Brand New Vehicle - Excercising Short Term Right to Reject - Missaligned body panels

[Henrymo]

Some more progress of a sort. I have spoken to the manufacturer today who told me that the supplying dealer needs to view, inspect and accept my rejection. I also spoke to the finance company who said they would be led by whatever the manufacturer suggests so I have asked the supplying dealership to recover the car and I await their response.

[des8]

Don't forget to confirm all these conversations in writing or email, and remind finance house that they are actually bound by statute, not what the
manufacturer says!

[Henrymo]

So I had the following reply from the manufacture. I've removed any obvious identifers.

I have liaised with the management of Car Dealer They have advised me that they would not be supporting the rejection as you are outside of your 30 day period.

They have confirmed with there legal team,the time only stops whilst the vehicle is at the dealership being repaired rather than from the time you first reporting the issue to having it rectified. In this case your car was in the body shop for approx. half a day having the front bumper re-aligned and the issue with the fuel gauge issue was rectified again in half a day but this was outside of the customers 30 day period. We will not be supporting the rejection with this in mind you are out of your 30 day period and we must be allowed one attempt to rectify the fault.

Please can you let me know if you have managed to speak to Dealer and where your car is currently?

If it is at at inspecting dealer then you are able to also authorise them to carry out the repairs under your warranty.

One the repairs are completed and you have your car back i would look into a gesture of goodwill to recognise the inconvenience.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Is there any basis for this stance. It doesnt look like it to me. I cant for the life of me figure out how they can claim the fuel gauge issue occured outside the the 30 day period when it was reported to them on day 22. The only thing I can think if is that the fuel gauge issue was fixed on 04/03/2020 which could be interpreted as day 31 !!!

So I replied with the following:

Unfortunately the information you are being given is incorrect. Notwithstanding their mis interpretation with the panel fault. The issue with the fuel gauge was reported to them on day 22 of ownership and fixed on day 30 so therefore the following applies:

(6) If the consumer asks for or agrees to a repair during the 30 days, then the Short Term Right to Reject period is stopped whilst this is carried out [s22(6)]. When it resumes, the consumer will have the remainder of the 30 days or 7 days, whichever is the longer period [s22(7)]. This will allow them to use the Short Term Right to Reject if another fault appears or the repair is ineffective.

This means I have 7 days after it was fixed to maintain my short term right to reject. The oil leak occurred on day 35 which is 5 days into this.

*

[des8]

Just bear in mind Sec 22 (8)

The waiting period—

(a)begins with the day the consumer requests or agrees to the repair or replacement of the goods, and

(b)ends with the day on which the consumer receives goods supplied by the trader in response to the request or agreement.

So their comment "*the time only stops whilst the vehicle is at the dealership being repaired rather than from the time you first reporting the issue to having it rectified." is absolute bollocks!

Go back to them with this additional info and insist they refund immediately to prevent you initiating court proceedings.

[Henrymo]

So an update of sorts. Its been a crazy few weeks for the world and things have been running in slo-mo for most. I have been speaking with the manufacturer directly of late as they are keen to do a deal. I gave them a number and said if they wanted me to keep the car then this is what it would be. They came back to me today with a counter offer as goodwill which is quite frankly an insult. They still maintain the position that the third fault was outside the short term right to reject window.

I've asked them to explain how they come to this conclusion when all the advice I have been given both on here and elsewhere suggests the short term right to reject is valid. I've asked them for this info before the end of the week after which time I'll start legal proceedings.

One question I have regarding small claims court. I understand there is a max claim of £10K. If I have paid less than £10K towards the car (rest is on finance) would I be able to take that route?

Cheers

[des8]

One question I have regarding small claims court. I understand there is a max claim of £10K. If I have paid less than £10K towards the car (rest is on finance) would I be able to take that route?

Cheers

Vehicle purchase price c£60,000 with c£50,000 finance

I don't think so but tagging R0b, but you can always request it is allocated to small claims track as the matter to be decided is simple.It sometimes works.

You will need to send a letter before action prior to initiating court action, and as I am sure you are aware there are costs implications if the case is allocated to multi track as finance is around

[Henrymo]

I had an e-mail from the manufacturer yesterday to say they have accepted the rejection and will be in contact in due course to arrange refunds and collect the car. I have made them an offer without prejudice for me to keep the car and await their response.

This process has been tough and throughout the dealer, finance company and manufacturer have done everything they can in an attempt to wriggle out of this. In my case the interpretation of the "Waiting time" by the manufacturers legal dept was taken as the time when the vehicle went in for repairs and not the time between me notifying them of the issue and the issue being resolved and in my opinion if I had relied on that then this would have probably gone to court as their stance was that by the time the oil leak occured my 30 day short term right to reject had expired as the accumilated waiting time was only 2 days and not 20+

However regardless of how the waiting time would be interpreted in court section 22(7) states that after my car had been repaired for the second time I had at least 7 days to excercise my short term right to reject and there is absolutley no ambiguity in this statement.

I'm not over the line yet but the finishing line is in sight. Lessons learned:

1. Whilst the finance company are who the legal contract was with most of the progress was made when I finally got to speak someone senior at the manufacturer. The dealership and senior managment were largely clueless.
2. Record all voice conversations as its amazing how quickly people backtrack on what they have said once things start to get serious. Dont wait for them to contact you. Chase/push them.
3. You need to be 100% committed to your desired end result. Be certain of your rights.
4. Everyone involved had their own interpretation of the CRA. For 4 weeks I let everyone involved know about the 7 day rule but it was constantly dismissed and it was only when my case was finally put infront of the legal team at the manufacturer that they accepted my stance.

[des8]

Well done, and hopefully your refund will be with you soon.

