anyone has an opinion on a follow-up email, I'd like to hear it.

Thanks again

[des8]

Assuming you did not request a repair in your last letter there is no need to give him any longer than the two weeks and no point in follow up emails.
He already seems to have been giving you the run around, so why would he change his attitude?

I would not consider threatening to leave a negative review as it might just complicate matters

[Greenfrog]

Thank you everyone for the comments, much appreciated. I've followed your advice, sending a recorded/signed for letter stating court action would be initiated if the dealer did not respond. No surprise, I haven't heard from the dealer. So tomorrow is the day when I initiate court action. I've put together my statement. If anyone fancies having a browse (comments would be much appreciated), I've copied below. Thanks again to everyone for their help. I'm hoping to get a resolution soon, but feel confident I've taken the right steps largely due to the comments received on this forum.

On the 14^th of June 2021 I took delivery of a secondhand Suzuki Jimny, purchase from XXX at XXX. This was a distance purchase; I am based in Essex whilst the car dealership is in Worcestershire. I did not visit to view the car prior to purchase.

As part of the negotiations for the purchase of the Suzuki Jimny, the warranty was discussed. As per the car advert, XXX advised that a full 6 month warranty would be supplied. As this was a distance purchase, it was agreed that the warranty covers repairs local to my home address.
Car was paid for and delivered on 14^th June 2021 via a bank transfer of £7,350. A deposit of £50 had previously been paid via bank transfer.
On the 26^th July I contacted XXX via Whatsapp to advise that the car had started to stall when idle. I request that he sends me details of the warranty. I didn’t receive a reply to this message. A subsequent phone call was made to XXX, it was on this call that XXX advised he had ‘forgotten’ to complete the warranty during the purchase. Instead, XXX requested that I instruct a local garage to investigate and complete any work. XXX would then reimburse the cost to me as part of the warranty. I’ve received a separate email from XXX/Phil confirming this was the case.

Subsequently, the local garage was unable to fix the issue. The total cost of this work was £84, paid in full by me. XXX was kept fully up to date with this progress via phone and Whatsapp, at this point XXX requested I take the car to the Suzuki main dealer to investigate. Suzuki made an initial attempt to repair the car. I collected the car and paid the £262.04 bill in full. After a drive of around 20 minutes, it became clear the problem had not been fixed. The car stalled and went into a limp mode, unable to accelerate past 20 miles an hour. XXX was advised of this by phone. XXX then requested I take the back to Suzuki and ask them to investigate further. The car was then returned to Suzuki for further investigation. Further investigation was still unsuccessful, Suzuki could not find the issue. The bill at Suzuki was a further £463.20. At this point I requested Suzuki deal directly with XXX as I was concerned regarding the cost. Suzuki informed me that had called XXX who would not commit to payment or whether more work should continue. As XXX would not pay for outstanding amount (XXX had also not paid for the last two bills), I was left with no choice but to pay the bill myself.
The report on the state of the car from Suzuki was very negative, to quote ‘Found many things wasn’t screwed down properly or connected tight’. Furthermore, the report states that ‘Exhaust back box severely corroded’ and requires repair. This is all included in the report from Suzuki. I’ve also spoken to the service department who advise that the car runs with excessive fumes and is generally in a poor state of repair. They’ve advised I return the car as they have no way of knowing how much additional cost is required to fix whatever the issue is.

After relaying much of this information back to XXX, I suggested that we return the car for a full refund. XXX initially indicated that this is the best option and we agreed to talk after the weekend (this call occurred October 22^nd). The next week I had several calls with XXX, no progress was made on any of these calls, each time a new excuse was offered as to why he couldn’t agree to anything presently. XXX would either end the call abruptly due to a customer interrupting, a pending meeting or advising he would need to agree with a business partner. Subsequently XXX stopped answering his phone.
I then sent an email advising that I wish to return the car for a full refund. My reason, which XXX initially indicated was the best option, was that this protects both parties. I will be rid of a problematic car and XXX protected from a seemingly never-ending bill from Suzuki. I’m keen to stress that up to this point the relationship had been amicable, I’ve been very patient dealing with a car which I’ve owned for nearly 5 months but which I’ve only had use of for the first 6 weeks. Likewise, XXX initially was very responsive and reassuring advising that he would cover the costs of repairs.
However, as soon as the issue of the outstanding bill was raised XXX has been wholly unresponsive. The only reply I have received so far is an email stating that the ‘onus is one you to return the car to us to get repaired’. Returning the car for repair had not previously been mentioned by XXX or myself, furthermore the warranty should be in place to facilitate a local repair (rather than a costly return) and finally, I am unable to return the car with such a large repair bill presently unpaid.

In a final effort to end resolve the dispute I sent XXX/XXX a letter by recorded post stating that if the car was not collected for a refund and the outstanding bills paid in full, I would initiate court action. XXX signed and received this letter, however he has not acknowledged or replied.
As the car is undriveable I am claiming for the whole cost of the car. I have advised XXX that the car is ready to collect once the outstanding bills and purchase cost have been returned.

I am also claiming for the repair bills as these are covered under the warranty and have wholly been paid by myself.

[des8]

If that is your particulars of claim, don't send it as it is more like a witness statement than a claim.
I'll draft something for you to work from later today

[Greenfrog]

Hi DES8, thanks for replying. In my ignorance, I didn't appreciate the difference. If you have the time, I'd really appreciate something to work from. Thanks again!

[Greenfrog]

Today I received a surprise letter from the car dealer. Sadly it was just a restatement of his request for me to return the car for him to repair. No mention of paying the outstanding money or paying for the return.

That leaves me firmly on track to initiating the small claims court process.