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Looking for some advice. A few months ago I purchased an MGB bodyshell and parts from ebay. I paid using a PayPal credit card. The e bay advert text is shown below:
“This was to be my last project, and so it has proved to be. Lack of time and good health mean my treasured roadster cannot be completed by me, and is therefore very very reluctantly for sale. A wonderful opportunity for someone to complete the project, put the B back on the road an enjoy ownership of what will be a beautiful example of the marque. 40 years old on 7th June, the car was originally yellow. It was stripped, new front wings, new rear wings, new floors, new sills, near rear bulkhead, new rear panel, new front panel, new bonnet, new jacking points, and resprayed in black. Thus it is as near to a new shell as can be! This was some 3 years ago, and the shell has sat in my garage since. There is absolutely no rust anywhere to be seen. There are a couple of very minor marks gained during storage. Originally rubber bumper, the work has been done professionally to convert to chrome, both front and rear as can be seen on the photos. I have accumulated a wealth of new parts, with no expense spared, costing over £4k, all of which will be included in the sale. These include : REAR END Parabolic springs, Gaz conversion shock absorbers, lowering blocks, polybushes and a complete brake renewal kit. New handbrake cable. New copper brake pipes. FRONT END Crossmember stripped and repainted, Gaz conversion shock absorbers, polybushes, lowered springs, complete rebuild kit for suspension, roller bearing king pins, complete front brake upgrade kit, new steering rack, new thicker anti-roll bar, rose jointed anti-roll bar control arms. There is a new propshaft, and a new clutch master cylinder. BODY & INTERIOR there is a brand new complete front screen and surround, fully assembled with sun visors, and a pair of brand new stainless steel quarter light assemblies. The hood and frame are as new, but could do with a clean after storage. There is a pair of brand new leather seats with headrests, in biscuit with black piping. I have probably forgotten some! There is also a host of other used parts, which will be included in the sale. The engine was refurbished and installed ready to go when I bought the car. I removed it, and the gearbox, intending to go the V* route. There is a set of Rostyle wheels, and a set of 15" alloy wheels, all included. Some parts will be required to complete the car. A radiator, hoses, oil cooler, door cards and panels, carpets, body trim and tyres, starter motor, alternator, battery and others, I am sure. Nothing major! There is an original jack, and 2 pairs of chrome bumpers, in need of a polish. The car is mounted on a 7' x 4' car body trolley, so it can be freely moved, and which will come with the car. Free to collect, or I will happily load onto trailer etc. A truly wonderful opportunity to create with little work, what will be a beautiful example of the marque!!”
However, on winning the car I had it collected and inspected for my peace of mind by a classic car restored who found on stripping the shell that the car was significantly not as described. Basically none of the panels had been replaced and they were not new. There was quite a bit of rust damage on the shell and repairs to bring it up to MOT standard or even the standard that the advert claimed the shell to be would be very expensive. I alerted the seller to the problems that I had found and advised him that he could go and see the bodyshell if he wished to see the problems. He did so and did not dispute the findings. I asked him for a full refund and told him I would be willing to return the bodyshell and parts to him. I also told him if he agreed to this I wouldn’t seek to claim any of my costs for the collection and inspection of the bodyshell. He refused to refund me and has chosen to ignore my e mails from this point on. At this point I made a section 75 claim against PayPal credit card who I used for the purchase. After 9 weeks of waiting for a response they have written to me today refusing my claim.
They say that:
“Following a thorough review of the transaction and all of the relevant information provided, we were unable to agree with your claim of misrepresentation.
You purchased a MGB (Car) shell on eBay on 10/06/2018, and an inspection was carried out by a third party upon collection. I understand that the third party found the item to be not as described and that the cost to rectify would not be viable. We believe however that the condition of the shell should have been assessed prior to purchase. As you have not provided any sales document or contract we are unable to confirm that the item was misrepresented to you either during the advertisement or through to the completion of the sale.
I regret that at this time we are not in a position to offer you any form of reimbursement. We are willing to review any new evidence that has not yet been provided to us, should you have any. Our decision does not affect your statutory rights nor your right to pursue a claim via any other method.”
I am am now in the process of appealing their decision with the ombudsman. I am looking for any advice please. PayPal are saying that I should have assessed the condition of the shell before purchase but I am not an expert car restorer and the parts were hidden under paint and underseal. It was only when the restorer was able to grind away the paint and undeseal that it became clear that the car was not as described. The sales document or contract that PayPal are referring to as not being provided is surely the original advert which clearly misdescribed the true condition of the vehicle. Are PayPal just trying it on? Any advice greatfully received. Thanks and apologies for the long first post.