[Henrymo]

So 30+ days later the dealer has sent me the following which seems to want to side step the CRA by imposing their own terms and conditions. My understanding is that they cant do this and all I need to do is make the vehicle available to collect. Also they are not buying the car back are they but refunding me. Not sure what to do?

We write further to your complaint in relation to the Vehicle. We understand you are dissatisfied with the vehicle which was sold to you by us, and we are sorry that you have had cause for complaint.

As you may be aware we have been in discussions with the finance company and manufacturer.

We are now willing to buy back the Vehicle for the price you paid (£xxxx, we will be settling your finance agreement with the finance company (currently £xxxxx). We will therefore refund you your cash deposit £xxxxx plus the 3 finance payments of £xxxx you have made, equalling £xxx, as per instruction from Renault. In total we will refund you £xxxxx

It is a condition of this offer that you have the private registration plate removed from the vehicle before we buy the Vehicle from you.
.
This offer is made on the basis that the Vehicle is returned by you in good condition with no damage above reasonable wear and tear commensurate with the age of the Vehicle. If there is damage to the Vehicle in excess of fair wear and tear we reserve the right to make a deduction to reflect this. This offer is made as a gesture of goodwill, without admission of liability and in full and final settlement of your complaint. This offer is open for acceptance for 14 days and shall be deemed withdrawn if not accepted within this timescale. If you would like to accept this offer please confirm by email.

Alternative Dispute Resolution – The National Conciliation Service and The Motor Ombudsman

This is our final response to your complaint. If you are dissatisfied with it, you may refer your complaint to the National Conciliation Service (NCS). This is a free alternative dispute resolution process. The NCS website can be found at: https://www.nationalconciliationservice.co.uk/. The NCS can be contacted by telephone (01788 538317), by post (NCS, 2 Allerton Rd, Rugby CV23 0PA) or by email (contact@nationalconciliationservice.co.uk).

Alternatively, we confirm that we are also a member of the Motor Ombudsman (TMO) which is another free alternative dispute resolution service. The Motor Ombudsman website can be found at: https://www.themotorombudsman.org/ . TMO can be contacted by telephone (0345 241 3008*(option 1)), by post The Motor Ombudsman, 71 Great Peter Street, London, SW1P 2BN United Kingdom or by email using their web form (https://www.themotorombudsman.org/contact/garages-contact ).

Forgot to add. That the finance has been cancelled and the finance company have removed it from my credit record and the car is still sat on my drive so from my point of view it can sit and depereciate for as long as the dealer wants.

[R0b]

This sounds really messy, I've tried to follow the earlier posts but if the finance company is the owner of the vehicle, and I think you said they will be led by the manufacturer, who in turn accepted your issue and agreed to refund you but then the dealer is now offering to buy back the car?!

Going back to basics, your contract is the finance company and so any acceptance of the rejection should come from them. Possibly, you may be able to argue that the manufacturer had authority to accept rejection as agent of the finance co. but it's not really clear from the posts. Otherwise, that rejection should come from the finance co. and relying on any other acceptance may cause you problems.*

I really don't get why the dealer is now wading into this by offering to buy back the car because the car doesn't legally belong to them. However, assuming they have an interest, then you are right in that you only need to make the car available for collection, though they are attaching conditions too which I wouldn't be happy about.*

As I said though, this sounds very messy and complicated. If I were in your shoes, I would be going back to the finance co. and saying the manufacturer has accepted the defect, please confirm your agreement and the refund of the sums already paid together with deposit (if applicable) and make arrangement for the car to be collect. If not then the matter will need to be resolved in court.

[Henrymo]

I have had a letter from the finance company saying they have accepted the rejection and both the finance company and the manufacturer have stated that the dealer will refund and collect in line with CRA but as they have done all along they want to define their own terms and conditions.

[R0b]

So in that case any deduction should be the actual use you have had from it, not the resale value of the vehicle and therefore their conditions of offer would (in my view) be contrary to the CRA.*

I would be inclined to respond to the dealer and copy in the finance co. and manufacturer something along the lines of:

1. Pointing out that this is not a complaint per se, rather you have exercised your final right to reject the goods under the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

2. That their offer of settlement is an attempt by them to contract out of the remedies available to you under the CRA or at least limit them. This is because their offer is subject to the vehicle being returned in good condition, reasonable wear and tear excepted and if there is excess damage, then they will reduce the refund. Whereas the CRA stipulates that a refund may only be reduced deduction may only be made for actual use of the vehicle since it was delivered/collected - I would argue any use driving the vehicle for repair ought to be excluded and I am sure there is some case law around this too. Therefore any deduction based on the resale value of the vehicle is strictly prohibited.

3. The offer also requires the vehicle to be returned by you but the CRA only requires you to make the vehicle available for collection. Of course if you are happy to deliver it then you can suggest you will do on the basis of them paying your reasonable costs but otherwise this is contrary to the CRA.

Depending on your appetite for court, you could give them a short period (7 days?) to confirm that they will now confirm that your final right of rejection is accepted, they will collect the vehicle and refund you all amounts paid so far under the finance arrangement. If they don't, then you will start the pre-action process for commencing legal proceedings. This bit is optional and not necessary to include but it does mean you are serious, and the fact that you've got an admission and acceptance of the rejection from the finance company, there's no reason why you couldn't seek a summary judgment if proceedings were commenced.

Also suggest you make specific reference to the CRA provisions so they know what you're talking about and not trying to wing it, if you need those provisions let us know one of us can point them out.*

[des8]

No deduction for usage as this was a short term right rejection within 30 days of delivery.

[R0b]

Must have missed that, an even stronger case then to get a full refund!

[Henrymo]

Last post to this thread to add closure. Received a full refund last week. Thanks for all the advice and guidance.