“This was to be my last project, and so it has proved to be. Lack of time and good health mean my treasured roadster cannot be completed by me, and is therefore very very reluctantly for sale. A wonderful opportunity for someone to complete the project, put the B back on the road an enjoy ownership of what will be a beautiful example of the marque. 40 years old on 7th June, the car was originally yellow. It was stripped, new front wings, new rear wings, new floors, new sills, near rear bulkhead, new rear panel, new front panel, new bonnet, new jacking points, and resprayed in black. Thus it is as near to a new shell as can be! This was some 3 years ago, and the shell has sat in my garage since. There is absolutely no rust anywhere to be seen. There are a couple of very minor marks gained during storage. Originally rubber bumper, the work has been done professionally to convert to chrome, both front and rear as can be seen on the photos. I have accumulated a wealth of new parts, with no expense spared, costing over £4k, all of which will be included in the sale. These include : REAR END Parabolic springs, Gaz conversion shock absorbers, lowering blocks, polybushes and a complete brake renewal kit. New handbrake cable. New copper brake pipes. FRONT END Crossmember stripped and repainted, Gaz conversion shock absorbers, polybushes, lowered springs, complete rebuild kit for suspension, roller bearing king pins, complete front brake upgrade kit, new steering rack, new thicker anti-roll bar, rose jointed anti-roll bar control arms. There is a new propshaft, and a new clutch master cylinder. BODY & INTERIOR there is a brand new complete front screen and surround, fully assembled with sun visors, and a pair of brand new stainless steel quarter light assemblies. The hood and frame are as new, but could do with a clean after storage. There is a pair of brand new leather seats with headrests, in biscuit with black piping. I have probably forgotten some! There is also a host of other used parts, which will be included in the sale. The engine was refurbished and installed ready to go when I bought the car. I removed it, and the gearbox, intending to go the V* route. There is a set of Rostyle wheels, and a set of 15" alloy wheels, all included. Some parts will be required to complete the car. A radiator, hoses, oil cooler, door cards and panels, carpets, body trim and tyres, starter motor, alternator, battery and others, I am sure. Nothing major! There is an original jack, and 2 pairs of chrome bumpers, in need of a polish. The car is mounted on a 7' x 4' car body trolley, so it can be freely moved, and which will come with the car. Free to collect, or I will happily load onto trailer etc. A truly wonderful opportunity to create with little work, what will be a beautiful example of the marque!!”
However, on winning the car I had it collected and inspected for my peace of mind by a classic car restored who found on stripping the shell that the car was significantly not as described. Basically none of the panels had been replaced and they were not new. There was quite a bit of rust damage on the shell and repairs to bring it up to MOT standard or even the standard that the advert claimed the shell to be would be very expensive. I alerted the seller to the problems that I had found and advised him that he could go and see the bodyshell if he wished to see the problems. He did so and did not dispute the findings. I asked him for a full refund and told him I would be willing to return the bodyshell and parts to him. I also told him if he agreed to this I wouldn’t seek to claim any of my costs for the collection and inspection of the bodyshell. He refused to refund me and has chosen to ignore my e mails from this point on. At this point I made a section 75 claim against PayPal credit card who I used for the purchase. After 9 weeks of waiting for a response they have written to me today refusing my claim.
They say that:
“Following a thorough review of the transaction and all of the relevant information provided, we were unable to agree with your claim of misrepresentation.
You purchased a MGB (Car) shell on eBay on 10/06/2018, and an inspection was carried out by a third party upon collection. I understand that the third party found the item to be not as described and that the cost to rectify would not be viable. We believe however that the condition of the shell should have been assessed prior to purchase. As you have not provided any sales document or contract we are unable to confirm that the item was misrepresented to you either during the advertisement or through to the completion of the sale.
I regret that at this time we are not in a position to offer you any form of reimbursement. We are willing to review any new evidence that has not yet been provided to us, should you have any. Our decision does not affect your statutory rights nor your right to pursue a claim via any other method.”
I am am now in the process of appealing their decision with the ombudsman. I am looking for any advice please. PayPal are saying that I should have assessed the condition of the shell before purchase but I am not an expert car restorer and the parts were hidden under paint and underseal. It was only when the restorer was able to grind away the paint and undeseal that it became clear that the car was not as described. The sales document or contract that PayPal are referring to as not being provided is surely the original advert which clearly misdescribed the true condition of the vehicle. Are PayPal just trying it on? Any advice greatfully received. Thanks and apologies for the long first post.
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